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00:00:37 *** Progman has quit IRC 00:00:52 <Wolf01> 'night 00:00:54 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 00:08:15 *** Maarten has quit IRC 00:09:31 *** Maarten has joined #openttd 00:35:37 *** snail_UES_ has joined #openttd 00:47:22 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 01:11:55 *** WWacko1976-work has joined #openttd 01:25:59 *** lugo has quit IRC 02:03:34 *** luxtram has quit IRC 02:13:35 *** Eddi|zuHause2 has joined #openttd 02:16:57 *** mikegrb has quit IRC 02:19:38 *** Eddi|zuHause has quit IRC 02:59:41 *** GroovyNoodle has joined #openttd 03:58:16 *** GroovyNoodle has quit IRC 05:56:18 *** glx has quit IRC 06:12:01 *** snail_UES_ has quit IRC 07:40:55 *** sushibear has joined #openttd 07:56:08 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 08:01:33 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 08:02:03 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] comicsads opened issue #6977: Minor spelling mistake in comment of code. https://git.io/fp0CA 08:16:29 <SpComb> >_< 08:17:00 <SpComb> github editor would work for fixing that 08:22:55 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SpComb commented on issue #6977: Minor spelling mistake in comment of code. https://git.io/fp0W3 09:06:04 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 09:09:04 <Wolf01> Moin 09:27:31 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 09:27:49 <andythenorth> o/ 09:36:33 *** lugo has joined #openttd 09:51:02 <dwfreed> who runs http://irc.openttdcoop.org/ ? 10:00:15 *** matt21347 has joined #openttd 10:26:46 *** erratic has joined #openttd 10:33:05 *** erratic has quit IRC 10:36:47 *** nielsm has quit IRC 10:36:56 *** Progman has joined #openttd 10:43:58 <LordAro> SpComb: not worrying about single character typos would also work 10:44:14 <LordAro> dwfreed: ^Spike^ or planetmaker, i think 10:52:39 *** erratic has joined #openttd 10:53:40 *** erratic has quit IRC 10:58:26 *** luxtram has joined #openttd 11:02:13 *** chomwitt has joined #openttd 11:05:15 <SpComb> well, it's worth fixing if you run across it, and it /could/ lead to more future contributions if they're methodological enough to grep for similar typos 11:10:37 *** erratic has joined #openttd 11:18:17 <Wolf01> https://us2.factorio.com/assets/img/blog/fff-270-save-statistics.png like ours... "98% trees" 11:18:28 <andythenorth> oof 11:18:32 <andythenorth> we should so fix that 11:18:37 <andythenorth> procedural trees are fine 11:18:53 <andythenorth> 256 seeds 11:18:57 <andythenorth> it's enough 11:19:15 <andythenorth> 16 trees * 16 variants or something 11:19:32 <andythenorth> there are 12 trees in temperate 11:19:47 <Wolf01> I propose to save only player placed trees 11:20:09 <Wolf01> All the other are random, maybe just save the number on a given tile 11:20:11 <andythenorth> how many bits are currrently used for trees? 11:20:37 * andythenorth had better understand problem before inventing nonsense solutions :P 11:22:42 <Wolf01> 6 + 8 for the type 11:22:52 <Wolf01> If I read it right 11:24:04 <andythenorth> there's a whole class? 11:24:05 <andythenorth> wow 11:24:15 <Wolf01> Mmmh, maybe 12 more 11:24:40 <Wolf01> The count, growth stage counter 11:24:42 <andythenorth> landscape grid shows a lot 11:24:55 <andythenorth> but I don't know if that's just trees, or inherited other bits 11:25:35 <andythenorth> I count 20 in m2, m3, m5 11:25:57 <andythenorth> so my proposal for 256 states would need a byte, not saving much? 11:26:35 <Wolf01> The super useful tree owner 4 bits 11:26:56 <Wolf01> (that's tile wise luckily) 11:27:03 <andythenorth> is that tile owner? 11:27:24 <Wolf01> Landscape docs say it's almost always owner 10 11:27:26 <andythenorth> and m2 is also ground? 11:27:30 <Wolf01> Yes 11:27:34 <andythenorth> so where is all this space being used? 11:27:45 *** wodencafe has quit IRC 11:27:46 <Wolf01> Counter, stage, type 11:28:33 <andythenorth> hmm 11:28:44 <andythenorth> for deterministic trees, I don't see how to save much space there 11:28:52 <andythenorth> I don't care about deterministic trees tbh 11:29:27 <Wolf01> Neither do I, only if placed by hand, but even there you must have a lot of luck and they change over time anyway... so newobjects are the answer 11:29:51 <andythenorth> wonder why all the trees are gone in my current game 11:30:10 <Wolf01> Ctrl+x? 11:30:16 <andythenorth> nope 11:30:19 <andythenorth> I just planted some to check 11:30:29 <Wolf01> Pollution 11:30:32 <andythenorth> wondering if I have that broken forests patch applied 11:30:35 <Wolf01> Oh, not F :P 11:30:55 *** wodencafe has joined #openttd 11:31:33 <andythenorth> nope not F :P 11:32:13 <andythenorth> does savegame size matter? 11:32:31 <Wolf01> Also on the topic of loading, we have decided to drop support for loading maps from version 0.13 and 0.14 in the latest version, which mean when you get your hands on 0.17, you will only be able to migrate a save game from 0.15 or 0.16. However as it worked before, you can still download 0.16 to migrate from 0.13, then migrate from 0.16 to 0.17. 11:32:43 <Wolf01> <andythenorth> does savegame size matter? <- multiplayer 11:52:11 *** synchris has joined #openttd 11:59:18 * andythenorth plan for day 11:59:20 <andythenorth> fix build 11:59:25 <andythenorth> test mac ICU patch 11:59:29 <andythenorth> make Horses 11:59:30 <andythenorth> profit? 12:28:52 *** luxtram has quit IRC 12:56:49 <Eddi|zuHause2> <andythenorth> does savegame size matter? <-- mostly for multiplayer join time 13:32:43 <andythenorth> savegames are about 200KB 13:32:46 <andythenorth> where's the problem? 13:34:59 *** wodencafe has quit IRC 13:35:21 *** wodencafe has joined #openttd 13:46:17 *** luxtram has joined #openttd 13:59:37 <peter1138> andythenorth, I know right. Apparently some fools think 4096x4096 is a reasonable map size... 14:04:59 <Wolf01> I would like to play a 8192*8192 MMO map :P 14:13:18 *** luxtram has quit IRC 14:19:13 <LordAro> Wolf01: don't you dare even suggest it :p 14:29:49 *** matt21347 has quit IRC 14:31:17 <Wolf01> :D 14:37:14 *** Eddi|zuHause2 is now known as Eddi|zuHause 14:53:54 *** Flygon has quit IRC 16:00:29 *** chomwitt has quit IRC 16:03:46 *** matt21347 has joined #openttd 16:26:58 *** tokai has joined #openttd 16:26:58 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai 16:33:29 *** bmbbsr has joined #openttd 16:33:43 *** tokai|noir has quit IRC 16:34:12 <bmbbsr> Hi i am in Germany Q is there a setting on autorenew the trains im investing so many tiome to renew them 16:34:51 <bmbbsr> 1.8.0 rc1 16:40:13 *** bmbbsr has quit IRC 16:42:02 <Arveen> yes 16:42:08 *** chomwitt has joined #openttd 16:45:31 *** ToBeFree is now known as Guest3799 16:45:31 *** ToBeFree has joined #openttd 16:53:10 *** ToBeFree has quit IRC 16:56:27 *** snail_UES_ has joined #openttd 16:58:34 <snail_UES_> do you guys need it’s important to display the engine type (steam, electric, diesel…) in the engine name? 16:59:10 <snail_UES_> in other words, do you feel the need for a string like “ ‘XYZ’ (Steam)” as an engine name in the purchase list, instead of just “ ‘XYZ’ “? 17:02:11 <andythenorth> I do it because original TTD does it 17:02:15 <andythenorth> it's probably not important 17:03:22 <snail_UES_> yeah because then, one should also separate catenary vs 3rd rail vs other ways of electrification 17:03:46 <snail_UES_> and there are bimodal engines (diesel and electric)... 17:10:03 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 17:13:28 <andythenorth> I use 'electro-diesel' for bi-mode 17:27:20 *** Progman has quit IRC 17:33:34 *** Wacko1976 has joined #openttd 17:36:32 <andythenorth> I have lost my newgrf mojo :( 17:42:53 <Wolf01> Mmmh 17:43:32 <Wolf01> https://i.ytimg.com/vi/WqD72U-lxgc/hqdefault.jpg try this 17:49:43 <andythenorth> not working 17:53:37 *** lugo has quit IRC 18:04:50 <snail_UES_> but electro-diesel might also mean a diesel engine with electric transmission... 18:04:59 <snail_UES_> i.e. as opposed to hydraulic or mechanical 18:17:29 *** Gja has joined #openttd 18:20:38 <andythenorth> not in UK english 18:30:25 *** Wolf01 is now known as Guest3807 18:30:27 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 18:30:55 <andythenorth> so 18:31:01 <andythenorth> I was going to colour scheme Horse 18:31:09 <andythenorth> all freight engines black, all fast engines 2CC 18:31:14 <andythenorth> but I dunno 18:31:55 <andythenorth> I didn't colour code the diesel and electric engines 18:33:07 <andythenorth> maybe I just 2CC them all 18:36:18 *** Guest3807 has quit IRC 18:47:47 *** Gja has quit IRC 18:48:00 *** luxtram has joined #openttd 18:54:53 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 18:55:19 <andythenorth> luxtram: still want game loop explained? o_O 18:57:55 <nielsm> 11:29:51 <andythenorth> wonder why all the trees are gone in my current game <-- I think the main reason trees disappear are farm fields (removed when an unserviced farm shuts down) 19:00:43 <nielsm> 18:04:50 <snail_UES_> but electro-diesel might also mean a diesel engine with electric transmission... <-- diesel-electric = diesel generator powering electric traction engines, electro-diesel = can also run off electrified track 19:02:08 <nielsm> 18:31:09 <andythenorth> all freight engines black, all fast engines 2CC <-- how about fast/passenger primary color is first CC, slow/freight primary color is second CC 19:04:14 <andythenorth> yes that's an option 19:04:20 <andythenorth> Road Hog does that somewhat 19:04:36 <andythenorth> the farm fields thing isn't relevant in my game, FIRS doesn't close farms 19:04:42 <andythenorth> there's some kind of tree bug 19:04:56 <andythenorth> I might have that forest patch applied, which is broken 19:06:56 <snail_UES_> I think generic train sets should always be 2cc.. that was the original TTD’s spirit 19:07:17 <nielsm> I've heard rumors before about maps deforesting just after running for a long time, but don't think I've observed it myself 19:07:23 <snail_UES_> everything in company colors 19:08:06 <nielsm> should make a debug logging of trees planted/removed each tick and graph it 19:10:25 <andythenorth> shall we just reimplement trees? :P 19:15:09 <planetmaker> o/ 19:16:10 <Xaroth> peter1138 4k x 4k is actually rather small tbh. 19:16:20 <peter1138> See what I mean? 19:16:55 <nielsm> btw when will my bunch of bugfix PR's get reviewed? :3 19:17:03 <peter1138> Unless you're openttdcoop, how many times does 4kx4k come close to even 5% full... 19:17:20 <Xaroth> it's not about how much is used 19:17:22 <peter1138> nielsm, when someone(tm) reviews them. 19:17:25 <Xaroth> it's about how much is available. 19:24:59 <andythenorth> meh 19:25:00 <andythenorth> :) 19:25:05 <andythenorth> 256x256 is lots 19:25:52 <planetmaker> peter1138, coop never does maps larger than 1k x 1k... too quickly too sluggish otherwise for no real benefit. 19:27:50 <peter1138> Right, but if anyone could fill it, they could :D 19:28:35 <andythenorth> 1024^2 ftw 19:28:52 <andythenorth> oof, we need to do nml 16 cargo industry thing 19:29:00 <andythenorth> I am bored of drawing trains 19:38:00 <planetmaker> hm, right :) 19:39:36 <nielsm> andythenorth: you can test out some PR patches instead then :] 19:39:39 *** wodencafe has quit IRC 19:41:44 <andythenorth> my build is sketchy 19:42:01 <andythenorth> hmm 19:42:32 <andythenorth> NotRoadTypes PR now fails the 3-months-and-dead rule 19:42:35 <andythenorth> v 19:42:35 <andythenorth> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/6811 19:42:47 <andythenorth> means it should be closed 19:43:27 <andythenorth> Wolf01: ^ shall we close it? 19:43:33 <andythenorth> it's got a conflict I can't resolve 19:43:37 <andythenorth> I think it's dead tbh 19:44:53 *** wodencafe has joined #openttd 19:45:31 <andythenorth> hmm can't find the PRs for samu :P 19:45:36 <andythenorth> too much samu 19:46:39 <andythenorth> this is better https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pulls?utf8=%E2%9C%93&q=is%3Apr+is%3Aopen+-label%3A%22waiting-on-author%22+-author%3ASamuXarick+ 19:48:00 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #6973: Add: Unique ID to savegames to prevent accidental overwriting https://git.io/fp0PQ 19:48:43 <nielsm> this one doesn't require any compilation to review :) https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/6963 19:51:26 <LordAro> andythenorth: could close/merge his PRs :p 19:51:45 <andythenorth> I am going to close NRT 19:52:09 <LordAro> :< 19:52:17 <nielsm> and many/all of Samu's PR's are imo in a "is this even something that needs to change at all?" state, i.e. should be reviewed on the concept and not the code itself 19:52:36 <andythenorth> when frosch reviewed some, they just weren't useful 19:52:44 <andythenorth> I think they're boil-the-ocean programming 19:52:48 <andythenorth> but samu does learn 20:00:46 <andythenorth> I make some food, then look at some PRs 20:00:46 *** Wacko1976_ has joined #openttd 20:00:59 <andythenorth> I won't close NRT without Wolf01 agreeing 20:01:11 <andythenorth> but I want it off my plate :P 20:01:22 <peter1138> Is it merged yet? 20:01:33 <peter1138> Wasn't it close? 20:03:44 *** glx has joined #openttd 20:03:44 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 20:04:34 *** Wacko1976 has quit IRC 20:10:07 <andythenorth> it's got merge conflicts 20:10:12 <andythenorth> I can't fix them, Wolf hasn't 20:10:34 <andythenorth> that isn't supposed to sound accusatory :P 20:10:38 <andythenorth> it's just facts 20:32:55 <peter1138> Learn how to? 20:57:06 <Eddi|zuHause> that sounds like "i want to drive home, but there's this tiny bump in the road" 20:57:55 <Wolf01> <andythenorth> I won't close NRT without Wolf01 agreeing <- close it, I don't have time, willpower, knowledge 20:59:04 <Eddi|zuHause> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALtGqSdt-4w 20:59:06 <Wolf01> I tried to fix them, but my working copy can't load grfs successfully 20:59:09 <andythenorth> I'll look at the merge conflict first 20:59:18 <Wolf01> So I can't test it 20:59:39 <andythenorth> 2 of them are just html conflicts 20:59:47 <andythenorth> one is lang 21:00:04 <andythenorth> https://farm.openttd.org/jenkins/blue/organizations/jenkins/OpenTTD%2FOpenTTD/detail/PR-6811/6/pipeline 21:00:29 <Wolf01> They aren't so difficult to fix 21:00:34 <andythenorth> there are about 6 that look less trivial 21:00:44 <andythenorth> the chances of me merging something I don't undersand 21:00:51 <andythenorth> into something I don't understand 21:00:52 <Eddi|zuHause> that page doesn't load? 21:01:26 <andythenorth> Wolf01: I'll leave it open, and if it's not fixed by 2019 I'll close the PR 21:01:30 <Eddi|zuHause> oh, just takes forever 21:01:32 <andythenorth> the problem is that it's bitrotting 21:01:35 <andythenorth> and NRT is big 21:01:38 <andythenorth> so everything breaks 21:02:02 <Eddi|zuHause> go back to a state that worked, and try again? 21:05:23 <Eddi|zuHause> by "try again" i mean in smaller steps that don't conflict 21:06:57 <andythenorth> presumably rebase on specific hashes would do that? 21:07:00 *** Wolf01 is now known as Guest3817 21:07:02 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 21:07:05 <andythenorth> we know the diffs where the breaks happen 21:07:16 <andythenorth> I'm not worried about how to bisect and pick through it 21:07:26 <andythenorth> but whether I take left or right is just a dice roll to me 21:07:37 <Wolf01> Meh, starts to disconnect again after 1.5 days of working flawlessly 21:08:26 <Eddi|zuHause> anyone know what a "throng" is? never heard that word before 21:09:21 <Wolf01> Seem to be a synonym for crowd 21:09:46 <LordAro> "a throng of people" is more or less "a large group of people" 21:12:28 *** Guest3817 has quit IRC 21:21:54 *** synchris has quit IRC 21:24:38 *** wodencafe has quit IRC 21:25:50 *** nielsm is now known as Guest3818 21:28:31 *** Guest3818 has quit IRC 21:41:25 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 21:53:41 *** wodencafe has joined #openttd 22:04:10 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 22:46:37 *** DrSegfault has joined #openttd 22:47:47 <DrSegfault> Hi, can anyone please help with https://imgur.com/a/5gkcJy4 ? The right train is entering while the train at the station is still there, and it's crashing. 22:48:40 <DrSegfault> Is this a bad signal constellation; can I fix it somehow? 22:49:02 <DrSegfault> If anyone wants to see the crash live: https://www.file-upload.net/download-13403023/autosave14.sav.html 22:49:05 *** ccfreak2k has joined #openttd 22:49:10 <LordAro> wouldn't expect that to cause a crash unless you'd told one of the trains the ignore a signal 22:51:05 <DrSegfault> I did somewhere in the past, but even when waiting a few trains to pass, trains crash again 22:51:42 <nielsm> what version of ottd? are you playing a patchpatch? 22:52:01 <nielsm> (e.g. something with "signals in tunnels") 22:52:43 <DrSegfault> nielsm: It's the official 1.8.0, no patches 22:55:22 <nielsm> hmm, try replacing those path signals with simple block signals 22:55:39 <nielsm> since there isn't really anything gained from them being path signals anyway 22:56:25 <DrSegfault> with block signals it works 22:57:06 <DrSegfault> they should be path signals, because while trains exit to the right track, trains from the top right track can already enter 22:59:22 *** luxtram has quit IRC 23:00:29 <nielsm> add a path signal (not one-way) to the northwest exit of the station, and also change the signal on the other end of the platform to a path signal 23:00:43 <nielsm> maybe 23:00:58 <nielsm> also try enabling the setting to show path reservations 23:01:24 *** luxtram has joined #openttd 23:04:31 <DrSegfault> the northwest signal won't help 23:04:39 <DrSegfault> where do I turn on the paths again? 23:04:52 <nielsm> somewhere in settings, use the search function 23:06:43 <DrSegfault> Oh, they don't crash if I take an older savegame... somehow, the train I let pass in the past caused the whole station to be confused 23:07:58 *** gelignite has quit IRC 23:09:24 <nielsm> so removing all the signals and placing them back, maybe also removing the track, could repair it 23:12:18 *** Wolf01 is now known as Guest3826 23:12:20 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 23:14:26 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc approved pull request #6961: Fix: Changing music set did not save new setting https://git.io/fp0Sy 23:16:02 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc approved pull request #6957: Fix #6498: Use int64 for all company rating calculations https://git.io/fp0SQ 23:17:07 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc approved pull request #6946: Doc: More notes for developers adding new PerformanceElements https://git.io/fp0S7 23:17:13 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 23:17:56 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc approved pull request #6962: Fix #6676: Prevent helicopters from stopping in midair during landing https://git.io/fp0Sd 23:18:08 *** Guest3826 has quit IRC 23:19:39 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 23:20:43 *** Wacko1976_ has quit IRC 23:28:25 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc requested changes for pull request #6963: Several improvements in known-bugs file https://git.io/fp09T 23:31:32 *** luxtram has quit IRC 23:33:59 *** matt21347 has quit IRC 23:44:02 *** lugo has joined #openttd 23:47:37 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh merged pull request #6962: Fix #6676: Prevent helicopters from stopping in midair during landing https://git.io/fxhTo 23:47:41 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh closed issue #6676: Helicopters can be stopped while descending https://git.io/fp09r 23:47:59 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh merged pull request #6961: Fix: Changing music set did not save new setting https://git.io/fxpI6 23:48:36 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh merged pull request #6957: Fix #6498: Use int64 for all company rating calculations https://git.io/fxAuK 23:48:41 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh closed issue #6498: Money bug in Detailed performance rating window https://git.io/fp09K 23:49:36 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh merged pull request #6946: Doc: More notes for developers adding new PerformanceElements https://git.io/fxHY1 23:49:42 <LordAro> :) 23:55:48 *** DrSegfault has left #openttd