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00:00:40 *** Osai^zZz [~Osai@pD9EB6284.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Osai^zZz] 00:13:52 *** Alanin is now known as alanin 00:25:43 *** NukeBuster [~opera@a62-251-21-79.adsl.xs4all.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:33:54 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A77DB.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 00:38:32 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-166-77.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 00:40:03 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A77DB.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #openttd [] 00:46:49 *** Sacro [~Ben@adsl-87-102-80-216.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:00:41 *** KritiK [Maxim@ppp85-141-226-10.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:05:59 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has quit [Quit: Solong, and thanks for all the fish.] 01:30:39 <Gekkko`> Nein~! 01:30:55 *** Eddi|zuHause3 [~johekr@p54B74F9B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 01:37:18 *** Eddi|zuHause2 [~johekr@p54B76866.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:46:49 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 02:20:55 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-166-77.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:30:38 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-160-16.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 02:39:49 *** glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: bye] 03:25:08 *** Chris82 [~chris@p579E1C6A.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:25:31 *** Digitalfox [~chatzilla@bl7-176-154.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #openttd 03:27:33 *** Tobin [~Tobin@c58-107-50-36.eburwd7.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 03:32:30 *** MarkSlap [~hestporr@host48-181.etanet.se] has joined #openttd 03:33:30 *** KUDr_afk [KUDr@mazanec1.netbox.cz] has joined #openttd 03:33:31 *** KUDr [KUDr@mazanec1.netbox.cz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:34:11 *** KUDr_afk is now known as KUDr 03:38:18 *** Ammller [~Ammler@adsl-89-217-146-76.adslplus.ch] has joined #openttd 03:39:03 *** MarkMc [~hestporr@host48-181.etanet.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:42:02 *** Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-62-167-58-73.adslplus.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:54:27 *** Ammller [~Ammler@adsl-89-217-146-76.adslplus.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:17:49 *** Tobin [~Tobin@c58-107-50-36.eburwd7.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Quit: Tobin] 06:00:27 *** Gekkko` [kvirc@CPE-58-168-99-207.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:02:42 *** elmex [~elmex@e180064206.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd 06:36:06 *** Ammller [~Ammler@adsl-89-217-146-76.adslplus.ch] has joined #openttd 06:39:24 *** myself [~prakti@pD9574770.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 06:45:16 *** Digitalfox [~chatzilla@bl7-176-154.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:46:42 *** prakti [~prakti@pD9577063.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:25:59 *** HMage` [hmage@arteimij.dialup.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 07:26:27 *** HMage [hmage@arteimij.dialup.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:27:29 *** Osai^zZz [~Osai@pD9EB6284.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 07:31:05 *** Osai^zZz is now known as Osai 07:34:19 *** alanin is now known as Alanin 07:37:57 *** Thomas[NL] [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 07:47:37 *** HMage` [hmage@arteimij.dialup.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:00:34 *** HMage [hmage@arteimij.dialup.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 08:03:00 *** Gekkko` [~Gekkko@CPE-58-168-99-207.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 08:10:50 *** kaan [~Klaus@82.192.152.195] has joined #openttd 08:11:00 <kaan> goodmorning 08:13:14 <stillunknown> Anyone know good reading material on performance optimisation? 08:13:22 <hylje> no 08:14:25 *** toresbe [~toresbe@64.80-203-20.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd 08:14:30 <toresbe> Hey guys :) 08:14:39 <hylje> hi 08:14:46 * toresbe checked out of SVN, heh. 08:14:48 <toresbe> Kaboom! 08:15:06 <hylje> soooo you are a code object? 08:15:28 <toresbe> No, I just checked OpenTTD out of SVN to try that build. It went kaboom. 08:15:28 *** Thomas[NL] [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:15:33 <toresbe> openttd: /home/toresbe/ottd-svn/trunk/src/player.h:241: Player* GetPlayer(PlayerID): Assertion `( (uint)((i) - (PLAYER_FIRST)) < ((uint)((sizeof(_players)/sizeof(_players[0])))) )' failed. 08:15:40 *** Thomas[NL] [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 08:15:40 <toresbe> for the record. 08:16:01 <hylje> that looks like a legitimate error 08:16:21 <toresbe> Well, it's from SVN. It's trivially reproducible. Scenario editor > load scenario :) 08:16:58 <hylje> id believe r10210 broke it 08:17:09 *** Purno [~Purno@5357D37C.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd 08:17:17 <hylje> with that type changing 08:17:35 <toresbe> also, the pixmaps are on crack - where there should be arrows, there are now flags 08:18:55 <toresbe> If I can be of any help, let me know. I have marginal competence in C++, but I should have nothing but time today, so... 08:19:26 <hylje> you can help by tracking down which revision broke it 08:19:41 <hylje> svn log src/player.h 08:22:33 <Alanin> being back in few minutes 08:22:52 *** Alanin [alanin@alanin.de] has quit [] 08:27:15 <peter1138> it's known 08:29:24 <toresbe> hylje: OK, noted, thanks. I'll do that in the future. 08:30:35 <toresbe> Hrm. A weird problem, this time with the 0.5.2 release. When I use the UK NewGRF, I get new locomotives for maglev.. but that's all I get. No cars, no nothin'. 08:31:09 <hylje> working as intended 08:31:16 <hylje> ukrs maglevs come in whole vehicles 08:31:17 <peter1138> correct 08:31:42 <toresbe> In whole vehicles? I see... 08:32:02 *** tokai|ni [~tokai@p54B83337.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:32:13 <caladan> so you dont get coal train traveling at 500km/h 08:32:56 <peter1138> toresbe: yeah, you buy the engine and the wagons come with it 08:33:07 <toresbe> aha 08:33:47 *** tokai|ni [~tokai@p54B81779.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 08:34:08 <toresbe> Gack. They're only 10 long. 08:34:17 <toresbe> I'll have to buy a bunch of them to push my kind of traffic... 08:34:38 <stillunknown> I wish the map array had space to store information about the shape of tiles. 08:34:40 <caladan> then use monorails :-) 08:34:53 <peter1138> stillunknown: shape? they're all square... 08:35:05 <hylje> toresbe: well you do have to buy a lot of wagons for that kind of traffic anyway 08:35:11 <stillunknown> I mean if it's flat, max_height and min_height. 08:35:19 <hylje> toresbe: and you can chain those things as if those were wagons 08:35:52 <toresbe> hylje: aaah! 08:37:18 *** Purno [~Purno@5357D37C.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:37:24 <stillunknown> Or at least if it's flat tile, which cover a lot of situations. 08:39:28 <toresbe> Hrm. Does it only carry goods? 08:39:35 <toresbe> Or can I somehow change that to, say, wood? 08:39:53 <stillunknown> You're not supposed to use maglev's for cargo. 08:40:06 <toresbe> Really? 08:40:23 <toresbe> It says "refittable" but I'm not quite sure how one goes about doing that. 08:40:56 <hylje> you can refit it to goods and foods 08:40:58 <hylje> and thats about it 08:57:18 *** setrodox [~setrodox@85-124-46-19.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has joined #openttd 09:01:50 <eekee> stillunknown: why that restriction? 09:02:20 <hylje> because it doesnt make sense really 09:02:35 <toresbe> why doesn't it? 09:02:39 <hylje> too heavy 09:02:43 <eekee> heheh 09:02:49 <hylje> maglev relies on the fact stuff doesnt hit the bottom 09:03:00 <toresbe> yeah, but in-game... 09:03:06 <eekee> give me a sec, looking up the Japanese maglev test track site 09:03:11 <hylje> ukrs is a realistic set 09:03:23 <hylje> the default grf allow you to haul bugger all on whatever 09:03:44 <toresbe> "bugger all" is a colloquialism for "nothing" 09:04:01 <hylje> context is a fun thing 09:04:10 *** Barry [~chatzilla@84-245-3-240.dsl.cambrium.nl] has joined #openttd 09:07:27 <eekee> Can't find the specific referance (It's too early for me) but I'm pretty sure somewhere on here http://www.rtri.or.jp/rd/maglev/html/english/maglev_frame_E.html it mentions the capacity of the maglev to carry over 40 tonnes, which is clost to the maximum weights of many of the OTTD wagons anyway 09:08:27 <stillunknown> But only insane people transfer bulk goods by maglev. 09:08:40 <toresbe> in-game as well? Why is this? 09:09:00 <Gekkko`> stillunknown: you mocking me again? 09:09:03 *** MarkSlap [~hestporr@host48-181.etanet.se] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:09:04 <Gekkko`> My entire network is maglev. 09:09:13 <eekee> no, only insane people deny facts of mag-lev capacity because "mag-lev is special" >:D 09:09:30 <Gekkko`> ph 09:09:31 <Gekkko`> oh* 09:09:39 <Gekkko`> you're saying that it wouldnt hold that many goods 09:09:45 <Gekkko`> because the magnets wouldnt hold the tonnes? 09:10:53 <stillunknown> By bulk goods i mean coal, oil, etc. 09:11:13 <stillunknown> Not the goods called goods. 09:11:22 <Gekkko`> I come in half way through teh argument 09:11:28 <eekee> well an open waggon is pretty stupid, yeah... 09:11:36 <Gekkko`> you're saying that its insane because it's physically impossible/ 09:11:41 <eekee> oh eck, so did I 09:12:21 <stillunknown> Just impractical. 09:12:39 <stillunknown> Just like carrying coal with an airplane. 09:14:27 <eekee> airplanes are much smaller capacity 09:15:01 <stillunknown> But for maglev you'd have to put the coal into containers. 09:15:21 <stillunknown> Or something like that, also coal benefits from >200 kph travel speeds. 09:15:28 <stillunknown> *benefits little 09:19:02 *** Nickman [~nn@d54C1C327.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 09:19:20 <eekee> just need a lid on the existing containers 09:21:42 <eekee> mew, I was wrong about the tonnage, in a way. Current maglev cars can weigh 40 tonnes empty, allowing (I think) 28 tonnes of capacity, but "experts are confidant that this will improve" 09:21:53 <eekee> ..in 10 years or so 09:22:00 <hylje> :o 09:22:20 <hylje> so first cargo maglevs should show up in 2020? 09:22:36 <eekee> prolly lol 09:24:17 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat1.spoje.net] has joined #openttd 09:27:07 <toresbe> A 09:27:10 <toresbe> oppsie 09:28:30 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has joined #openttd 09:30:23 *** Ammller is now known as Ammler 09:30:30 <stillunknown> Were can i find the DoCommand function? 09:30:39 <stillunknown> (it doesn't seem to be in any header file) 09:31:34 <stillunknown> Found it. 09:32:33 *** Brianetta [~brian@82.110.130.162] has joined #openttd 09:42:25 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host161-229-dynamic.5-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 09:42:34 <Wolf01> hello 09:43:36 <SmatZ> hello Wolf01 09:46:39 *** Brianetta [~brian@82.110.130.162] has quit [Quit: Tschüß] 09:55:03 <Thomas[NL]> any progress on brickland? 09:56:06 <Wolf01> no 09:57:26 <kaan> hi Wolf 10:02:04 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has joined #openttd 10:03:11 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1C6CD.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 10:10:50 *** Chris82 [~chris@p579E1442.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 10:10:54 <Chris82> hi guys :) 10:11:05 <Chris82> can somebody check the following savegame: 10:11:06 <Chris82> http://openttd.sandra-bullock.co.uk/public/save/stability-test-crashing-r10387-Trunk.sav 10:11:23 <Chris82> it keeps crashing after a little while, when you click windows it crashes quicker than when you do nothing 10:11:34 <Gekkko`> memory leak? 10:11:39 <Gekkko`> malloc() borked? 10:11:51 <Chris82> I have no idea :p that's why I asked if somebody can check it out 10:12:40 <Chris82> I have 37 billion in that game and world population is 14,6 mio so it's pretty massive 10:12:42 <Gekkko`> well I wont. 10:17:00 *** Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-89-217-146-76.adslplus.ch] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:17:36 *** Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-89-217-146-76.adslplus.ch] has joined #openttd 10:18:16 *** Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-89-217-146-76.adslplus.ch] has quit [] 10:20:45 *** Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-89-217-146-76.adslplus.ch] has joined #openttd 10:29:36 *** Gekkko` [~Gekkko@CPE-58-168-99-207.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Quit: http://bbqsrc.org - Now less gay.] 10:30:33 <SmatZ> Chris82: I get SIGFPE , will test with debugging enabled 10:31:48 <Chris82> k thx :) 10:34:08 <SmatZ> Program received signal SIGFPE, Arithmetic exception. 10:34:08 <SmatZ> [Switching to Thread 46971218706544 (LWP 6362)] 10:34:08 <SmatZ> 0x000000000042d278 in CargoList::InvalidateCache (this=0x11e3438) at /mnt/svn/openttd/trunk/src/cargopacket.cpp:355 10:34:25 <SmatZ> days_in_transit = dit / count; 10:34:37 <SmatZ> ^^^ there is the problem 10:35:35 <SmatZ> dit = count = 0 10:36:12 *** TinoM [~Tino@i5387CD34.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 10:36:23 <peter1138> hmm, that shouldn't happen 10:38:42 <Chris82> well it happens 10:38:52 <Chris82> and the savegame is from Trunk r10387 without patches 10:39:12 <peter1138> clearly, but it shouldn't :) 10:39:38 <Chris82> I first thought these late game crashes were caused by some patch in ChrisIN, but as this test has shown the problem occurs in Trunk games as well 10:43:00 <Chris82> btw... shouldn't 0 / 0 work in some cases? 10:43:15 <SmatZ> happens for station at xy=173859, x=803, y= 169 10:43:18 <Chris82> I thought division by 0 is only illegal when you divide something != 0 by 0 10:43:34 <Chris82> is that an AI station or one of my own? 10:43:44 <stillunknown> Does the new hashmap store subtiles when on a 64x64 map? 10:44:03 <Prof_Frink> Chris82: And what value should 0/0 give? 10:44:07 <Chris82> 0 10:44:12 <Prof_Frink> lies 10:44:17 <SmatZ> stillunknown: no 10:44:29 <SmatZ> as far as i know :) 10:44:35 <stillunknown> So updating the hashmap when entering a new tile should be ok? 10:44:36 <Chris82> well that's what our math prof said :( 10:44:45 <Prof_Frink> Well, he's wrong 10:44:52 <Prof_Frink> 0/0 is undefined 10:45:11 <Chris82> gtk so division by 0 is an exception in every case 10:46:52 <SmatZ> peter1138: count overflows 65535 -> 0 10:47:07 <SmatZ> Drunningworth falls' passangers, there are too many 10:47:19 *** eekee [~ethan@cpc2-lanc4-0-0-cust540.brig.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:47:33 <peter1138> stillunknown: no 10:47:40 <peter1138> 65535? :o 10:47:42 <stillunknown> no to what? 10:47:56 <peter1138> oh 10:47:59 <peter1138> to the first question :) 10:48:05 <peter1138> so yes to the second 10:48:13 <SmatZ> peter1138: there are about 65532 passangers and then the game crashes, so most likely overflow and then division by 0 10:48:44 <peter1138> hmm, count is 32 bit 10:49:24 <Chris82> OMG =O 10:49:33 <Chris82> there are really that many passengers lol 10:49:47 <Chris82> I thought there can't be more than 4095 at one station 10:49:47 <SmatZ> uint16 count; ///< The amount of cargo in this packet 10:49:51 <SmatZ> it is not 10:49:59 <peter1138> oh 10:50:02 <peter1138> the packet itself 10:50:03 <peter1138> hmm 10:50:20 *** ethan [~ethan@cpc2-lanc4-0-0-cust540.brig.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd 10:50:25 *** ethan is now known as eekee 10:50:43 <peter1138> then either it needs to be uint32, or just split it into 2 packets. hmm. 10:51:08 <Chris82> yeah that station is the problem I just had the station open and when it hit 65532 fatal application failure 10:54:31 <peter1138> cargopacket.cpp:231 10:54:35 <peter1138> - if ((*it)->SameSource(cp)) { 10:54:35 <peter1138> + if ((*it)->SameSource(cp) && (*it)->count + cp->count <= 65535) { 10:54:46 <peter1138> i think 10:54:57 <peter1138> (mmm, magic numbers) 10:55:18 <SmatZ> well, count+count will everytime <= 65535, I think 10:55:25 <SmatZ> if they are uint16 10:55:32 <peter1138> should be promoted to int 10:55:48 <toresbe> Hrm. 10:55:56 <peter1138> might need to force it i guess 10:56:17 * toresbe has a problem with openttd (this time it's rail infrastructure ;) 10:56:34 <toresbe> I have a problem with that there are too many trains pulling out of a very busy traffic artery. 10:56:38 *** myself [~prakti@pD9574770.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Quitting .... Hackedi...hackedi...weg.] 10:56:39 <SmatZ> (*it)->count + cp->count <= (*it)->count would be enough :) 10:57:08 <SmatZ> *> 10:57:21 <SmatZ> >=, not <= 10:57:37 <SmatZ> because sum of two numbers cannot be lower than any of them 10:57:49 <SmatZ> but promoting them to int would be faster... so why not :) 10:59:01 <SmatZ> peter1138: or you may limit the number of units in one packets to 32767 10:59:05 <peter1138> damn that game is slow :p 10:59:08 <SmatZ> :D 11:01:20 <eekee> toresbe: ehhh.. get inventive with junctions? That can be quite a puzzle ^_^' 11:03:01 <Chris82> my save is slow? Yeah it runs with "normal speed" when I hit fw :D 11:03:11 <eekee> lol 11:03:14 <Chris82> i.e. I don't see a difference between fw and normal speed 11:03:25 <Zavior> How is that 11:03:48 <Chris82> I think I will put limit town growth in the next IN, these 100k cities don't make sense :D 11:04:05 <eekee> wai not? 11:04:23 <stillunknown> Chris82: You probably have a faster computer than peter1138. 11:04:25 <Chris82> well you can never handle the amount of passengers/mail that city produces 11:04:38 <eekee> hrm 11:05:02 *** Osai^2 [~Osai@pD9EB61EF.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 11:05:17 <Chris82> and it's really hard to build any industry railways when the map is full of cities 11:05:55 <Chris82> ah but I just remember I have set 1 in 1 towns become cities 11:05:59 <eekee> I'm always wanting ttd to be harder 11:06:17 <Chris82> what happens actually when I set this to 1 in 2 ? I mean what is defined as a town, and what a city 11:07:11 <peter1138> i'm guessing my pc doesn't like the 1,665 road vehicles 11:07:21 <eekee> crap, ottd forces it's window size after the window manager tells the new window what to use. That means it's a pain with tiling window managers, and I'm making a new tiling WM which hasn't yet got a facility for forcing windows to size. 11:07:45 <eekee> (might be an SDL thing) 11:08:08 <peter1138> yet another tiling wm? :) 11:08:44 <SmatZ> peter1138: FindRoadVehToOvertake is still using the old hash table 11:08:50 <eekee> peter1138: I only ever found one sane one, & that now has a wierd license (ion) 11:09:59 <peter1138> SmatZ: hmm, no it's not, but it is only 'scanning' one tile. 11:10:24 <eekee> well, sane ~= intuitive, to me, plus I didn't like wmii's rotation of windows 11:11:05 <Chris82> }; < does such a semicolon make sense in any situation? 11:11:31 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB6284.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:11:36 <peter1138> end of a struct/class 11:11:39 <SmatZ> peter1138: you are right, it is not 11:13:38 <peter1138> hmm 11:13:53 <peter1138> looks like it 'manually' scans two tiles anyway 11:19:03 <stillunknown> peter1138: That is needed, otherwise vehicles may stall behind another. 11:19:31 <stillunknown> It was added at the same time the new hashmap was added. 11:20:42 <peter1138> hmm? 11:20:55 <stillunknown> looks like it 'manually' scans two tiles anyway 11:20:56 <peter1138> r3510 is a little bit before the new hashmap 11:21:01 <stillunknown> It is? 11:21:25 <stillunknown> I remember making that change locally not so long ago. 11:25:31 *** raimar2 [~hawk@p5489CB0D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:38:32 *** Osai^2 is now known as Osai 11:48:30 <Chris82> if (ret.GetCost() == 0) 11:48:30 <Chris82> return CMD_ERROR; 11:48:34 <Chris82> is that obsolete? 11:48:42 <Chris82> it is used for the Signal auto complete 11:49:10 <Chris82> and I have a problem with it... when I have like 2000 money left and auto completion would cost 60k it also builds all signals and subtracts 60k 11:49:17 <Chris82> although it should only build signals for max. 2k 11:51:02 <eekee> shouldn't it refuse to build any signals & pop up one of those red boxes? 11:51:32 <Chris82> well either that or build as many possible 11:51:45 <Chris82> but it builds all and subtracts more money than I have as a result 11:51:55 <Chris82> so the error checking if there's enough money is not working 11:53:20 <eekee> if (ret.GetCost() == 0) <== that's your test line? 11:53:46 <Chris82> I assume it is 11:54:39 <Chris82> http://www.sandra-bullock.co.uk/openttd/rail_cmd.txt 11:54:44 <Chris82> in this part of code the error must be 11:55:04 <eekee> I would have thought it should be: if (ret.GetCost() < 0) 11:57:32 <Chris82> uhm < sounds more logical yeah I'll test it :D 11:57:53 <Gekko[PDA]> <= 11:58:00 <eekee> Oh wait 11:58:26 <eekee> that's the cost, not the cast there would be after the operation 11:58:59 <eekee> might be correct to leave that alone and add some code to check if the player can afford it 12:00:45 <Chris82> changing it from == to < didn't change anything at all anyway 12:00:47 <Chris82> strange 12:01:04 <Gekko[PDA]> lol. 12:01:52 <eekee> not so strange. Cloning trains was implemented without any check for cash available, at first 12:02:22 <Gekko[PDA]> hacks. 12:02:41 <eekee> I think the if (ret.GetCost() == 0) 12:03:11 <Thomas[NL]> what happened to http://dev.openttd.org/~belugas/Industries/ :( ? 12:03:16 <eekee> er, I think that line is there for when there isn't enough length for any more signals 12:03:58 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1C6CD.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:04:15 <eekee> heheh, oh dear 12:14:17 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1C6CD.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 12:19:06 <peter1138> Druningworth Falls: 65,550 passengers 12:19:06 <peter1138> hmm 12:19:09 *** WuZuul [~kpk@88.193.21.99] has joined #openttd 12:20:09 <WuZuul> Anyone else had any problems with bridges with the latest ottd? 12:20:17 <Chris82> peter1138: Did you fix it? :D 12:20:23 <peter1138> seems like it 12:20:28 <Chris82> cool 12:20:37 <Chris82> WuZuul: Except for many clipping errors no. 12:20:47 <peter1138> though it's clearly a bug that it has so many passengers 12:21:15 <WuZuul> Chris82, when I build a bridge over water, the trains wont go over it.. They jsut turn around like there wouldn't be any track 12:21:16 <Chris82> Yeah I thought so too, I was thinking there is a fix limit at 4095 12:21:25 <peter1138> that was removed 12:21:27 <WuZuul> And if I builda a bridge accross another railway, the trais still crash :D 12:21:34 <peter1138> but those stations have a rating of around 30% 12:21:35 <WuZuul> trains even.. 12:21:36 <Chris82> electriefied trains and the bridge is normal rail? 12:21:47 <WuZuul> Steam trains and any bridge 12:22:00 <peter1138> 0.5.3RC1 is broken, yes 12:22:10 <WuZuul> Thought something like that 12:22:16 <WuZuul> So guess I will revert to the older one then 12:22:21 <peter1138> yup 12:23:15 *** glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 12:23:15 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 12:24:03 <Chris82> what might cause this bug that there are so many passengers? 12:24:21 <Chris82> I obviously had it in a few games already, because this is not the first game crashing this way 12:24:45 <Chris82> maybe a bug specific to AI stations? 12:25:19 <peter1138> possible, they do get strange bonuses... 12:25:39 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: peter1138 * r10404 /trunk/src/cargopacket.cpp: -Fix (r10266): Adding a cargo packet to cargo list could overflow. Now we detect this and just leave the cargo in its own packet. 12:25:45 *** BobingAbout [~BobingAbo@adsl-83-100-238-41.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 12:26:30 <peter1138> hmm, my rubadub is ginormous 12:27:53 <Chris82> errrrm there is a bad bug in r10403/4 12:27:57 <Chris82> I can't build erail 12:28:04 <Chris82> it's disabled in the GUI 12:28:13 <Chris82> no matter if I enable/disable it in patch options 12:28:52 <peter1138> works for me 12:29:17 <Chris82> uhm when can you build erail? 12:29:30 <Chris82> oh lol I had DB Set XL disabled :D 12:29:34 <peter1138> when erail engines are available 12:29:37 <Chris82> I am not used to no erail available in 1950 lol 12:30:47 <Gekko[PDA]> arctic has no erail 12:32:07 <Chris82> :'( grrr I don't get this auto signal bug fixed 12:32:20 <Chris82> it's obviously more complicated than fixing diagonal levelling 12:33:09 <Gekko[PDA]> make it find banko - cost 12:33:20 *** Nickman is now known as Nickman^Away 12:33:29 <Gekko[PDA]> if < 0 than error 12:36:16 *** scia [~scia@85.149.96.102] has joined #openttd 12:36:24 <stillunknown> peter1138: Do you have any idea why some savegames do trigger CheckSaveameVersion() and why some don't? 12:36:52 <glx> because they don't have the same version 12:37:42 <stillunknown> I just added a new version, 70, so no existing savegame should have that? 12:38:08 <peter1138> mmm, fresh spring onions 12:38:47 <peter1138> stron g 12:39:22 <Gekko[PDA]> freak lol 12:39:26 <peter1138> what? 12:39:41 <Gekko[PDA]> put the,m in a dip 12:39:46 <Gekko[PDA]> now. 12:39:49 <Gekko[PDA]> :o 12:39:51 <peter1138> too late, gone :D 12:39:59 <Gekko[PDA]> noooooo 12:40:07 <peter1138> lovely yummy spring onions 12:40:24 <Gekko[PDA]> lol chives 12:40:40 <Gekko[PDA]> i eat white onion like an apple 12:41:01 <Gekko[PDA]> tried to eat a clove of garlic once 12:41:16 <peter1138> fresh garlic is nice but a little bit too strong 12:41:21 <Gekko[PDA]> i was licking the roof of bmy mouth for 6 hours 12:48:41 <stillunknown> peter1138: any idea what in savegame version 42 could cause the function to return? 12:48:56 <stillunknown> (with opntitle.dat) 12:50:07 <stillunknown> function = AfterLoadGame() 12:50:41 <stillunknown> Since i see not returns. 12:51:30 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-160-16.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:52:05 <Chris82> what is the variable for the money that's available to me? 12:52:19 <glx> p->money ? 12:52:35 <Chris82> thx 12:54:41 <glx> GetPlayer(_local_player)->player_ money or GetPlayer(_current_player)->player_money 12:57:13 <stillunknown> I found it myself, my problem. 12:59:14 *** Chris82 [~chris@p579E1442.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [] 13:00:06 <peter1138> heh 13:00:12 *** BobingAbout [~BobingAbo@adsl-83-100-238-41.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- 100,000+ downloads can't be wrong] 13:00:31 <Gekko[PDA]> obviously they can. 13:00:52 <Gekko[PDA]> irssi would have to get 10k a week. 13:01:52 <hylje> most of the irssi downloads are downstream 13:01:59 <hylje> distributor packages 13:02:38 <Gekko[PDA]> still 10k a week 13:04:18 * eekee wonders what xchat & pidgin (formerly gaim) get 13:04:56 <Gekko[PDA]> xchat sucks 13:05:04 <Gekko[PDA]> pidgin rules 13:05:04 <eekee> heheh 13:05:22 <eekee> my friend swears by xchat, but I've tried it &.. meh. 13:06:09 <eekee> I've been using gaim, but it's teh freakahzoidal with a barebones window manager and I'm currently making a window manager, so it's back to irssi 13:06:24 <hylje> is that bad? 13:09:40 <eekee> hylje: if you're using a bare-bones window manager, yeah 13:10:43 <eekee> actually most gtk apps seem to be dumping their transient windows in odd places with my wm, so I guess I'll have to fix something there. Probably need to be more evil about controling the windows 13:12:37 *** Purno [~Purno@5357D37C.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd 13:30:39 <stillunknown> peter1138: are you around for a question (no bugs or anything like that ;-) )? 13:39:34 *** KritiK [Maxim@ppp85-140-205-147.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #openttd 13:45:38 *** Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-89-217-146-76.adslplus.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:47:21 *** Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-193-46-fixip.tiscali.ch] has joined #openttd 13:48:30 *** AntB [~AntB-UK@5ac91a48.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 14:01:54 *** MarkMc [~hestporr@host48-181.etanet.se] has joined #openttd 14:11:15 *** lolman [~john@cpc3-leds2-0-0-cust55.leed.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:15:05 *** thgergo [~th_gergo@dsl51B7A140.pool.t-online.hu] has joined #openttd 14:15:53 *** lolman [~john@cpc3-leds2-0-0-cust55.leed.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd 14:32:14 *** lolman [~john@cpc3-leds2-0-0-cust55.leed.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 14:33:20 *** lolman [~john@cpc3-leds2-0-0-cust55.leed.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd 14:50:44 *** UnderBuilder [~chatzilla@168.226.106.208] has joined #openttd 14:51:28 <UnderBuilder> I was playing on a server when a player named jasperwillem entered 14:51:53 <UnderBuilder> fortunately it is other jasper as it seems, because he is building railways 14:55:36 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A5DAB.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 14:57:22 <UnderBuilder> also a suggestion: is inside the plans of economy balancing adding mantenaince costs to purchased land? 14:57:34 <UnderBuilder> suggestion->question 15:12:40 *** crim [~crim@cc149662-b.emmen1.dr.home.nl] has joined #openttd 15:19:18 *** crim [~crim@cc149662-b.emmen1.dr.home.nl] has quit [Quit: Bye for now!] 15:21:16 <kaan> UnderBuilder: look in the pdf for that, its all there 15:36:00 *** Thomas[NL] [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:41:27 *** Mekansiz_Reis [~MT19483@85.99.13.161] has joined #openttd 15:47:17 *** Mekansiz_Reis is now known as Superx 15:47:49 *** Superx [~MT19483@85.99.13.161] has left #openttd [] 15:53:42 *** prottt [~lala@87-119-171-103.tll.elisa.ee] has joined #openttd 15:54:43 <prottt> hi 15:54:56 <prottt> i have a little problem with bridges 15:55:10 <prottt> the trains fall through them 15:55:59 <hylje> :o 15:56:06 <hylje> we have a physics engine? 15:56:23 <prottt> so i cant make bridges over water and on land it must have railway under it 15:56:48 <prottt> i added some newgrf stuff 15:57:13 <prottt> but when i remove them then its not helping 15:57:57 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A5DAB.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #openttd [] 15:58:23 *** MUcht [~Mucht@p57A0DEC6.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 15:59:02 <prottt> any suggestions ? 15:59:21 *** Thomas[NL] [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 15:59:41 <colle> known problem in 0.5.3-rc1 I think 15:59:51 <prottt> ouh okey 15:59:52 <colle> read something about it in the forums 15:59:58 <prottt> ty 16:00:15 <colle> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?t=32799 16:02:03 *** Mucht_ [~Mucht@p57A0CDBD.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:02:58 <kaan> I updated the autoslopes patch http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=603183#603183 16:11:09 <peter1138> http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c186/jonf45/P10105132.jpg 16:11:16 <peter1138> ^ struck by 0.5.3-rc1 16:11:45 <kaan> hehe 16:12:17 *** AntB [~AntB-UK@5ac91a48.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:13:35 <kaan> I was wondering if it is wasted work i did on autoslopes 16:13:56 <kaan> will it get considered for trunk if whipped into shape? 16:16:27 *** Taikaponi [~Zavior@d195-237-7-209.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 16:23:42 *** Zavior [~Zavior@d195-237-7-209.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:30:57 *** MarkSlap [~hestporr@host48-181.etanet.se] has joined #openttd 16:30:57 *** MarkMc [~hestporr@host48-181.etanet.se] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:38:47 *** Kosma [~kosma@hakone.magma-net.pl] has joined #openttd 16:39:08 <Kosma> a quick question: is it possible to use multiplayer without UDP? 16:39:31 <hylje> you need udp to detect servers 16:39:40 <hylje> if you add servers manually, you might not need it 16:39:42 <hylje> im not sure 16:39:53 <caladan> well, i tried 16:39:58 <caladan> it just says the server is offline 16:40:14 <caladan> so maybe there's some workaround... 16:42:00 *** Ammller [~Ammler@adsl-193-46-fixip.tiscali.ch] has joined #openttd 16:44:11 *** Zojj [~Zojj@ip68-96-107-63.lv.lv.cox.net] has joined #openttd 16:45:23 *** Zojj [~Zojj@ip68-96-107-63.lv.lv.cox.net] has left #openttd [] 16:45:42 *** Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-193-46-fixip.tiscali.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:45:58 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A4A19.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 16:48:25 <peter1138> try "connect ip" from the console 16:49:25 <Kosma> network game connection lost 16:53:15 <caladan> hmm, it seems to work 16:53:28 <caladan> i already given up and shut down server, but now it works with connect 16:55:09 <caladan> peter1138: thx :-) 16:56:22 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1C6CD.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:11:33 *** PinguTux [~PinguTux@pD9E9D6BF.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 17:11:47 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r10405 /trunk/src/rail_gui.cpp: -Fix [FS#972]: do not try to determine the default railtype in the scenario editor. 17:13:15 <kaan> so noone can answer my question above? 17:17:21 <hylje> i think if you bring the patch to coding standards and poke the devs enough 17:17:25 <hylje> youll get it 17:18:18 *** WuZuul [~kpk@88.193.21.99] has left #openttd [] 17:18:26 *** PinguTux [~PinguTux@pD9E9D6BF.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: PinguTux] 17:18:40 <Rubidium> the real question is whether the design of that autoslope patch is/was sound 17:19:16 *** PinguTux [~PinguTux@pD9E9D6BF.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 17:19:51 <Rubidium> I haven't looked thoroughly at the patch at all 17:20:47 <kaan> ok, thanks for the answer :) 17:21:39 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r10406 /trunk/src/ (industry.h industry_cmd.cpp): -Fix [FS#968]: only industries in the temperate climate should be affected by the "do not increase production" flag. 17:48:24 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A4A19.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #openttd [] 17:51:15 *** PinguTux [~PinguTux@pD9E9D6BF.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #openttd [] 17:51:46 *** PinguTux [~PinguTux@pD9E9D6BF.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 18:03:23 *** MarkyParky [~Marky@r6be251.net.upc.cz] has joined #openttd 18:09:35 <toresbe> OK, SVN's stopped crashing. :) 18:09:44 <toresbe> Wow. the SVN version is even more awesome. 18:10:12 *** Frostregen_ [~sucks@dslb-084-058-149-127.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 18:13:23 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: miham * r10407 /trunk/src/lang/ (7 files): (log message trimmed) 18:13:23 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Update: WebTranslator2 update to 2007-07-01 20:12:34 18:13:23 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: brazilian_portuguese - 2 fixed by tucalipe (2) 18:13:23 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: catalan - 2 fixed by arnaullv (2) 18:13:23 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: hungarian - 2 fixed by miham (2) 18:13:25 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: italian - 1 changed by lorenzodv (1) 18:13:25 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: japanese - 4 fixed by ickoonite (4) 18:16:25 *** Frostregen [SADDAM@dslb-084-058-099-103.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 18:16:53 *** Frostregen_ is now known as Frostregen 18:19:39 *** Markkisen [~hestporr@h51n6c1o1114.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #openttd 18:22:07 *** MarkSlap [~hestporr@host48-181.etanet.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:23:15 *** PinguTux [~PinguTux@pD9E9D6BF.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: PinguTux] 18:47:05 *** Sacro [~Ben@adsl-87-102-80-216.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 18:52:06 <Wolf01> -Fix (r10266): Adding a cargo packet to cargo list could overflow. Now we detect this and just leave the cargo in its own packet. 18:52:06 <Wolf01> which mean? 18:53:41 *** MarkyParky [~Marky@r6be251.net.upc.cz] has left #openttd [] 18:53:45 <glx> you get 2 packets if it overflows 18:53:49 <Rubidium> that coalescencing algorithm doesn't merge two cargopackets when they would overflow the "count" variable in the cargo packet 18:54:44 <Wolf01> thanks glx :) (sorry Rubidium, too complex yours :P) 18:55:13 <Rubidium> I'm trying to increase your vocabulary ;) 18:55:27 <Wolf01> yeah i really need it :D 18:56:11 <Wolf01> i think coale..whatisit mean really old, isn't it? 18:56:53 <Rubidium> http://m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?va=coalescence 18:57:18 <Rubidium> and especially 2a 18:58:41 <Wolf01> aaah, i read coal and i associated with coal age :P 19:01:07 <Wolf01> back to work, i made a new preview of my brickland tiles, now i have 3 of 4 stages of the bulldozed land 19:04:45 <peter1138> heh 19:05:01 <peter1138> Rubidium: it was either that or make the count uint32 19:05:06 <peter1138> which seemed silly to me 19:12:00 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r10408 /trunk/src/ (16 files): -Codechange: make GetImage a class method of Vehicle instead of Get(Aircraft|RoadVeh|Ship|Train)Image. 19:14:04 * stillunknown smells local copy conflicts coming soon 19:14:53 <Rubidium> with a little luck it will merge nicely 19:15:49 <stillunknown> I've overhauled a lot of the vehicle handling stuff, so i will have to do some stuff manually i think. 19:20:25 *** Sacro [~Ben@adsl-87-102-80-216.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:20:50 *** Sacro|Laptop [~Ben@adsl-87-102-80-216.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 19:25:08 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r10409 /trunk/src/ (11 files): -Codechange: replace (Aircraft|RoadVeh|Ship|Train)_Tick with a Tick method in the Vehicle class. 19:25:36 <stillunknown> :-( 19:25:57 <stillunknown> Is it possible to skip a revision altogether, aka reverse patch it? 19:26:58 <Sacro|Laptop> stillunknown: what do you mean? 19:28:13 <Eddi|zuHause3> patch -r? 19:28:15 <stillunknown> I have a class based vehicle tick implemented in my local copy. 19:28:18 <Eddi|zuHause3> or -R? 19:28:27 <stillunknown> I have no use for another one. 19:29:48 <stillunknown> Does svn have a facility for this, since that would be preferred. 19:31:22 <Eddi|zuHause3> svn diff > tmpfile && svn revert -r . && svn up && svn diff -r HEAD:PREV > tmpfile2 && patch -p0 < tmpfile2 && patch -p0 < tmpfile 19:31:38 <Eddi|zuHause3> you might have to switch HEAD and PREV 19:31:44 *** Sacro [~Ben@adsl-87-102-80-216.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 19:33:22 <peter1138> or just work your patch around trunk :p 19:33:51 *** Sacro|Laptop [~Ben@adsl-87-102-80-216.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:34:59 <stillunknown> peter1138: not very usefull, since my level of integration is much greater 19:35:09 <stillunknown> This looks like one of my first steps. 19:36:07 <stillunknown> I'm currently performance optimizing my train controller. 19:36:29 <stillunknown> So nobody write a new train controller ;-) 19:36:44 * Smoovious starts working on his controller as ordered 19:37:01 <stillunknown> Not that happens often, since it's not easy. 19:37:23 <peter1138> i've probably got several uncommitted controllers, knowing me 19:38:59 <stillunknown> I'm having decent results. 19:39:05 <stillunknown> *I'm getting 19:39:24 <stillunknown> Although they vary, on some games i can get a cpu reduction of 50%. 19:39:36 <peter1138> interesting 19:39:43 <stillunknown> But i have this game called the SML testcase, which has 1000 maglev trains. 19:39:57 <stillunknown> And i only recently managed to shave a few perfect of that. 19:40:06 <peter1138> i now have a test game with 440 trains 19:40:11 <peter1138> and 1550 road vehicles 19:41:21 <stillunknown> Although to remove a bottleneck i did have to cache some data. 19:41:58 <mikk36> lol 19:41:58 <mikk36> http://bash.org/?777977 19:42:04 <stillunknown> In the map, so at the end, we'll have to have a long talk about what and how to do. 19:42:12 <stillunknown> Because the patch is huge (>100 KiB) 19:42:25 <stillunknown> But i'm not done optimizing just yet. 19:44:58 <peter1138> yeah, my bridges-over-diagonal-rail patch was huge 19:45:45 <Smoovious> mikk36: hahaha... that's just perfect. :D 19:45:52 <mikk36> ;) 19:46:06 <peter1138> wtf, kids do that? 19:46:32 <mikk36> i dno,haven't noticed here 19:47:42 <Smoovious> people's kids are pretty huge monsters, with parents deluded with the 'not MY kid' syndrome which lets them get away with everything, and they aren't going to do shit about it... 19:47:48 <Smoovious> serves her right... 19:47:59 <Eddi|zuHause3> must be american kids... 19:48:03 <mikk36> yeah 19:48:17 <Eddi|zuHause3> or with "alternative" upbringing methods 19:48:17 <Smoovious> what's she gonna say... he forced his leg into her kids mouth and made the kid bite down?! 19:48:33 <mikk36> :P 19:49:10 <Smoovious> the 'alternative' methods are actually better... at least there is a method... these problem kids are raised with the 'I don't give a fuck' method 19:49:19 <Eddi|zuHause3> honestly, i have never seen that kind of kids 19:50:07 <Smoovious> yeah, well, unfortunately, the way things are going to make corporal punishment akin to child abuse, it is only gonna get worse 19:51:17 <Smoovious> a kid is out of control, and her mother puts the kid over her lap and spanks him there on the spot, and the next thing she knows, she's spending a couple years defending herself t hrough t he c ourts for child abuse allegations and child services gets involved and everything else 19:51:21 *** Bjarni [~Bjarni@0x50c79adc.virnxx14.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 19:51:23 *** mode/#openttd [+o Bjarni] by ChanServ 19:51:26 <Smoovious> they've SOOO lost touch with reason 19:51:32 <peter1138> hmm 19:51:43 <peter1138> oh yes, smacking is now taboo isn't it? 19:51:52 * Smoovious rolls h is eyes. 19:52:26 <Smoovious> hey, when I was in school, I got paddled by the principal a few times... which I deserved... didn't scar me for life... 19:52:59 <mikk36> paddled by the principal o.O 19:53:02 <Smoovious> but in the past generation, it seems people's backbones has been weeded out of the genetic pool... 19:53:22 <Smoovious> remember that story in the news about this one teen who was going to get caned in a different country? 19:54:40 <Smoovious> like... hell, he could have gone to jail... he could h ave got a h arsher punishment, but all he was gonna get was a caning and be done with it right then and there... but no... it got dragged out and dragged out and dragged out as t he parents thought it to be too harsh 19:55:06 <Smoovious> maybe if they had given their kid a spanking or two growing up, the kid wouldn't have been caned then 19:55:19 * Smoovious rolls his eyes. 19:55:48 * toresbe rolls his eyes at Smoovious' cluelessness 19:55:55 <stillunknown> What's caning? 19:56:07 <toresbe> stillunknown: they beat you with a cane. 19:56:19 <toresbe> The Singaporean style leaves you with fairly obvious scars. 19:56:21 <Smoovious> being smacked on the ass with a cane... same as paddling, but with a cane 19:56:32 <Smoovious> that's too bad 19:57:48 <Eddi|zuHause3> what's a cane? 19:58:01 <stillunknown> A walking stick. 19:58:01 <Smoovious> a type of stick 19:58:24 <Prof_Frink> I dunno, kids these days 19:58:25 <Smoovious> generally, thinner than a walking cane, for punishment purposes 19:58:47 <toresbe> If you're going to stray off topic, can you please not be this militantly clueless? 19:59:03 <mikk36> i haven't got beaten with a cane 19:59:11 <mikk36> rather with a belt 19:59:27 <Smoovious> the whole point of punishment is to have a consequence the kid doesn't want to get... and a 'time out' just doesn't cut it 19:59:37 <Smoovious> nothing militant about it 19:59:40 <mikk36> yup 19:59:45 <Smoovious> and I'd say you're the clueless 19:59:47 <toresbe> no, the point of punishment is to prevent the kid from doing it again 19:59:52 <Smoovious> have you ever even caned someone? I have... 20:00:18 <mikk36> toresbe, the point is to make the kid scared of getting punished 20:00:18 *** Thomas[NL] [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:00:19 <toresbe> Smoovious: Not like the Singaporean do it. It is after all a rather serious punishment there, that should tell you something. 20:00:24 <toresbe> mikk36: No, it isn't. 20:00:30 <mikk36> so that he drops the idea of making stupid things 20:00:36 *** Thomas[NL] [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 20:00:49 <toresbe> ah, christ. I can't deal with this kind of cluelessness. 20:00:52 <Smoovious> mikk36... I've had the hand-spank, paddles, belts... and I deserved every one of em 20:01:02 <mikk36> i've had them too 20:01:29 <mikk36> also deserved them 20:01:31 <Smoovious> toresbe... if the point of punishment isn't to have someone be scared of being punished, then you tell us... what is the point? 20:01:32 <Eddi|zuHause3> you should not have that kind of discussion here... 20:01:42 * Smoovious shrugs. 20:02:00 <mikk36> Eddi|zuHause3, because there are kids here ? :) 20:02:16 <Eddi|zuHause3> no, because it is off topic 20:02:28 <mikk36> this is the current topic :P 20:02:28 <Eddi|zuHause3> and you are going nowhere 20:02:54 <mikk36> it's a side-topic :) 20:03:08 <mikk36> to relax our minds from openttd :P 20:03:14 <Smoovious> give us an ottd topic, and we'll be happy to immediately switch back 20:03:16 <toresbe> Smoovious: The fear of punishment works very poorly as an incentive not to do stupid things. 20:03:26 <mikk36> well, it worked for me 20:03:30 <Smoovious> toresbe... now who's clueless... .. . 20:03:47 <Sacro> me! 20:03:50 <Smoovious> where do you think that 'fear' comes from... a 'time-out'?! 20:03:57 <toresbe> Smoovious: I can back this up with statistics. Can you? 20:04:02 <mikk36> toresbe, what is the reason for not robbing the bank for you ? 20:04:11 <toresbe> mikk36: Because I have a sense of decency. 20:04:16 <Smoovious> oh yeah... statistics... 20:04:38 <Smoovious> reason trumps statistics any day 20:04:52 <mikk36> and what makes robbing a bank a not decent action ? 20:04:54 <mikk36> for you 20:04:55 *** scia [~scia@85.149.96.102] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 20:05:02 <toresbe> Smoovious: Congratulations, you've just invoked reason and discarded it in the same sentence. 20:05:11 <toresbe> mikk36: the fact that the money doesn't belong to me. 20:05:14 <Smoovious> statistics != reason 20:05:39 <Eddi|zuHause3> toresbe: so it would be ok to rob a bank where you have stored money? 20:05:49 <toresbe> Eddi|zuHause3: If I only robbed them of my money, sure. 20:05:59 <toresbe> But then they call it a "withdrawal" here... :) 20:06:05 <Smoovious> toresbe... that's just stupid 20:06:06 <mikk36> not the fact that you'll be trialed for doing the robbery ? 20:06:07 <Eddi|zuHause3> yeah, try telling that to the judge :p 20:06:19 <toresbe> I was kidding, sheesh 20:06:22 <toresbe> mikk36: of course not 20:06:40 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@dD576B7C2.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 20:06:56 <mikk36> another thing, do you sometimes drive faster than the limit ? 20:07:00 <toresbe> Nope. 20:07:01 <Eddi|zuHause3> no, i mean "robbing" in the sense of going in there and shouting "this is a robbery, i want xxx Money in this bag" 20:07:11 <mikk36> but if you'd be in a hurry, would you ? 20:07:14 <toresbe> Eddi|zuHause3: Yeah, I know, I was kidding. No, of course not. 20:07:28 <mikk36> i mean, if there'd be no limit, would you drive faster than you'd do now ? 20:07:32 <toresbe> mikk36: If I had a pregnant woman in the back seat and conditions allowed for it, then of course. 20:08:00 <mikk36> so you drive by the limit because you'd be punished :) 20:08:08 <mikk36> and you don't want to be punished :) 20:08:12 <toresbe> No? 20:08:15 <Eddi|zuHause3> i always drive 10km/h over the limit (20km/h outside towns) 20:08:27 <Eddi|zuHause3> that's usually the range where they do not punish 20:08:37 <toresbe> I drive by the limit because I realize that the traffic rules are there for a reason. 20:08:59 <Smoovious> you sound like a very boring person to be around 20:09:02 <toresbe> If conditions are excellent sure I'd go 10 km/h over, but that's excusable. 20:09:02 <mikk36> lol 20:09:14 <mikk36> toresbe, by the book, it isn't 20:09:21 <Eddi|zuHause3> i drive like that because if you drove as the limit says, you stall the other traffic 20:09:25 <Smoovious> it isn't excusable... traffic rules are there for a reason 20:09:31 <mikk36> and if you happen to catch a very arrogant police officer, you'll get fined too 20:09:40 <Eddi|zuHause3> and the traffic rules say you should not stall unnecessarily 20:09:48 <toresbe> mikk36: sure. Then I'd pay the fine. 20:09:54 <toresbe> Eddi|zuHause3: exactly 20:10:02 <mikk36> because it isn't very high, right ? 20:10:10 <toresbe> mikk36: it's extraordinarily high. 20:10:17 <toresbe> Something like 600 dollars. 20:10:26 <mikk36> 0 for +10 ? 20:10:28 <toresbe> that's where it *starts*. 20:10:32 <toresbe> no, +15 20:10:36 <mikk36> o.O 20:10:40 <Smoovious> 600 dollars... as punishments go, that's slap-on-the-wrist territory 20:10:42 <toresbe> +10 in inexcusable conditions 20:11:01 <toresbe> +10 on a dry interstate is no problem 20:11:09 <toresbe> but this is way way besides the point 20:11:09 * mikk36 thinks he's lucky that he lives in estonia 20:11:17 <mikk36> toresbe, where to do you live ? 20:11:24 <toresbe> Norway. 20:11:43 <mikk36> uhm, ok :P 20:11:45 <toresbe> My point is that trusting someone not do do something usually works a damn sight better than threatening him/her not to. 20:11:56 <Smoovious> yeah, my thoughts too, mikk36 20:12:03 <Eddi|zuHause3> the worst i got fined was for +41km/h, 100EUR, 4 points (which accumulate, if you get too many (like 18 or so), you loose your license, they get invalidated after 2 years of no other occurences) and 1 month temporary loss of license 20:12:17 <toresbe> Eddi|zuHause3: Let me guess, you're in Germany? :) 20:12:22 <mikk36> here i had to pay ~150 for speeding +39 (just a small acceleration for 300 meters) 20:12:23 <Smoovious> toresbe... you're so clueless... 20:12:25 <Eddi|zuHause3> yeah ;) 20:12:46 <peter1138> now that statement is laughable 20:13:06 <Smoovious> I find my stuff gets solen a lot less when I threaten to kick t heir ass if they touch anything, than if I say nothing and just trust they won't 20:13:17 <peter1138> hmm, i did 36 in a 30 and attended a 'training course' for 2 hours 20:13:22 <peter1138> it was that or have 3 points... 20:13:29 <Smoovious> solen=stolen 20:13:38 <toresbe> Smoovious: Yeah, but that's stupid. That's not a trust relationship as one would have with ones child, or pupil 20:13:41 <peter1138> (35 in a 30 and you won't get stopped) 20:14:01 <Eddi|zuHause3> peter1138: is that miles per hour? 20:14:05 <peter1138> yes 20:14:07 <Smoovious> a child, isn't capable of that level of thought and reason yet... 20:14:09 <mikk36> well, here i can drive +20 in city usually without any actions 20:14:19 <toresbe> Smoovious: That's really wrong. 20:14:22 <mikk36> and in the evenings i usually go +30 20:14:23 <Smoovious> trusting in a child's ability to reason, is rediculous 20:14:46 <toresbe> Smoovious: Trusting in a child's ability to understand that you trust him or her works perfectly fine. 20:14:49 <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause3: police guidelines in the uk are speedlimit + 10% + 3mph 20:15:03 <mikk36> that +3mph is variable here 20:15:07 <mikk36> it depends on the radar gun 20:15:08 <Smoovious> toresbe... it is sounding more and more that you're exactly the kind of parent being talked about in that bash.org post, and in my subsequent comments... 20:15:16 <peter1138> (i.e. you can do 79 mph in a 70) 20:15:23 <Eddi|zuHause3> mikk36: no, radar gun tolerance is extra 20:15:24 <mikk36> from +-4kph to +-7kph 20:15:26 <toresbe> Smoovious: Eh, the kids I look after act great. 20:15:33 <Prof_Frink> It depends on the wanker setting up th Gatso 20:15:35 <Smoovious> take t he blinders off 20:15:48 <Smoovious> 'look after'... not yours? 20:15:51 <Prof_Frink> mikk36: You can be done for doing 7kph below the speed limit?? 20:15:54 <Eddi|zuHause3> radar gun tolerance automatically gets deducted from the value they charge you for 20:16:01 <mikk36> no 20:16:02 <toresbe> Smoovious: I'm not going to have children until I'm a bit more economically sturdy. 20:16:13 <toresbe> Smoovious: Note that I'm not saying you should never punish children, I'm saying you shouldn't punish them physically, eg. hitting them or such. 20:16:15 <mikk36> Prof_Frink, it's always for your side 20:16:32 <mikk36> that +- is the error-amount 20:16:38 <Smoovious> not yours then... no wonder y ou think the way you do, someone else is doinig all of the d isciplining... come back and have this convo again when yo u have your own kids 5yrs and older 20:17:11 <mikk36> so if the radar gun showed 100kph, you could be driving only 93, and you'll be registered for driving 93kph 20:17:25 <Smoovious> dont g et me wrong... I'm not talking about hitting them... (hitting to me is fist-contact)... accepted discipline methods are what I'm talking about 20:17:36 <stillunknown> My parents never physically hurt as far as i can remember. 20:17:42 <Smoovious> mine neither 20:17:50 <mikk36> you could have been driving also 100, and still get registered for driving 9 20:17:51 <mikk36> 93* 20:17:51 <toresbe> Smoovious: Accepted in certainly morally retarded countries, yeah :) 20:18:14 <Smoovious> the spankings, paddlings, and beltings, were all about being painful... there was nothing about them that hurt 20:18:29 <toresbe> that kind of thing would *never* fly here in Europe. 20:18:37 <toresbe> It's child abuse. Period. 20:18:48 <Smoovious> morally retarded... please... the Norwegians I've met put my parent's discipline practices to shame... 20:18:57 <Eddi|zuHause3> err... what's the difference between "pain" and "hurt" in your eyes? 20:19:04 <mikk36> you could also drive at 107kph, and it could still show 100, and you'll get registered for driving @ 93 20:19:15 <Smoovious> pain is the feeling... hurt, is damage 20:19:38 <toresbe> Smoovious: Are you talking about Minnesotans now, or? 20:19:52 <mikk36> understand now, Prof_Frink ? 20:19:57 <peter1138> Prof_Frink: yeah, that's the guidelines though :) 20:20:02 <Eddi|zuHause3> still does not make a difference for me, Smoovious 20:20:15 <Smoovious> Minnesotans and Norwegians don't look at all alike... 20:20:21 *** Thomas[NL] [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:20:27 <Smoovious> Eddi|zuHause3... t h ere is a d ifference tho 20:20:27 <toresbe> Smoovious: Don't say that around one of them. 20:20:45 <Smoovious> toresbe I say what I please around anyone 20:20:58 <toresbe> Smoovious: I recommend a sense of humour. 20:21:16 <Smoovious> I have a sense of humor... you're just not funny... 20:21:32 <toresbe> Not at all. 20:21:39 <Smoovious> btw, I'm done with this... 20:21:56 <toresbe> I'm a bit oversensitive about the "it's ok to punch him a *little*" arguments. I've lived in orphanages. 20:22:12 <Smoovious> you'll get a big awakening when you have your own kids... until then, you really have nothing to say about what does and doesn't work... you're not qualified... 20:22:33 <Smoovious> I have never, ever, said, that i t is ok to punch him... 20:22:36 <Smoovious> it isn't ok 20:22:52 <toresbe> Oh, no, punching is different from spanking, of course. 20:23:00 <Smoovious> then why bring it up? 20:23:05 <toresbe> I was being sarcastic. 20:23:22 <Smoovious> you can't have a serious discussion about it, can you? 20:23:23 <peter1138> smacking just stings. punching really hurts 20:23:26 <toresbe> It's all physical punishment. A parent shouldn't hurt his child. 20:23:27 * Smoovious sighs. 20:23:29 <Smoovious> I'm done. 20:23:48 <Smoovious> I agree... a parent shouldn't 'hurt' their chilid... discipline, isn't 'hurt' 20:24:06 <toresbe> Yes it is. 20:24:10 <Smoovious> nope 20:24:15 <toresbe> is too. 20:24:22 * toresbe likes this discussion 20:24:25 <Smoovious> oh grow up already 20:24:27 <mikk36> there are different disciplinary methots 20:24:37 <Smoovious> what are you... nine? 20:24:40 <mikk36> and i prefer to call physical punishment one of them 20:24:44 <Smoovious> I'm done... 20:27:28 <peter1138> o superman 20:29:12 <Eddi|zuHause3> i was telling you this discussion went nowhere half an hour ago :p 20:30:00 *** NukeBuster [~opera@195-241-212-152.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has joined #openttd 20:30:12 <Smoovious> yeah, but there was nothing else being talked about at the time 20:30:38 <Eddi|zuHause3> and now there is? 20:31:19 <Smoovious> doesn't appear to be... I got nothing to add to peter1138's superman comment 20:31:52 <kaan> wow, i go away for one minute and then you start talking like madmen 20:31:56 <peter1138> laurie anderson :D 20:32:06 <Smoovious> who's that? 20:32:40 <kaan> oh, i beleive toresbe is right about the subject of children and physical pubushment 20:32:53 <kaan> *punishment 20:34:02 <peter1138> Smoovious: musician 20:34:40 <Smoovious> oh really? I'm a musician-type... :) what does she do? 20:35:02 <peter1138> :o 20:35:17 <peter1138> 'experimental' stuff 20:35:22 <peter1138> like, er, 'o superman' 20:35:27 <peter1138> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laurie_Anderson 20:35:52 <Smoovious> might be worth checking out 20:37:32 <Bjarni> <kaan> wow, i go away for one minute and then you start talking like madmen <--- the channel tries to adapt to your level... or something 20:38:38 <kaan> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yKjZFmhg5yk 20:38:44 <kaan> here is a madman for you 20:39:32 <peter1138> Smoovious: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hhm0NHhCBg# 20:39:50 <Smoovious> thnx peter1138, but already downloading... :) 20:39:53 <peter1138> not exactly exciting video stuff ;p 20:40:30 <peter1138> bah, youtube lags for me 20:40:35 <peter1138> i think my firefox is fucked in the head :/ 20:40:38 <Smoovious> not d oing youtube 20:40:58 <peter1138> no, i was just making a general complaint :) 20:41:03 * Smoovious nods. 20:44:56 <kaan> I really like the part where erik spandmand gives a speach about the dangers of beer right after taking a bottle full of canabis smoke :) 20:45:27 * Prof_Frink konquers peter1138 20:47:01 <Smoovious> a bottle full? 20:47:11 <Smoovious> its called a 'bong' 20:47:30 <kaan> not when you smoke like erik 20:48:11 <kaan> he takes a bottle without a buttom and a bucket of water 20:48:13 <Smoovious> uh huh 20:49:28 <mikk36> kaan, and what age are you ? 20:49:46 * Smoovious grins. 20:49:49 <kaan> 32, why? 20:50:05 <mikk36> just to get a real understanding of your comments 20:50:33 <mikk36> i'd take them differently if you'd say that you're 10 20:50:58 <kaan> well im danish, that would influence my english quite a bit 20:51:21 <mikk36> i'm not talking about the spelling 20:51:36 <mikk36> i mean the idea behind the writing 20:51:39 <Smoovious> <kaan> he takes a bottle without a buttom and a bucket of water <--- was there more to that? felt left hanging waiting for the rest 20:51:45 <kaan> im also refering to the words i choose and my (lack) of grammatics 20:51:58 <mikk36> well, i'm used to bad english 20:52:10 <kaan> Smoovious: look at the video, its explains it quite well ;) 20:52:12 <mikk36> because few people take proper english into account 20:52:37 <Smoovious> can you just tell me? I'm not motivated to go back and forth between computers making sure I typed the URL right 20:52:46 <kaan> oh 20:53:21 <kaan> well imagine that you put the bottle in the water untill only the part you normally drink from is over water 20:53:57 <kaan> then you put your pipe int the opening and light it while pulling the bottle slowly from the water 20:54:20 <kaan> this makes the bottle suck air into the bottle through the lit pipe 20:54:30 *** PinguTux [~PinguTux@pD9E9D6BF.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 20:54:33 <Smoovious> ... 20:54:45 <kaan> when at the top you remove the pipe and put you mouth there and lower the bottle fast 20:54:58 <kaan> its quite a sight :) 20:54:59 *** PinguTux [~PinguTux@pD9E9D6BF.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [] 20:55:15 <Smoovious> quite a joke too... 20:55:26 <Smoovious> no self-respecting smoker would waste the smoke like that... 20:55:39 <kaan> and the guy in the movie is also quite a dopehead 20:55:40 <Smoovious> and btw... that, although very badly done, is a bong 20:56:18 *** PinguTux [~PinguTux@pD9E9D6BF.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 20:56:29 <kaan> erik spandmand is using this method because his lungs cant smoke the normal way anymore ;) 20:56:31 <Eddi|zuHause3> you must know it :p 20:56:42 *** PinguTux [~PinguTux@pD9E9D6BF.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:56:44 <Smoovious> he probably only did that for the clip... no way he actually smokes like that regularly 20:56:51 <kaan> sure 20:57:05 <kaan> look at the black edge on the bucket 20:57:12 <kaan> in the water 20:57:15 <Smoovious> ahh... that would make sense... but there are still much better ways to do it 20:57:16 *** PinguTux [~PinguTux@pD9E9D6BF.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 20:57:22 <kaan> is leftovers from the smoke 20:57:31 <Smoovious> that's called resin 20:58:53 <mikk36> sad that i don't understand anything from that eriks speech 20:59:25 <Smoovious> someone should send erik a positve-pressure pipe... 20:59:29 <kaan> i can sum it up for you, hes praising the weed and cursing the cops 20:59:40 <mikk36> lol 20:59:46 *** PinguTux [~PinguTux@pD9E9D6BF.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [] 20:59:51 *** PinguTux [~PinguTux@pD9E9D6BF.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 21:00:50 <Smoovious> brb 21:01:03 *** Thomas[NL] [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 21:02:27 *** Ammller [~Ammler@adsl-193-46-fixip.tiscali.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:07:20 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A465D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 21:08:49 *** McHawk [~hawk@p5489CB0D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 21:10:59 *** Ammller [~Ammler@adsl-62-167-45-121.adslplus.ch] has joined #openttd 21:11:54 <Smoovious> ib 21:13:58 *** PinguTux [~PinguTux@pD9E9D6BF.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:14:39 <Kosma> stillunknown: svn merge is the correct way to reverse a commit 21:15:09 <Kosma> like, if you want to rever changes made between revisions 10 and 20, it would be svn merge -r 20:10 21:15:52 <Kosma> since it preserves pretty much everything like properties and new/deleted files 21:15:56 <mikk36> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dg-qkFqDxBs 21:16:48 <mikk36> sry, Eddi|zuHause3, if i create another non-ottd topic :P 21:17:01 <Eddi|zuHause3> :p 21:17:35 *** PinguTux [~PinguTux@pD9E9D2E7.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 21:23:36 <kaan> really bad loser there 21:27:57 *** Purno [~Purno@5357D37C.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Quit: Life is a game of pick-up-sticks, played by fucking lunatics.] 21:28:59 <Smoovious> yeah... too full of himself... 21:29:44 *** lolman [~john@cpc3-leds2-0-0-cust55.leed.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:29:51 <Smoovious> bad choice of song for his 'Mr. Love' name too 21:30:24 <Smoovious> welp... he did say before it, he was doing it for the publicity... sounds like he got it. :) 21:30:43 *** raimar2 [~hawk@p5489EF0E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 21:30:50 *** lolman [~john@cpc3-leds2-0-0-cust55.leed.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd 21:31:44 *** Barry [~chatzilla@84-245-3-240.dsl.cambrium.nl] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 1.5.0.10/2007021601]] 21:32:00 <mikk36> also, wasn't he from the US either ? 21:32:13 <mikk36> talking about his target "america" or smth 21:34:16 <Smoovious> he was from Canadaa 21:34:28 <mikk36> doesn't mean he lived there 21:34:32 <Smoovious> tho he did say he performed in the US... 21:34:49 <Smoovious> but I don't see him being big in the US either... 21:35:11 <Wolf01> 'night 21:35:11 <mikk36> peter1138, did you own w810i ? 21:35:17 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host161-229-dynamic.5-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 21:35:21 <peter1138> did i what? 21:35:33 <mikk36> sonyericsson w810i 21:35:36 <peter1138> ]oh 21:35:37 <Smoovious> or why wouldn't he have tried American Idol if that was his target? We don't see the german version very much over here 21:35:41 <peter1138> no i didn't own a w810i 21:35:45 <mikk36> ok 21:36:41 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@dD576B7C2.access.telenet.be] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:37:33 <colle> mikk36: I used to have one of those, anything you're wondering about it? 21:37:49 <mikk36> not particularily 21:37:52 *** McHawk [~hawk@p5489CB0D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:38:07 <mikk36> just that someone commented here that he couldn't get mini opera to work 21:38:20 <mikk36> though on mine, 3.1 works fine 21:39:13 <colle> ok, I guess you could try to update the software in the non-working phone 21:39:19 <mikk36> 4 beta, though, couldn't get connected 21:39:55 <kaan> night all 21:39:55 <mikk36> i have the latest version on my phone 21:39:59 *** kaan [~Klaus@82.192.152.195] has left #openttd [] 21:40:08 *** PinguTux [~PinguTux@pD9E9D2E7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: PinguTux] 21:41:32 <colle> check if you have the same firmware version then 21:41:48 <mikk36> i have no problem 21:41:59 <mikk36> 3.1 works fine 21:42:04 <colle> ok 21:42:08 <mikk36> which is the latest "release" 21:42:46 <colle> don't know, the forums on www.esato.com lists the versions though 21:43:00 <colle> check there 21:43:16 <mikk36> latest versions of what ? 21:43:34 <colle> the firmware for SE's phones 21:43:42 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1C6CD.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 21:43:48 <colle> firmwares 21:44:22 <Smoovious> hmm... almost on-topic... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-54gBLwK3s&feature=dir 21:46:42 *** TinoM [~Tino@i5387CD34.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 21:47:55 <mikk36> 400kph, nice :) 21:50:57 <Smoovious> I gotta take a ride on that one of these days 21:51:42 <Smoovious> wonder how fast they could have got going if they didn't have to slow down for the stop 21:52:00 <mikk36> well, it stopped acceleration on 431kph 21:52:08 <Smoovious> ya 21:52:15 <mikk36> so it's safety-limited there 21:52:20 <Smoovious> ~270mph... :) 21:52:31 <mikk36> i calculate in kph :) 21:52:48 * Smoovious grins. 21:53:05 *** lolman [~john@cpc3-leds2-0-0-cust55.leed.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:53:07 *** Thomas[NL] [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:53:09 <Smoovious> well, I can't relate to kph as I'm always dealing with mph... 21:53:44 <Prof_Frink> Smoovious: I liked the comment: Faster than a Bugatti Veyron for 21:53:56 <Smoovious> I drove 90mph average on a trip to texas a long time ago... I thought that was crazy-fast at the time, on highways... (limit was 55 at the time) 21:54:04 * Smoovious grins. 21:54:07 <Smoovious> yeah, good comment 21:54:36 <mikk36> what's ? 21:54:40 <Smoovious> then I figure that 90mph... and I was only doing a third of that maglev? crazy... 21:54:44 <Prof_Frink> Smoovious: Drive that slow on the M6Toll and people'll be stuck behind you 21:54:48 <Smoovious> it is a measure of currency 21:54:49 <Prof_Frink> mikk36: £4 21:55:03 <mikk36> 8 dollars ? 21:55:13 <Smoovious> Prof_Frink... well, I wasn't in a performance car either 21:55:28 <Prof_Frink> A punto's hardly performance ;) 21:55:35 <mikk36> lol 21:55:42 <mikk36> hmm 21:55:46 <Eddi|zuHause3> 90mph? that is only like 150km/h 21:55:48 <mikk36> 90mph aint really fost 21:56:00 <mikk36> fast* 21:56:08 <mikk36> rather like 140 21:56:25 <Eddi|zuHause3> well, 100mph == 160km/h 21:56:36 <Smoovious> the radar detector worked SOOO well going through Arkansas... at home, I can expect 0.5-1.0 mile warning of a speed trap... but Arkansas is so flat... 10minutes after it started going off, I was still looking for the trap, and we hadn't passed it yet 21:56:36 <mikk36> 90*1.609 = 144,81 21:57:46 <mikk36> the usual speed if i'm in a hurry on a highway 21:58:06 <Eddi|zuHause3> radar detectors?? those are very illegal here 21:58:06 <mikk36> if not, then i drive @ 120kph 21:58:23 <mikk36> they're illegal everywhere 21:58:29 <Smoovious> speed limits are set by the states here... most are back up to 70mph... federals withhold money from states going above that tho, and one state said 'fine, keep it' and set theirs higher... a few years, they didn't have a highway limit, but I think they do now, of ~80 21:58:37 <Eddi|zuHause3> i usually go ~160km/h when unlimited 21:58:41 <Prof_Frink> They ain't illegal in .uk 21:58:47 <mikk36> o.O 21:58:49 <Smoovious> Eddi|zuHause3... depending on which state you're in, they're illegal here too 21:58:49 <mikk36> too bad 21:59:52 <Eddi|zuHause3> usual limit around europe is 130km/h 22:00:14 <Eddi|zuHause3> in germany, that is "recommended speed" in the unlimited sections 22:00:25 <Smoovious> store|food run, back ~20min 22:00:45 <Eddi|zuHause3> although you might find some insurances not paying if you have an accident when driving faster than that 22:02:58 <Smoovious> I'd like to see min/max speeds by lane-position... 22:03:00 *** Ammller [~Ammler@adsl-62-167-45-121.adslplus.ch] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:03:29 <Prof_Frink> Smoovious: But then, you'd have everyone in the fast lane even more 22:03:30 *** Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-62-167-45-121.adslplus.ch] has joined #openttd 22:03:46 <Smoovious> being tailgated in the slow lane, or having to hit my brakes in the fast lane and end up being passed by both slow lanes as a result, irks me 22:03:54 <Smoovious> you'd think 22:04:08 <Prof_Frink> What annoys me is: 22:04:17 <Prof_Frink> Empty motorway, doing about 80 22:04:25 <Prof_Frink> in the slow lane 22:04:28 <Prof_Frink> one person 22:04:32 <Prof_Frink> doing 65 22:04:40 <Smoovious> having established limits per lane would allow the police to ticket people in the wrong lane more 22:04:43 <Prof_Frink> in the middle fscking lane! 22:05:51 <Eddi|zuHause3> <Smoovious> I'd like to see min/max speeds by lane-position... <- they have that in certain locations (usually uphill) 22:05:55 <Eddi|zuHause3> but not generally 22:06:10 <Smoovious> and it doesn't have to be drastic... slow->fast = right->left... people in the right lane have max/min limits of 70/55... center lane 80/65... left lane 90/75... 22:07:10 <Eddi|zuHause3> there's a pretty long steep downhill section on the A3 (southbound towards Frankfurt, Main), which has max 40km/h on the right lane, and max 100km/h on the middle and left lanes 22:07:13 <Prof_Frink> Smoovious: And then, on an empty motorway, there's be someone driving at 75 in the fast lane and a massive queue behind them 22:07:27 <Eddi|zuHause3> and they have two stationary radar stations there, so people actually stick to the limits 22:07:39 <Smoovious> how could s omeone on an empty motorway have a massive queue behind him? 22:08:01 <Prof_Frink> Because everyone's in the fast lane so they can drive at 75 22:08:06 <Prof_Frink> (or more) 22:08:10 <Smoovious> but... its empty... 22:08:16 <Prof_Frink> exactly 22:08:23 <Smoovious> so, no queue 22:08:24 *** e1ko [~L@205.117.broadband9.iol.cz] has joined #openttd 22:08:33 <Prof_Frink> undertaking is far more illegal than speeding 22:08:35 <Eddi|zuHause3> err... it's mandatory to drive as right as possible, if you are not overtaking someone 22:09:11 <Prof_Frink> Eddi|zuHause3: So, with this system, an empty motorway (not overtaking) would have a lower speed limit than a congested one? 22:09:13 <Smoovious> if someone was doing 75 in the fast lane, according to my earlier comment, it'd be illegal 22:09:13 <Biff> Eddi|zuHause3: thats the only sane rule 22:09:16 <Smoovious> er 22:09:17 <Smoovious> legaL 22:09:23 *** e1ko [~L@205.117.broadband9.iol.cz] has quit [] 22:09:32 <Smoovious> you could pass em in the right lane 22:09:41 <Biff> i dont understand how the americans can do without that rule 22:10:04 <Eddi|zuHause3> Prof_Frink: no, if there are differen speed limits, the lanes are counted like several roads, which also implies you can drive faster on the right lane than on the left lane 22:10:45 <Eddi|zuHause3> (if the limits allow it, of course) 22:10:53 <Prof_Frink> Basically, it comes down to being a nice idea, if it wasn't for one thing: people. 22:10:56 <Smoovious> for 2-lane-in-one-direction, you're supposed to stay right, and left is suppoed to be used for overtaking... for 3-lane-in-one-direction-or-more, lane choice isn't that restrictive... tho trucks usually can't use the far left lane 22:11:04 <Smoovious> except for exiting on t he left 22:11:38 <Prof_Frink> Now, laws to stop lorries overtaking on the M26, I'm all in favour of 22:11:45 <Eddi|zuHause3> like on the previously mentioned 100/40 km/h section, you cannot overtake anyone at 40km/h when the left lane has a minimum speed of 60km/h (standard in germany) 22:12:04 <peter1138> Prof_Frink: undertaking is a "do not", not a "must not" in the highway code... 22:12:38 <Biff> what do you mean by undertaking? 22:12:45 <Prof_Frink> OVertaking on the left 22:12:45 <Biff> passing someone on the wrong side? 22:12:46 <peter1138> i.e. you'd get done for dangerous driving or something, rather than "overtaking on the wrong side" 22:13:35 <Smoovious> undertaking is frowned upon, but the police are forgiving of it... t hey're more after the people who are undertaking while speeding... if you are undertaking cuz some idiot in front of you is g oing too slow, while you're otherwise legal, it is the idiot t hey'll deal with 22:13:44 <Biff> that is something you must often do here, because a lot of people stay in the left lane, without lookning in the mirrors 22:13:59 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has quit [Quit: Solong, and thanks for all the fish.] 22:15:15 <Eddi|zuHause3> only that in britain, "undertaking" would be on the left side, not the right side :) 22:15:34 <Biff> obviously 22:15:36 <Smoovious> yeah, well, you guys drive on the wrong side anyways 22:15:45 <Smoovious> we drive o n the right side 22:15:57 <Eddi|zuHause3> i'm not in britain 22:16:08 <Biff> seems to be better with rhd tho 22:16:10 <Eddi|zuHause3> i have never driven in britain either 22:16:18 <Biff> so you can always keep your right arm on the wheel 22:16:35 <Eddi|zuHause3> i find i can steer better with my left arm... 22:16:44 <Smoovious> so do I 22:17:08 <Smoovious> my left arm always is steering... the right arm, that I favor, has to do everything else in the car except turn signal 22:17:30 <Smoovious> better to do it quick, than fumble around with the lesser arm 22:17:38 <Eddi|zuHause3> although i sometimes find myself in a little left-handed behaviour 22:17:51 <Smoovious> on that note, brb 22:18:49 *** skidd14 [~skidd13@p548A541D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 22:19:30 <skidd14> If I try to remove an opponets road. I get an assertion. Can someone copy this in latest trunk too? 22:20:09 <Eddi|zuHause3> 14? you got promoted or something? ;p 22:20:34 <skidd14> nope.. Damned IRC 22:20:40 <peter1138> nini 22:21:00 *** skidd14 is now known as Skidd14 22:21:32 *** Skidd14 is now known as Skidd13_real 22:22:01 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A465D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:22:07 *** KritiK [Maxim@ppp85-140-205-147.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:22:19 *** Skidd13_real is now known as skidd13 22:22:51 *** mikk36 [~mikk36@pc90.host7.starman.ee] has quit [Quit: The pedestrian had no idea which way to run, so I ran over him.] 22:23:05 *** raimar3 [~hawk@p5489CBC3.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 22:23:15 <Eddi|zuHause3> i like how the language compilation is not interrupted by those stupid warnings anymore :) 22:26:56 <skidd13> I only get the assertion If I remove the hs.dat and start openttd with "~/bin/openttd/openttd -c ~/bin/openttd/openttd.cfg -b 8bpp-optimized -s null -m null -v sdl" else everything works fine 22:27:43 <Eddi|zuHause3> what is hs.dat? 22:28:29 <caladan> highscore 22:28:49 <Eddi|zuHause3> oh, that explains why i do not have one :) 22:29:05 <glx> it's created on first run 22:29:06 <caladan> hehe 22:29:41 <caladan> quess it tries to write that file in place where you have no permission? 22:30:21 *** raimar2 [~hawk@p5489EF0E.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:30:22 <skidd13> "src/player.h:241: Player* GetPlayer(PlayerID): Assertion `( (uint)((i) - (PLAYER_FIRST)) < ((uint)((sizeof(_players)/sizeof(_players[0])))) )' failed." 22:30:54 *** KritiK [Maxim@ppp85-140-204-36.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #openttd 22:30:56 <glx> do you have a backtrace? 22:31:28 <skidd13> backtrace? What do you need? 22:31:54 <glx> we need to know what calles GetPlayer 22:32:04 *** elmex [~elmex@e180064206.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:32:11 <glx> and what is the passed value 22:32:24 <skidd13> As I said I tried to remove an opponents road. 22:32:27 *** UnderBuilder [~chatzilla@168.226.106.208] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.4/2007051502]] 22:32:29 <Eddi|zuHause3> i can reproduce it... 22:32:52 <Eddi|zuHause3> without extra options 22:34:14 <glx> ok got it :) 22:34:22 <Eddi|zuHause3> <glx> it's created on first run <- i think rather first time a highscore is reached 22:34:54 <Eddi|zuHause3> which i never did in my history of openttd :) 22:35:39 <glx> no, when I first run win32 or win9x builds (testing the installer) I have an hs.dat in the dir 22:35:56 <Eddi|zuHause3> hm... 22:36:23 <skidd13> On linux same behavior. 22:36:33 <Eddi|zuHause3> hm, yes, now i see it, too... 22:39:34 <Eddi|zuHause3> i have a backtrace, if you want... 22:39:45 <Eddi|zuHause3> looks like string handling with the error message 22:40:13 <glx> I have a backtrace too :) 22:40:23 <skidd13> I've to get up early tomorrow. Good night... 22:40:35 <glx> let's start gdb and follow the values :) 22:41:00 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A541D.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #openttd [] 22:42:08 <Eddi|zuHause3> english.txt:287:STR_013B_OWNED_BY :{WHITE}...owned by {STRING2} 22:42:12 <Eddi|zuHause3> maybe? 22:42:24 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1C6CD.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:42:29 <Eddi|zuHause3> should possibly be {COMPANY} there 22:42:47 <glx> hmm i = 45356 22:43:14 <glx> it seems int64->int32 cast failed 22:46:31 <glx> hmm or an incorrect SetDParam 22:49:51 *** thgergo [~th_gergo@dsl51B7A140.pool.t-online.hu] has quit [] 22:52:43 <Eddi|zuHause3> hm... english.txt:158:STR_00B3_MESSAGE_FROM :{YELLOW}Message from {COMPANY} 22:52:48 <Eddi|zuHause3> this seems to be the string used 22:52:51 <glx> yes 22:53:42 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat1.spoje.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:58:47 <Eddi|zuHause3> hm... this exceeds my knowledge of the inner workings of openttd... 23:00:26 <Eddi|zuHause3> but it's probably a forgotten conversion from the introduction of {COMPANY} 23:11:56 *** raimar2 [~hawk@p5489CA3D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 23:15:04 *** mikk36 [~mikk36@pc90.host7.starman.ee] has joined #openttd 23:15:33 <NukeBuster> -Fix (r10323): 'message from company' text used {STRING1} instead of {COMPANY}\ 23:16:11 <NukeBuster> r10403 23:18:57 *** raimar3 [~hawk@p5489CBC3.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:35:22 *** Nickman^Away [~nn@d54C1C327.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: ( www.nnscript.de :: NoNameScript 4.02 :: www.XLhost.de )] 23:36:34 <Smoovious> would it be a big deal to lighten the amount of transparency-shadow with transparent buildings? you get a few tall buildings overlapping, and it gets so dark you can barely see what's behind em 23:39:45 <Eddi|zuHause3> i believe transparency is kind of a palette hack, difficult to change in 8bpp 23:39:48 <Belugas> not currently, Smoovious. 23:39:55 <Belugas> indeed, Eddi|zuHause3 23:40:55 <Smoovious> hmm... 23:43:50 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 23:44:18 *** KritiK [Maxim@ppp85-140-204-36.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:50:31 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB61EF.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Osai] 23:54:58 *** setrodox [~setrodox@85-124-46-19.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has quit [Quit: Hapiness ;D]