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00:00:22 *** mikl [~mikl@0304ds2-ba.0.fullrate.dk] has quit [Quit: Connection reset by Peer Gynt] 00:07:35 <Sacro> michi_cc: i thought that said n64.zip there :( 00:14:48 <fjb> michi_cc: I still have a case where a train locked itself in a station with v.4.2. The train doesn't find a free path path out of the station. After some time waiting it decides to reverse. But it forgets to clear the reserved part of the platform behind it (because it didn't leave that paltform). Not it has the reserved platform tiles in front of it and is locked. 00:17:18 <fjb> Here is a picture showing it: http://www.myimg.de/?img=ExpressGmbH2Nov194959df4.png 00:20:13 <Gonozal_VIII> trains should check if there's a path behind them before reversing... 00:25:58 <fjb> Yes, that would help. The problem here is that the platform doesn't get released tile by tile, it gets released as a whole when the train left the platform. But it never leaves it. 00:26:35 <Gonozal_VIII> no path, no reversing, no problem :-) 00:27:43 <fjb> Cleaning up reserved path is not bugfree yet. That should be fixed. 00:41:53 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1CB09.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:42:10 *** UFO64 [~UFO64@brodeurmb2.umeres.maine.edu] has joined #openttd 00:42:51 <Eddi|zuHause3> <Gonozal_VIII> no path, no reversing, no problem :-) <- you are missing the problem 00:43:26 <Gonozal_VIII> i know the problem... station is always one piece 00:43:26 <Eddi|zuHause3> the train does not find a path because it hits its previously reserved, now invalid, path 00:44:26 <ln-> ah, 91.8% of 4x03 00:45:08 <Eddi|zuHause3> ln-: why are you always 3 days late? 00:47:31 <ln-> this time joox.net didn't provide the thing at all. the previous times i only remembered a bit late. 00:50:23 *** Jortuny [~octernion@r253186120.resnet.cornell.edu] has joined #openttd 00:53:14 <ln-> had to get it from torrent this time, never before have i needed to revert to such complicated methods. 00:53:39 <Gonozal_VIII> since when is a torrent complicated? 00:55:03 <ln-> it's more complicated than saving a file to disk through firefox. 00:55:17 <Gonozal_VIII> hmm no 00:55:29 <glx> it's easy with µtorrent 00:55:33 <Gonozal_VIII> yep 00:55:58 <Gonozal_VIII> open the .torrent file, wait until finished... nothing more 00:57:08 <ln-> the "wait until finished" part is also complicated, as it takes many hours. 00:57:22 <Gonozal_VIII> many hours? 00:57:31 <ln-> many hours. 00:57:32 <Gonozal_VIII> how big exactly are those episodes? 00:57:33 <glx> depends on file size and source count 00:57:44 *** UFO64-alt [~UFO64@brodeurmb2.umeres.maine.edu] has joined #openttd 00:57:44 <ln-> this one was like 120MB. 00:57:48 <Gonozal_VIII> i usually download 350mb episodes 00:57:50 <glx> and you need to open ports 00:57:53 <Gonozal_VIII> takes about 20 minutes 00:58:24 <ln-> and i don't really have open ports. 00:58:46 <glx> torrent without at least an open port is slow 00:58:53 <glx> it can even not finish 00:58:58 <ln-> i usually download 350mb episodes through http, and it takes ~10 mins. 00:59:16 <Gonozal_VIII> would be faster but i only have 3mbit 00:59:42 <ln-> glx: i've noticed that.. actually i'm surprised i was actually able to get the file tonight and not next week. 01:00:42 <glx> @op 01:00:45 *** mode/#openttd [+o glx] by DorpsGek 01:01:00 *** glx changed the topic of #openttd to: 0.5.3, 0.6.0-beta4 | Website: *.openttd.org (DevBlog: blog, Translator: translator2, Gameservers: servers, Nightly-builds: nightly, NightlyArchive: archive, WIKI: wiki, SVN mailinglist: maillist, Dev-docs: docs, Patches & Bug-reports: bugs) | #openttd.notice for FS + SVN notices | UTF-8 is mandatory 01:01:05 <glx> @deop 01:01:08 *** mode/#openttd [-o glx] by DorpsGek 01:04:08 *** UFO64 [~UFO64@brodeurmb2.umeres.maine.edu] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 01:10:37 <fjb> Hm, will YAPP become stable before 0.6.0? 01:10:59 <Gonozal_VIII> what has the one to do with the other? 01:11:06 <Belugas> even if he is, he's not going ot be in 0.6 01:12:37 <fjb> It needs more testing? 01:13:00 <Gonozal_VIII> no big stuff gets in right before a release 01:13:18 * Sacro sniggers 01:13:37 <Gonozal_VIII> hmmm? 01:16:05 <fjb> THE ECS coal mines are stupid, one train arriving late and the output drops from 500 tons to 30 in no time. But it needs ages (and a statue) to get back up near that level again. 01:16:57 *** Wezz6400 [~Wezz6400@145-118-108-75.fttx.bbned.nl] has quit [Quit: Zzz] 01:17:02 <Gonozal_VIII> they are designed for patch, high transported% is easier to reach there 01:18:06 <ln-> what's the opposite of a flashback? 01:18:23 <Sacro> darkforward? 01:18:30 <Gonozal_VIII> a vision? 01:18:36 <fjb> Not disigned only for the patch. He smooth output change is only working in OpenTTD yet. 01:21:13 *** Frostregen [SADDAM@dslb-084-058-108-226.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: und weg] 01:24:31 *** Frostregen [SADDAM@dslb-084-058-108-226.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 01:28:28 <DaleStan> So, designed for Patch, where the things that cause breakage don't happen. 01:28:37 <DaleStan> :p 01:29:14 <Gonozal_VIII> and again in english please? 01:30:25 <fjb> No jams in patch? Sounds boring. :-P 01:32:40 *** NukeBuster [~wouter@a62-251-21-79.adsl.xs4all.nl] has quit [Quit: using sirc version 2.211+KSIRC/1.3.12] 01:32:59 *** KritiK [~Maxim@78-106-139-47.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:34:24 <fjb> DaleStan: Are you the main patch develeoper now? 01:35:19 <DaleStan> It seems that way. JGR's good for foisting random "impossible" features on us, though. 01:35:40 <DaleStan> I keep hoping Patchman will come back from wherever he went. 01:35:57 *** Eddi|zuHause2 [~johekr@p54B77A3F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 01:36:41 <fjb> Who is JGR? 01:38:12 <Belugas> another ttdpatch dev 01:38:24 <Belugas> the newest recruit, if i'm not mistaken 01:38:42 * Belugas search "recruit" in his dictionnary 01:38:58 <fjb> I guess some features would cause the rewrite of the whole game. It is harder for a patch to push some limits than for a project like OpenTTD where you have the whole source and can change almost anything. 01:39:21 <Belugas> recruit is fine :) 01:39:36 <SmatZ> :-) 01:39:43 <Belugas> fjb, i would not say that... 01:39:49 <fjb> :-) My English is so bad, I wouldn't notice any difference. 01:39:59 <Belugas> both sides have their difficulties 01:40:35 <Belugas> for sure, it is easier for OTTD to do some massive changes. But it easier for us too to get some pretty nasty bugs 01:40:58 <fjb> Yes, but when you have the source you can just look into it and can change things using a high level language. Ofcourse you have to be backward compatible and things. 01:41:02 <Belugas> ttdp may have bugs too, but somehow, i think they are not as severe as some of ours 01:41:54 * SmatZ hopes there are not any 'severe' bugs in beta4 01:42:05 * Belugas hopes too 01:42:06 *** llugo [~lugo@p4FD5E535.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:42:17 <Belugas> fjb, the sources are immense 01:42:21 *** Eddi|zuHause3 [~johekr@p54B77DC0.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:42:21 <fjb> ttdp has astonishing few bugs, considering that it is heavy assembler hacking in something that you don't have a comented source of. 01:42:21 <Belugas> it is easy to get lost 01:42:42 <DaleStan> Most of ours are easily reproducible and fixable. Like when I confuse "call [esp]" and "call esp" 01:43:11 *** Jortuny [~octernion@r253186120.resnet.cornell.edu] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 01:43:18 <fjb> Yes, it is. But assembler scares my more than C++. And I think even C++ is not the best language to write bugfree code. 01:43:23 <Sacro> grr... null pointers 01:46:00 <Belugas> no language is garanteed to write bugfree code... 01:46:17 <Belugas> helll. some wonderfull bugs i've done in delphi... 01:46:39 * ln- writes 100% bugfree code with C++. 01:46:53 <DaleStan> <fjb> something that you don't have a comented source of. <-- We do have two somewhat-commented "sources"; the DOS and Windows IDA databases. The DOS one is especially good at documenting the calling conventions. 01:47:14 <Gonozal_VIII> i can write hello world bugfree :-) 01:47:24 <fjb> You can have bugs in every project, but some languages help you to make fewer bugs. 01:48:48 <fjb> DaleStan: So the patch hooks into the os calls? 01:50:17 *** lugo [~lugo@p4FD5E6F0.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 01:51:12 <DaleStan> No, the conventions for things like RefreshRectangle, which wants X1,X2,Y1,Y2 in ax,bx,dx,bp. Or the return values for GetLandscapeInfo. (Which fills [e]si, dh, dl and, di from ax and cx, IIRC) 01:52:06 <Sacro> Gonozal_VIII: go on then 01:52:30 <DaleStan> $ hello --license 01:52:31 <fjb> Ah, ok. The os calls are reference points for understanding the code inbetween? 01:52:35 <Gonozal_VIII> i already did 01:52:45 <Gonozal_VIII> i can do it again... 01:52:49 <Gonozal_VIII> hello world bugfree 01:52:53 <Gonozal_VIII> see? :-) 01:53:19 <DaleStan> The conventions of the TTD functions. I think the OS calls are mostly untouched, except that win2k fixes the DirectX calls. 01:53:54 *** Brianetta [~brian@77-103-231-158.cable.ubr05.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 01:54:22 <fjb> Still sounds far more difficult than to look at a huge C++ source. 01:55:47 <Belugas> depnds of your capacity of understanding and abstraction of the concept... 01:56:52 <fjb> Maybe. I have less problems with assembler than with machine code. And I even have less problems with a higher level language than with assembler. 01:57:36 <DaleStan> But some of the games we can play with register conventions get really quite nice. My understanding is that if you have a call stack ten functions deep that all deal with the same vehicle in C or C++, that vehicle pointer will appear on the stack once for each function. In Patch, it won't be on the stack at all; it'll be in ESI instead. 01:58:16 <SmatZ> :-) 01:59:42 <SmatZ> one can create his own internal ABI if he needs so 01:59:43 <fjb> A good compiler will keep the pointer in a register then. 02:02:07 <DaleStan> But you can't declare that type of calling convention (at least with MSVC), and you have to use some convention so you know that the calls in file1.obj will fill the registers properly for the functions in file2.obj. 02:04:59 <fjb> You don't have to declare it. The compiler does it for you, if it is smart. the compiler sees the whole source, if it is devided into files or not. A smart compiler can have it's own custom conventions that work across file borders. 02:05:42 <SmatZ> compiler sees only the file(s) it is compiling 02:06:04 <SmatZ> for each object file, it starts from scratch 02:06:14 <DaleStan> Else, you'd have to recompile all objects because you changed one source file, and that obviously doesn't happen/ 02:06:26 <fjb> That depends on the compiler. 02:07:02 *** llugo [~lugo@p4FD5EA72.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 02:07:21 <SmatZ> maybe you could compile whole OTTD in 1 compile run... 02:08:57 <fjb> Or the compiler could remeber his optimized calling conventions between diffenrent files. 02:09:26 <DaleStan> What happens when file1.obj is compiled, and then file2.cpp is changed so that a different convention is preferable? 02:11:11 <fjb> You get nonoptimal code. But you probably will have some debugging code anyway while you are developing. You can recompile the whole project for a realease and get optimized code. 02:11:54 <DaleStan> And what happens when the compiler can't find file1.obj, because it's called file1.o, or because it's yet to be created by some other tool, like NASM? 02:12:38 *** lugo [~lugo@p4FD5E6F0.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:13:11 <fjb> Then it takes the nonoptimal default convention. For the release all the files have to be there. Else some parts of the program would be missing. 02:15:42 <DaleStan> And what happens when it compiles file1.o and file2.o (with whatever custom convention happens to be best) and then NASM generates file3.o, which assumes some earlier custom convention, and then the linker throws the whole mess together. How does the compiler know that the func1 and func3 are called by assembly code, while func2 is not? 02:16:39 <DaleStan> After all, the compiler doesn't see the assembly code. 02:17:10 <fjb> You have to tell the compiler that a function can not be optimized because it relies on some conventions out of it's scope. 02:17:15 <DaleStan> Only the assembler sees the assembly code, so the compiler can't make decisions based on what it might or might not contain. 02:19:36 <DaleStan> So I have to modify the C header to use the function in assembly? This is a feature? (And you still haven't named this hypothetical compiler that can do this magic within the bounds of the standard makefile, which compiles one file at a time, without giving the compiler any information as to what other files might or might not be related.) 02:19:41 <fjb> That assembler code is declared to be external code. So the compiler doesn't optimize that calls. 02:20:01 <DaleStan> No, the calls from assembler into C. 02:20:58 <glx> fjb: you should take a look at ttdpatch source ;) 02:21:08 <fjb> There are not only C compilers in the world. I have to admit that most C compilers didn't advance that much from the early 70s. 02:21:53 <fjb> Only compiling one file after the other limits the possibilities for optimization very much. 02:22:29 <fjb> is that source availlable? 02:22:31 <DaleStan> And every single makefile in existence does exactly that. 02:22:40 <DaleStan> svn://svn.ttdpatch.net/trunk 02:23:22 <fjb> It does that only in the world of C compilers. 02:23:55 <DaleStan> So, what language are you thinking of where it doesn't? 02:24:51 <SmatZ> that's the advantage of object files 02:25:06 <fjb> One is Eiffel. Most ML dialects are also more advanced. 02:25:12 <SmatZ> every object file can come from different compiler (even assembler) and be linked together by a linker 02:25:19 <DaleStan> And why is a language that OpenTTD and TTDPatch are neither using nor considering using relevant? 02:26:04 <DaleStan> And what benefit does having multiple source files provide if every object depends on every source file? 02:26:14 <fjb> Because a C compiler can adopt that behavior. And I'm not sure if really no C compiler does an optimisation over the whole sorce. 02:27:10 <fjb> The benefit is that you can handle the source better when it is in small files than it would be in one big file. 02:27:32 <DaleStan> Over whole file, sure. But it can't possibly do it over the whole source unless you tell it what constitutes the whole source. 02:27:52 <glx> having many files is also good to reduce compile time 02:28:18 <DaleStan> But if every object depends on every source file, does that still apply? 02:28:37 <glx> I don't want to recompile everything after changing a line in one file 02:29:17 <glx> and fjb suggestion totally breaks that 02:30:22 <fjb> As I said you don't have to compile the whole source while developing. You only do that for a release. 02:30:46 <SmatZ> I was thinking about this a few days ago... 02:30:59 <SmatZ> maybe it would have some benefit 02:31:13 <fjb> That is usual with many modern compilers for modern languages. 02:31:15 <SmatZ> like KDE, you can compile whole packages in one run 02:32:09 <fjb> C was developed in the early 70s. But coputers are smarter today. 02:32:47 <fjb> You have far more RAm and computing power today to do the optimisations. 02:33:28 <SmatZ> yes, that's why we have -O3 -ftree-ssa -ftree-loop-linear -fzomg-fast switches :) 02:33:37 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N948P001.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:33:38 <fjb> You compile unoptimized codes in small parts while developing. And then you do a compile run over the whole project for release. 02:33:55 <fjb> :-) 02:34:17 *** Axamentia [~SlayerRag@78-105-140-209.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: Triplets, More triplets and palm muting...] 02:34:44 <SmatZ> fjb: do you want to try to do this for openttd? 02:34:55 <SmatZ> maybe it wouldn't be hard 02:34:56 <fjb> But most people seam to only know C or C++, maybe some java. 02:35:53 <fjb> Do what for OpenTTD? Finding a C++ compiler that does that optimisations I was talking about? 02:36:09 <SmatZ> compile whole project at once 02:36:14 <SmatZ> so it can be better optimised 02:36:30 <SmatZ> with -fwhole-program 02:37:30 <SmatZ> probably makefile changes, path changes... 02:39:14 <fjb> Hm, I can look at it. Didn't work with makefiles for a long time. 02:40:13 *** De_Ghost [DeGhost@CPE0050ba8caf2c-CM0011aec4b06a.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:41:44 *** De_Ghost [DeGhost@CPE0050ba8caf2c-CM0011aec4b06a.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #openttd 02:42:02 <fjb> Which compiler does support that option? GCC? Which version? 02:42:30 <SmatZ> I am running gcc 4.2.3 02:43:40 <SmatZ> probably gcc 4.x supports it 02:43:44 <SmatZ> but it is not needed 02:43:53 <fjb> Oh, I'm still having 3.4.6 02:43:55 <SmatZ> if it compiles everything in one run, it is fine :) 02:46:06 <fjb> GCC is availlable for most platforms. That would be an advantage. 02:47:57 <fjb> SmatZ: Have you looked at http://llvm.org/ ? 02:48:10 <fjb> Looks interesting what they are doing. 02:48:20 <SmatZ> yeah, I am at #llvm :) 02:48:51 <SmatZ> but only listening ;) 02:49:40 <fjb> Oh. :-) 03:02:47 <fjb> The --combine option would also be important beside the -fwhole-program option. 03:07:30 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 03:07:36 <fjb> The ttdp sources look a bit scaring. C++ is easier to read. 03:08:46 <DaleStan> Just don't get too worried when you see "jmp near $" or "call near $". We really did mean to type that. 03:09:51 <fjb> I guess you know what you are doing. 03:10:57 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-165-110.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:11:21 <DaleStan> Those instructions never get executed. The magic of self-modifying code. 03:12:08 <glx> they are just placeholders for something else :) 03:12:39 <DaleStan> We just need a five-byte placeholder where the first byte is E8 or E9, and those two instructions are the easiest way to generate that. 03:14:21 *** UFO64-alt [~UFO64@brodeurmb2.umeres.maine.edu] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:15:10 <fjb> Now I know why nfo looks so odd and has self modifying code. :-) 03:17:45 <DaleStan> I keep meaning to adjust the system so those instructions call or jmp to the "code" at address 0 (which will save space in the patching code) but I haven't done that yet. 03:22:01 <fjb> I guess you have more important things to do. 03:37:18 *** a1270 [~Cheese@24-117-88-79.cpe.cableone.net] has quit [Quit: The ending changes tone & is actually quite sad - but it involves a scene of necrophilia, so that's just another plus in my book.....] 03:41:55 <fjb> Good night. 03:42:26 *** fjb [~frank@p5485D291.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:44:06 *** a1270 [~Cheese@24-117-88-79.cpe.cableone.net] has joined #openttd 04:00:19 *** roboboy [~Leo@c211-30-60-34.carlnfd4.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 04:09:59 *** glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: bye] 04:19:16 *** Jortuny [~octernion@r253186120.resnet.cornell.edu] has joined #openttd 05:00:14 *** UFO64 [~UFO64@murrayjm8.umeres.maine.edu] has joined #openttd 05:09:01 *** UFO64 [~UFO64@murrayjm8.umeres.maine.edu] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:15:31 *** gfldex [~dex@dslb-088-074-128-102.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 05:16:30 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@xdsl-213-196-228-18.netcologne.de] has joined #openttd 05:17:28 *** gfldex_ [~dex@dslb-088-074-136-094.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:17:46 *** a1270 [~Cheese@24-117-88-79.cpe.cableone.net] has quit [Quit: The ending changes tone & is actually quite sad - but it involves a scene of necrophilia, so that's just another plus in my book.....] 05:29:59 *** a1270 [~Cheese@24-117-88-79.cpe.cableone.net] has joined #openttd 05:31:02 *** a1270 [~Cheese@24-117-88-79.cpe.cableone.net] has quit [] 05:36:35 *** Jortuny [~octernion@r253186120.resnet.cornell.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:37:29 *** a1270 [~Cheese@24-117-88-79.cpe.cableone.net] has joined #openttd 05:40:42 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB64F4.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Osai] 05:44:47 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@xdsl-213-196-228-18.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: leaving] 06:31:01 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i577B6F3B.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:34:56 *** De_Ghost [DeGhost@CPE0050ba8caf2c-CM0011aec4b06a.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:35:19 *** De_Ghost [DeGhost@cpe0050ba8caf2c-cm0011aec4b06a.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #openttd 06:49:47 *** NukeBuster [~wouter@a62-251-21-79.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 06:51:08 *** DJ-Nekkid [~DJNekkid@static128-249.adsl.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:59:02 *** Zaviori [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:59:10 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 06:59:56 *** Zaviori [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 07:28:42 *** debian__ [~debian@ti541210a340-1906.bb.online.no] has joined #openttd 07:28:50 <debian__> Hello 07:29:24 <debian__> I'm trying to install openttd on an windows compter, it tells me sample.cat is missing or corrupted. Why? 07:29:46 <debian__> Anyonr here? 07:29:55 <ln-> let me guess it's because your sample.cat is missing or corrupted. 07:30:13 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB46D7.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 07:30:43 <ln-> never ask if anyone is here, that's the most useless question possible. 07:30:58 <debian__> ln-: It is an fresh install, how can it allready be missing or corupted? 07:31:09 <debian__> ln-: The answer is usefull for me. 07:31:48 <debian__> Do I need something before I download the game= 07:31:49 <debian__> ? 07:31:55 <debian__> Installed on my computer? 07:32:54 <ln-> you need certain files from your Transport Tycoon Deluxe CD-ROM. 07:34:08 <ln-> i'm sure all this is documented somewhere. 07:34:19 <debian__> ln-: I thought it was free open source... 07:35:10 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:35:10 *** Zaviori [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Write error: connection closed] 07:35:31 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 07:35:41 <debian__> So I need to pay for an cd to get the game? 07:35:47 *** Zaviori [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 07:36:22 <globester> nope 07:36:25 <ln-> either pay for one, or steal one. 07:37:08 <debian__> Where? 07:38:00 <ln-> i bought the CD through amazon.co.uk. 07:38:42 <debian__> How big is the files I need? 07:39:03 <globester> couple mb 07:39:09 <globester> the files are at orudge's site 07:42:56 <debian__> Link? 07:43:03 *** peter1138 [~petern@217.151.109.242] has joined #openttd 07:43:06 *** mode/#openttd [+o peter1138] by ChanServ 07:43:34 <globester> www.transporttycoon.net 07:44:36 <debian__> Is it also free open-source? 07:44:59 <Fujitsu> The data files can not legally be used without purchasing TTD. 07:45:06 <debian__> how can I help making the graphic files you need? 07:45:34 <debian__> I dont see a warning on the site... 07:47:18 <debian__> I want to make all the grapics for you, where to start? 07:48:08 <Fujitsu> There are a couple of graphics replacement projects. The 8bpp OpenGFX, and that for the new 32bpp graphics subsystem. 07:52:15 <debian__> How do I eat forest? 08:11:27 *** Christoph [~lekro@s01060014513484ae.ss.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 08:27:26 *** peter1138 [~petern@217.151.109.242] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:38:21 *** Netsplit oxygen.oftc.net <-> osmotic.oftc.net quits: roboboy 08:39:03 *** Netsplit over, joins: roboboy 08:42:28 *** TinoM [~Tino@i59F57D51.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 08:56:22 *** Leviath [~thomas@z037133.its-s.tudelft.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:05:34 *** peter1138 [~petern@petern.bnsnet.co.uk] has joined #openttd 09:05:37 *** mode/#openttd [+o peter1138] by ChanServ 09:05:56 *** mucht_home is now known as Mucht 09:08:58 <blathijs> michi_cc: Thanks! 09:12:38 *** tokai [~tokai@p54B8161F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 481 seconds] 09:14:46 *** tokai [~tokai@p54B81C57.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 09:14:50 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 09:16:49 <peter1138> So are we ready to make RC1 yet? ;) 09:19:40 *** mikl [~mikl@0x5733cec6.boanxx22.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 09:31:17 *** eQualizer [~lauri@dyn15-194.dsl.spy.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:36:57 *** Greyscale is now known as Greysc[a]le 09:37:06 *** Yexo [~Yexo@dhcp-077-249-253-023.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 09:44:53 *** a1270 [~Cheese@24-117-88-79.cpe.cableone.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:46:20 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-165-110.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 09:46:45 *** Gekz [~brendan@CPE-124-183-21-103.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 09:48:20 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Quit: ( www.nnscript.de :: NoNameScript 4.1 :: www.regroup-esports.com )] 09:49:11 *** eQualizer [~lauri@dyn15-194.dsl.spy.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 10:02:27 *** Brianetta [~brian@77-103-231-158.cable.ubr05.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #openttd 10:04:36 *** Leviath [~thomas@z037133.its-s.tudelft.nl] has joined #openttd 10:11:09 *** demaker [vzzmirc@x1-6-00-13-8f-ba-be-51.k21.webspeed.dk] has joined #openttd 10:11:18 <demaker> Hello all! 10:12:50 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 10:18:05 *** a1270 [~Cheese@24-117-88-79.cpe.cableone.net] has joined #openttd 10:18:48 *** Zaviori [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:21:57 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat1.spoje.net] has joined #openttd 10:26:03 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:29:42 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@062249182162.customer.alfanett.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:31:17 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-165-110.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:35:08 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@062249182162.customer.alfanett.no] has joined #openttd 10:36:12 *** Digitalfox [~chatzilla@bl7-183-32.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #openttd 10:36:38 <Digitalfox> peter1138 how dare you say RC1 :0 10:39:49 <peter1138> Why? :p 10:40:40 <debian__> How do I make money? 10:40:49 <keyweed_> sell drugs. 10:40:54 <Digitalfox> beta 4 just released yesterday, give it time to bug reports ;) 10:41:47 <debian__> I'm using beta 4, I'm only loosing money... 10:42:03 <Yexo> are you sure you aren't using transfer? 10:42:03 * Digitalfox want's RC1 has soon has possible, i love that magic patch :0 10:42:07 <debian__> Where should I transport stuff? 10:42:30 <Yexo> transporting coal from a coal mine to a powerplant is a good start 10:42:44 <debian__> Where is my powerplant? 10:43:11 <Yexo> There are multiple on the map, use the minimap to find them 10:43:26 <debian__> It is no road/railroad to it 10:43:28 <Yexo> http://wiki.openttd.org/images/4/4a/4_Types_of_railway.png 10:43:33 <Yexo> that's a powerplant 10:43:41 <Yexo> And you have to build the rail yourself ;) 10:43:46 <Yexo> that's kinda the purpose of the game 10:44:09 <Yexo> See http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/Railway_construction 10:46:03 <debian__> So I only build roads? 10:47:22 *** DJ-Nekkid [~DJNekkid@gprs-ggsn6-nat.mobil.telenor.no] has joined #openttd 10:47:39 <Yexo> No, you can build rails too 10:49:21 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-165-110.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 10:49:26 <debian__> So Now I have money? 10:50:24 <debian__> I'm still loosing a lot... 10:50:35 <debian__> -360000 10:51:01 <Yexo> Can you post a savegame somewhere so I can have a look? 10:51:24 <debian__> Jay, I earned 1.986$ 10:52:34 <debian__> Railroads is magically apperaring, why? 10:52:54 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@xdsl-81-173-234-128.netcologne.de] has joined #openttd 10:52:59 <Yexo> Probably because you're playing with ai opponents which are building railroads 10:53:08 <Yexo> You can disable them in the patch settings 10:55:25 <debian__> Ok 11:00:09 *** Yexo_ [Yexo@32-88-ftth.onsneteindhoven.nl] has joined #openttd 11:01:35 <debian__> Yexo: He wont try to steal my railroad area then? 11:03:13 <debian__> This game is only point is to build roads? 11:03:42 <Yexo_> The ai can't use your railroads 11:03:55 <Yexo_> What he can do however, is building in an area you planned to build 11:04:18 <Yexo_> About the point of this game: you can play it any way you like. 11:04:33 <Yexo_> Some people like to play with only road vehicles 11:04:52 <Yexo_> other people like to build massive rail networks with hundreds of trains 11:05:07 *** Yexo [~Yexo@dhcp-077-249-253-023.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:05:36 <debian__> The stupid train wont load cargo 11:05:53 <debian__> ït goes back and fort from oil and powerplant 11:06:25 <Noldo> oil doesn't goto the power plant 11:06:36 <debian__> Seriously? 11:06:45 <debian__> Where does it go? 11:07:00 <Yexo_> oil goes to a refinery 11:07:11 <Yexo_> click on the industry to see which cargo's it accepts 11:08:17 *** Digitalfox [~chatzilla@bl7-183-32.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:11:06 <debian__> The trainstation can store stuff? 11:11:17 <Yexo_> sort of 11:11:32 <Yexo_> all cargo generated by industries is delivered to a nearby station 11:11:44 <Yexo_> but some is lost if you don't transport it in time 11:13:55 *** nzvip [~svip@192.38.109.188] has joined #openttd 11:14:40 <debian__> But my coal trains is refuses to move... 11:15:12 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has joined #openttd 11:16:00 <debian__> They are stuck in the garage 11:18:10 <ln-> the depot, sir 11:18:11 <Yexo_> Are your signals placed ok? 11:18:28 <Gekz> is it an electric garage on a diesel track 11:18:29 <Gekz> lol 11:18:34 <Gekz> or vice versa 11:18:40 <Yexo_> There can only be one train at the same time within one signal block 11:18:58 <debian__> Oh 11:19:00 <Yexo_> diesel depot with elektric rails isn't a problem :) 11:19:10 <debian__> How can I fix the signal block thing? 11:19:18 <Yexo_> http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/Signals 11:22:44 *** DJ-Nekkid [~DJNekkid@gprs-ggsn6-nat.mobil.telenor.no] has quit [] 11:25:14 <debian__> Can I have doubble rails too? 11:25:35 <Yexo_> of course, just build two railroads next to eachother with oneway signals facing different directions 11:27:03 <Tefad> LLRR RRLL heh. 11:27:14 <Yexo_> :) 11:27:23 <Yexo_> that's not exactly simple to start with :) 11:30:14 *** Gekz [~brendan@CPE-124-183-21-103.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:31:11 *** Gekz [~brendan@124.183.21.103] has joined #openttd 11:31:22 <peter1138> What do L and R mean? 11:31:33 <Yexo_> the driving side 11:31:50 <Yexo_> LR is normal two way track 11:31:56 <debian__> Noo, I started new game, noww I've wasted all the money... 11:31:58 *** Gekz [~brendan@124.183.21.103] has quit [] 11:31:59 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1D664.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 11:32:03 <Yexo_> LLRR is four tracks, two going one way and two going the other way 11:32:07 <debian__> Ther I got meny 11:32:26 *** Gekz [~brendan@124.183.21.103] has joined #openttd 11:32:29 <debian__> How many wagons can An train have? 11:32:42 <peter1138> Is L and R some standard system? Because to mean it means nothing. 11:32:50 <Yexo_> it's used in openttdcoop a lot 11:32:58 <peter1138> Yes, but I mean standard. 11:33:05 <Yexo_> I have no idea :) 11:34:44 *** caladan [~caladan@161-bem-18.acn.waw.pl] has joined #openttd 11:37:34 <peter1138> So is LLRR RRLL: ââââ ââââ ? 11:37:41 <Yexo_> yes 11:38:00 <peter1138> So if you had a loop... 11:38:16 *** fjb [~frank@p5485D291.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 11:38:16 <peter1138> It would end up as ââââ ââââ on the other side...? 11:38:21 <fjb> Hello 11:38:29 <Yexo_> that's also possible 11:38:39 <Yexo_> L and R don't have any particluar direction 11:38:41 <peter1138> but that's not LLRR RRLL any more... 11:39:02 <demaker> is it best to have different kind of transport or is it best to stick to airplanes etc? 11:39:04 <Yexo_> it's only that every L-lane is going in the same direction, and opposite to any R-lane 11:39:25 <Yexo_> demaker: whatever makes you have the most fun of your game :) 11:40:05 <demaker> hehe okay.. i just love this game.. played it 10 years ago and startet yesterday hehe 11:40:20 <fjb> demaker: And the patches you are using. Try to start an airplane only game with the passenger destinations patch. :-) 11:40:34 *** Dark_Link^ [~glidegame@fw.dormnet.his.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:40:39 *** Gekz [~brendan@124.183.21.103] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 11:42:02 <debian__> Can an coal mine become empty? 11:42:41 <debian__> How do I make an train turn in the railroad? 11:42:57 <fjb> Yes it can. 11:43:15 <Yexo_> but it normally won't if you provide good service 11:44:44 <fjb> There is a button on the right side of the vehicle window that lets the train reverse. 11:46:41 *** eQualizer [~lauri@dyn15-194.dsl.spy.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:56:04 <demaker> fjb, what do you mean? 11:56:08 *** DJ-Nekkid [~DJNekkid@static128-249.adsl.no] has joined #openttd 12:00:44 <demaker> How do i upgrade busses etc? 12:05:40 *** eQualizer [~lauri@dyn15-194.dsl.spy.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 12:13:30 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N748P012.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 12:14:50 <Vikthor> demaker: Just send it in depot sell the bus and buy new one 12:14:57 <Vikthor> or use autoreplace 12:22:10 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 12:31:19 * Hendikins hrms, idly wonders how long it would take him to build openttd on his build farm 12:31:28 <Noldo> time! 12:33:15 <Hendikins> Need autofox to finish first. 12:33:19 <Hendikins> I can build Firefox in 14 mins 12:34:07 *** Leviath [~thomas@z037133.its-s.tudelft.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:34:14 <peter1138> Takes my X2 5600+ 1 minute for a release build 12:34:19 <peter1138> 30 seconds for debug 12:35:11 <Yexo_> depends whether I compile on windows or linux :) 12:35:14 <Yexo_> linux is under 1 minute 12:35:21 <Yexo_> windows can take up to 5 minutes 12:36:57 <Hendikins> peter1138: My build farm is an X2 4800+, Turion X2 1.9GHz, Sempron 3000+ and dual Athlon MP 2600+ 12:37:21 *** Yexo_ is now known as Yexo 12:38:30 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-165-110.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Quit: ThePizzaKing] 12:41:16 *** Jacy [~personal@212-123-177-242.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd 12:49:14 *** Brianetta [~brian@77-103-231-158.cable.ubr05.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 12:57:52 <fjb> Is there an option to preven trains from reversing in front of signals? 12:57:59 <fjb> prevent 13:15:35 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat1.spoje.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:16:32 *** mcbane [~Maui_key@p5498CEB8.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 13:16:44 <mcbane> ^,^ 13:17:34 <mcbane> hmm george barly haning around here aye? 13:17:43 <mcbane> *hangig 13:18:29 * fjb can't remember seeing him here. 13:18:47 <Gonozal_VIII> me neither 13:19:09 <Forked> meep meep 13:19:26 <murray> oO 13:19:28 <mcbane> cause its fuuny with his closing mechanism. most close as intended except oilwells forest sawmills and a few other industries. 13:22:09 <fjb> Not all industries are in the same stage of development. Beta 4 is the most advanced. 13:22:43 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has joined #openttd 13:23:22 <debian__> Ok 13:23:44 <mcbane> i have no clue about the grf coding but it have to be defined for every single industry? 13:23:49 <debian__> But how can I make an lot of money? 13:24:19 <fjb> Yes, for every single industry. 13:24:26 <mcbane> arg 13:24:34 <debian__> The stuff the oil raffinery makes, where should it go? 13:24:40 <fjb> debian__: Use the cheat menu. :-) 13:25:12 <fjb> debian__: Standard oil rafinery or an industry replacement grf? 13:25:15 <Noldo> debian__: some cities accept goods 13:25:24 <mcbane> debia_ if you use ECS potrol goes to gasstation and reafined stuff goes to chem industry 13:25:25 <debian__> The thing that comes in beta4 13:25:34 <Yexo> goods ahve to be transported to towns 13:25:37 <Gonozal_VIII> you get money for selling tracks, sell them all and you have more money 13:26:02 <Gonozal_VIII> (that's how politicians think) 13:26:25 <mcbane> yes and its a lie. 13:26:33 <fjb> Some houses of towns are accepting good. They have to be in the station cachement area. Then that station accept goods. 13:27:25 *** roboboy [~Leo@c211-30-60-34.carlnfd4.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:29:09 <debian__> How many wagons can an train have? 13:29:31 <Sionide> loads 13:29:35 <Sionide> but it gets slower the more they are 13:30:08 <Gonozal_VIII> no 13:30:14 *** Dark_Link^ [~glidegame@fw.dormnet.his.se] has joined #openttd 13:30:20 <Gonozal_VIII> not with additional engines too 13:30:33 <debian__> Can I have two trains? 13:30:38 <debian__> On one train? 13:30:50 <Sionide> yeah 13:31:09 <Sionide> try it in the depot, build two then drag the second one to behind the first one 13:31:12 <Sionide> and they couple up 13:35:10 *** roboboy [~Leo@c211-30-60-34.carlnfd4.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 13:35:41 <debian__> If I want an big network, like double lanes trains, how? 13:35:56 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i577B76D7.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 13:36:25 *** glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 13:36:29 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 13:37:42 <debian__> Does the cityes want food? 13:38:17 <Yexo> not when playing temperate 13:38:34 <Yexo> just build your network piece by piece and extend it further 13:43:01 *** divo [~asd@0x4dd443c6.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #openttd 13:43:15 *** roboboy [~Leo@c211-30-60-34.carlnfd4.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:46:30 <debian__> Will the game go for ever? 13:46:34 <debian__> It isnt done ever? 13:46:50 <Gonozal_VIII> yes 13:47:13 <Yexo> although you get your score in 2051 you can still play on after that date 14:02:37 *** eQualizer [~lauri@dyn15-194.dsl.spy.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Quit: leaving] 14:08:56 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 14:09:57 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [] 14:10:34 <debian__> Some of my trains refuses to turn 14:10:49 <debian__> How to make double lanes, and can they change lanes? 14:12:07 *** eQualizer [~lauri@dyn15-194.dsl.spy.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 14:16:14 <debian__> I want this to work 14:17:23 <Noldo> with some clever signaling 14:20:52 *** frosch123 [~mtce@pascal.math.tu-clausthal.de] has joined #openttd 14:21:10 <Gonozal_VIII> quak 14:21:30 <mcbane> quack? 14:22:24 <debian__> quack? 14:22:33 <Gonozal_VIII> no, quak 14:22:45 <frosch123> quak :) 14:23:37 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has joined #openttd 14:28:59 <mcbane> frösche.. 14:34:08 <fjb> Quak frosch123 14:34:17 <frosch123> moin fjb 14:34:22 <fjb> :-) 14:34:37 <fjb> frosch123: I missed you yesterday evening. 14:34:59 * frosch123 was busy 14:41:06 *** Jortuny [~octernion@r253186120.resnet.cornell.edu] has joined #openttd 14:42:31 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i577B76D7.versanet.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:46:59 *** GoneWacko [~gonewacko@86-60-159-234-dyn-dsl.ssp.fi] has joined #openttd 14:48:46 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i577B76D7.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 14:50:01 *** GoneWacko [~gonewacko@86-60-159-234-dyn-dsl.ssp.fi] has quit [] 15:01:41 *** UFO64 [UFO64@john-michael-murray.um.maine.edu] has joined #openttd 15:02:07 <DJ-Nekkid> debian__: with SML ? 15:02:50 *** UFO64 [UFO64@john-michael-murray.um.maine.edu] has quit [] 15:02:57 *** UFO64 [UFO64@john-michael-murray.um.maine.edu] has joined #openttd 15:06:37 <peter1138> SML? 15:07:38 <DJ-Nekkid> shift/switch main line 15:08:24 <DJ-Nekkid> http://83.243.128.249/ottd/sml.png 15:09:47 <peter1138> Even 'shift/switch main line' means nothing to me, so I doubt it can mean anything to a newbie... 15:09:51 <SmatZ> DJ-Nekkid: why is it a 2-way exit presignal? 15:10:15 <peter1138> SmatZ, because the openttdcoop people like to abuse signals for other purposes... 15:10:22 <DJ-Nekkid> SmatZ: because it wont work without :) 15:10:30 <SmatZ> when train reverses because it has to wait for a long time, it blocks the ML 15:11:08 <SmatZ> peter1138: I have to say I like it ;-) but sometimes, I don't understand that overuse 15:11:09 <DJ-Nekkid> the trains will only enter the 2nd ML if it's free, if it's a 1way it will go to the combo and stay until it's free... 15:12:14 <DJ-Nekkid> and peter1138; i were makeing the screenshot when u asked :) 15:12:25 <DJ-Nekkid> *making* 15:12:30 <Yexo> DJ-Nekkid: are you sure you didn't make a few mistakes there? 15:12:57 <DJ-Nekkid> Yexo: not 100%, but i made aprox 100 of thoose last coop-game, and they worked 15:13:20 <SmatZ> well, I played that game for a while, and this was the place where it was blocked 15:13:50 <DJ-Nekkid> well, it is build according to mark's example... 15:14:00 <Yexo> http://www.openttdcoop.org/wiki/images/7/70/SML2-Shifter.PNG 15:14:03 <Yexo> that looks more like it 15:14:35 <Yexo> the signal before exit 1way/combo 2way has to be a presignal 15:14:47 <DJ-Nekkid> nope 15:15:12 <DJ-Nekkid> because: 15:15:13 <Gonozal_VIII> no need for a penalty, it's longer anyways 15:15:49 <Gonozal_VIII> other version is better 15:16:00 <DJ-Nekkid> Gonozal_VIII: mine? 15:16:09 <Gonozal_VIII> yes 15:16:14 <peter1138> It's so ugly :o 15:16:22 <Gonozal_VIII> yep, ugly^^ 15:16:29 <Gonozal_VIII> but looks like it could work 15:16:37 <DJ-Nekkid> Yexo: if the 2nd ml is not free, and the exit is not free (because the trains are closely packed) it's like haveing a 3 tile signalblock 15:17:20 <Gonozal_VIII> longer signalblocks are very bad 15:17:23 <Yexo> yes, but if there are both not free then it *is* desired behaviour to wait for the first one to become free, isn't it? 15:17:28 <Gonozal_VIII> jams everything 15:18:17 <Gonozal_VIII> trains should never stop 15:18:27 <Gonozal_VIII> so presignal entry bad 15:18:34 <DJ-Nekkid> Gonozal_VIII: i agree... 15:18:42 <peter1138> And this is why I don't play openttdcoop. It's so tedious. 15:18:56 <DJ-Nekkid> peter1138: it's actually fun... 15:19:03 <DJ-Nekkid> last game lasted more then 300 years 15:19:25 <DJ-Nekkid> that's more then 70 hours 15:19:36 <DJ-Nekkid> if it were not close to 400 15:19:43 <fjb> But some people have more fun building pretty lines through beautiful landscapes. 15:20:06 <DJ-Nekkid> sure! 15:20:25 <SmatZ> yeah, without terraforming :) 15:20:36 <Gonozal_VIII> i try to combine that :-) lines where trains never have to stop or slow down but that still look good 15:20:43 * SmatZ likes no-terraforming maps with 1000+ trains ;) 15:20:52 <SmatZ> and at least 1024x1024 map :-D 15:21:02 <fjb> Without isn't always possible, but with as few terraforming as possible. 15:21:48 <fjb> 1024x1024 map is nice in multiplayer, but I feel lost on it in a single player game. 15:21:53 <SmatZ> :) 15:22:20 <Yexo> I normally build them like this 15:22:21 <Yexo> http://www.student.tue.nl/V/t.i.marinussen/sml.png 15:22:35 <SmatZ> for how long trains? 15:22:46 <SmatZ> TL3? 15:22:47 <Yexo> not measured this time :) 15:22:51 <Yexo> tl 3 indeed 15:23:02 <fjb> SmatZ: I looked at the makefiles fpr OpenTTD, but I don't know enough about automake etc. to make new makefiles for OpenTTD to compile it all at once. 15:23:17 <Yexo> just type ./configure 15:23:26 <SmatZ> fjb: neither me :( 15:24:18 <fjb> You need at least two options for gcc to make it work. And it may have sideeffects on varaible and function scope. 15:26:04 <peter1138> Why would you want to compile it all at once? 15:26:27 <fjb> To get an far more optimized executable. 15:27:10 <fjb> Optimisation is local to a single input file now. It would be global to the whole OpenTTD source then. 15:27:15 <peter1138> Right... 15:27:50 <Yexo> you can try cat *.h *.cpp > gcc :) 15:28:03 <Yexo> that should be | g++ 15:28:23 <SmatZ> you have to -I correct directories 15:29:11 <fjb> Or use some smarter make replacement. 15:29:23 <Eddi|zuHause2> | grep -v '#include "' 15:29:27 <Noldo> fjb: what on earth are you talking about? 15:29:41 *** Morloth [~b.ridder@mail.tjip.com] has joined #openttd 15:29:52 <Morloth> Hi everyone! :)_ 15:30:45 *** yorick [~yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 15:31:32 <fjb> Noldo: the current source is compiled one source file at a time. Optimisation is local to that file. gcc has a global optimizer option where the optimisation is global to the whole code base. But it has to be called with all source files as arguments at once. 15:31:42 <fjb> Hi Morloth 15:31:56 <Noldo> aha 15:37:28 <Morloth> Does someone have time to review & commit my patch for NoAI @ http://bugs.openttd.org/task/1783, please? 15:37:53 <glx> Morloth: split it in many parts (it's way too big) 15:37:58 <Morloth> I'd like to develop NoAI furder but I don't want to create patches which depend upon patches; Things get messy :) 15:38:30 <glx> and I don't like your change for GetCargoProduction and GetCargoAcceptance 15:38:51 <glx> better add functions to just tell if it accepts or produces 15:38:51 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:39:07 <glx> and keep the GetCargo* as they are 15:39:08 <Morloth> glx: But the old methods didn't gave any sensable information 15:39:41 *** UFO64 [UFO64@john-michael-murray.um.maine.edu] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:39:50 <glx> maybe for you, but some AI writer may want to know the exact amount 15:40:31 <Morloth> glx: Hmmz... Perhaps you're right, but I don't see the sense in the numbers it returned 15:40:46 *** Maedhros [~jc@host86-137-228-149.range86-137.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 15:40:57 <glx> it is the numbers you can see when you use the query tile tool 15:41:55 <Morloth> But what does an acceptance of 24 mean as to an acceptance of 16 or 2? 15:42:08 <Morloth> Thought it was kinda dodgy, those functions 15:42:29 <Morloth> But I'll rewrite it one I get home tonight and create a new patch :) 15:43:23 <Morloth> Would be good to see NoAI back on track again 15:45:14 <glx> higher acceptance means your station has less chance to stop accepting stuff when the town decides to replace/remove buildings 15:45:57 <Morloth> But you'd recommend I create 2 separate patches? 1) Make methods static. 2) The added functions ? 15:46:53 <glx> it's always better to do small patches 15:47:13 <Morloth> I'll keep that in mind :) 15:47:29 <glx> or at least 1 patch for 1 change 15:47:44 *** raimar2 [~hawk@p5489CAF5.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 15:47:56 <Gonozal_VIII> yes because devs are lazy people and don't want to read more than 10 lines at once 15:48:02 <Gonozal_VIII> hehehe 15:48:22 <Morloth> glx: I kinda got over excited I guess and coded away at NoAI the last couple of days :) 15:48:34 <glx> Gonozal_VIII: not only, it's easier to understand 1 change than 10 when you read a diff 15:48:46 <Gonozal_VIII> i know, i know ;-) 15:48:49 <Gonozal_VIII> just kidding 15:48:51 <Morloth> hehe :) 15:51:52 <peter1138> That's okay, you're on ignore now 15:52:15 <NukeBuster> speaking of small patches.. 15:53:41 <yorick> ping * 15:53:52 <NukeBuster> did anyone take a look at http://bugs.openttd.org/task/1670? 15:55:08 *** raimar3 [~hawk@p5489D981.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:55:17 *** Christoph [~lekro@S01060014513484ae.ss.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 15:55:42 * Maedhros has looked, yes 15:56:18 * SmatZ too 15:56:20 <NukeBuster> :) 15:56:36 <NukeBuster> Do you have an opinion about it? 15:56:46 <Gonozal_VIII> been looking 15:57:40 <SmatZ> I think it can be useful 15:57:44 * Belugas has seen it, but has no opinion, since not playing nor doing MP 15:58:06 <NukeBuster> :) 15:58:54 * Maedhros agrees with Belugas 15:58:55 <Gonozal_VIII> opinions are for people that can't make their own reality 15:59:06 <Maedhros> that makes no sense 15:59:12 <Gonozal_VIII> sure does 15:59:25 <Morloth> I'm signing off, cya guys tonight! 15:59:31 *** Morloth [~b.ridder@mail.tjip.com] has quit [Quit: Awaaay!] 15:59:33 <Gonozal_VIII> everything is the truth then 16:01:19 <Maedhros> and that makes you indifferent to everything? you don't like it, dislike it, anything? 16:02:03 <Gonozal_VIII> yep 16:03:13 <SmatZ> :-) 16:04:59 <Gonozal_VIII> why would you dislike something you made yourself? 16:04:59 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc332161-a.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has joined #openttd 16:05:10 <Gonozal_VIII> or like it... if you don't know different 16:06:26 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i577B76D7.versanet.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:09:13 <peter1138> Isn't there already a password on join thing? 16:09:32 <peter1138> hmm 16:09:38 <NukeBuster> not in trunk (as far as I know) 16:09:54 <peter1138> Ah, there's the default password thing 16:10:58 *** Tefad [~tefad@c-71-63-20-187.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: IS IT CAN BE HARDWARE REMIX TIME NAO? YES! YES IT IS.] 16:11:37 <NukeBuster> there was a discussion about that in the suggestions forum 16:12:23 <NukeBuster> This got into trunk quite recently, though it have two disadvantages - in game you don't see whether there is some password or not (you have to look into the config file to check for that) 16:12:24 <NukeBuster> Second, it is stored in plaintext in config file. If you do not realize that and send config file to someone (like with some bug report to the bugtracker) ... oops, your password just became public. 16:12:29 <NukeBuster> Oops.. 16:12:40 <NukeBuster> (that was posted by Bilbo) 16:13:15 <NukeBuster> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=35633 16:15:00 <glx> NukeBuster: usually the .cfg is not needed for bug reports (as all important settings are in the .sav) 16:15:30 <NukeBuster> ok 16:16:08 <glx> but we may ask for it, or at least some specific settings 16:16:31 <NukeBuster> is it possible to change the default password in game? 16:16:45 <glx> dunno 16:17:00 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 16:20:24 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i577B76D7.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 16:21:29 *** White_Rabbit [whiterabbi@cpc1-oxfd8-0-0-cust590.oxfd.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd 16:22:33 *** White_Rabbit [whiterabbi@cpc1-oxfd8-0-0-cust590.oxfd.cable.ntl.com] has quit [] 16:22:53 *** White_Rabbit [whiterabbi@cpc1-oxfd8-0-0-cust590.oxfd.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd 16:30:31 <peter1138> Isn't that what the button does? 16:30:45 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-136-225-75.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has joined #openttd 16:33:05 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat1.spoje.net] has joined #openttd 16:38:15 *** Draakon [~chatzilla@88-196-96-224-dsl.trt.estpak.ee] has joined #openttd 16:39:03 <Draakon> hello 16:40:22 <Gonozal_VIII> hi 16:40:41 <Draakon> what's up? 16:41:50 <Gonozal_VIII> the opposite of down 16:41:56 <Draakon> ? 16:42:13 <Gonozal_VIII> that's up 16:42:26 <Draakon> lol 16:42:51 <Gonozal_VIII> well, you asked :-) 16:42:58 <Draakon> :P 16:44:36 <NukeBuster> Peter1138, that's indeed what the button does. 16:45:24 <NukeBuster> I just like the fact it would pop up if you don't have it set. 16:46:02 <peter1138> Well, add it then ;) 16:46:09 *** Draakon [~chatzilla@88-196-96-224-dsl.trt.estpak.ee] has quit [Quit: Error: Connection Lost] 16:46:38 *** Draakon [~chatzilla@88-196-96-224-dsl.trt.estpak.ee] has joined #openttd 16:47:07 <NukeBuster> Well that's the patch :) 16:47:42 *** Draakon [~chatzilla@88-196-96-224-dsl.trt.estpak.ee] has quit [] 16:48:03 <NukeBuster> if you create a new company and no default password set then: ShowNetworkCompanyPasswordWindow(); 16:48:11 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:50:42 *** Zaviori [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 16:52:42 *** Brianetta [~brian@77-103-231-158.cable.ubr05.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #openttd 16:56:53 *** Frostregen_ [SADDAM@dslb-084-058-106-040.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 16:58:29 *** toet [~Oblivious@3E339CE5.dslaccess.aol.com] has joined #openttd 17:02:35 *** Frostregen [SADDAM@dslb-084-058-108-226.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:03:03 *** Frostregen_ is now known as Frostregen 17:07:47 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d51A473D5.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 17:08:22 *** White_Rabbit [whiterabbi@cpc1-oxfd8-0-0-cust590.oxfd.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:10:47 *** White_Rabbit [whiterabbi@cpc1-oxfd8-0-0-cust590.oxfd.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd 17:16:53 <Sacro> :D 17:16:58 <Sacro> Big 'O' notation! :D 17:19:05 *** LordAzamath [~LordAzama@ip208.cab23.ltln.starman.ee] has joined #openttd 17:20:24 <Eddi|zuHause2> O no... he figured us out... 17:20:34 *** yorick [~yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Po-ta-to, boil em, mash em, stick em in a stew.] 17:20:56 <Eddi|zuHause2> they're called 'Landau Symbols' btw. 17:21:03 * LordAzamath is going to say hello in a moment, be ready! 17:21:11 <LordAzamath> hellp 17:21:15 <LordAzamath> hello 17:21:17 <LordAzamath> * 17:21:42 <Eddi|zuHause2> you, sir, are massive failure in person ;) 17:22:09 <LordAzamath> true 17:22:11 <LordAzamath> ^^ 17:22:47 <LordAzamath> but atleast I've got beta-4 downloading atm.. 17:23:20 <Eddi|zuHause2> i'm stuck with 12066 for a while, because i can't be bothered with savegame compatibility 17:23:22 *** dih [~dihedral@dslb-088-066-135-000.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 17:23:41 <dih> :-) 17:23:59 <LordAzamath> hello dih :) 17:24:18 <Sacro> LordAzamath: you failed that quite amusingly 17:24:25 <LordAzamath> yeah, I know ^^ 17:25:07 <LordAzamath> had to ask help because my keyboard.... well let's say I don't feel comfortable with it :P 17:25:58 * LordAzamath is listening the Queen cassete "A kind of magic" ^^ 17:26:24 <Gonozal_VIII> yay queen 17:26:31 <Eddi|zuHause2> michi_cc: have you considered a feature of 'real' PBS? in order to reserve a path, every switch leading to this path from 'outside' must be secured, otherwise no path can be locked (= speed limit 40km/h), this prevents crashing trains from the side ('Flankenfahrt') 17:27:50 <Eddi|zuHause2> 'secured' means either the next switch is in a position not leading to this path, or a derailment device is installed 17:28:51 <Gonozal_VIII> the switches don't switch... 17:29:13 <LordAzamath> pain is so close to pleasure.. But that's completely unrealted to current topic ^^ 17:29:23 <Sacro> http://msdn.microsoft.com/events/hero/images/bio-vsg-03.gif <- hahhaha 17:29:27 <Eddi|zuHause2> no, but a train without reserved path cannot take that switch even if it wants to 17:29:45 <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause2: catch point? 17:30:05 <peter1138> 'real' PBS? heh 17:30:16 <Sacro> peter1138: yes 17:30:19 <Sacro> though i want ABS :( 17:30:23 <LordAzamath> tt-forums has another spammer.. 17:30:25 <Eddi|zuHause2> Sacro: you can e.g. safely force a train through a signal without path 17:30:25 <Sacro> but i fear that'd be hard to implement 17:30:43 <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause2: actually, IRL it is up to the signalman to make sure all points are locked 17:30:52 <LordAzamath> I tried to report post, but it was already reported :D 17:31:28 <Eddi|zuHause2> Sacro: german signal control stations have devices that ensure these lockings, otherwise the signal cannot be turned green 17:31:48 <Eddi|zuHause2> signals have an 'override' for that, but it's not a green light, but a white light 17:31:52 <peter1138> How does this relate to PBS? 17:32:56 *** Morloth [~bram@53542231.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd 17:33:45 <Eddi|zuHause2> like i said, it provides more safety in case someone is messing around... 17:34:10 <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause2: yes, but a signalman can give permission for a train to pass a red 17:34:20 <Sacro> otherwise how would you get passed a TCF 17:34:22 *** mikl [~mikl@0x5733cec6.boanxx22.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 17:34:24 <Sacro> *pst 17:34:25 <Sacro> *past 17:34:31 <Eddi|zuHause2> TCF? 17:34:36 *** frosch123 [~mtce@pascal.math.tu-clausthal.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:34:49 <Sacro> track circuit failure 17:35:03 <Sacro> short circuit between the lines, hopefully makes all signals show red 17:35:11 *** Maedhros [~jc@host86-137-228-149.range86-137.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: leaving] 17:36:34 <Eddi|zuHause2> yes, that is like the 'ignore signal' switch in the game 17:36:41 <peter1138> So... 17:36:58 <peter1138> You should manually ensure it's safe if you're going to fiddle with that... 17:37:06 <Eddi|zuHause2> not 'so'... i was just throwing this into the discussion 17:37:25 <Eddi|zuHause2> but it's going the wrong way ;) 17:38:26 <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause2: yes, same concept 17:38:34 <Sacro> you have to make sure the way is clear 17:38:47 <Sacro> the ability to lock stes of points in a certain drection would be nice 17:38:59 <Sacro> as would having choseable crossover/single slip/double slip 17:39:18 *** dih_ [~dihedral@dslb-088-066-143-103.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 17:39:30 <Eddi|zuHause2> anyway, in all these special cases which circumvent a locked path, speed limit is 40km/h 17:40:31 <Eddi|zuHause2> and sometimes, they tell the train driver to "drive on sight" [e.g. he has to stop behind a train already waiting in the next block] 17:40:46 *** dih is now known as Guest534 17:40:47 *** dih_ is now known as dih 17:41:10 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i577B76D7.versanet.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:41:26 <peter1138> Sacro needs his realistic track simulation :o 17:41:47 <peter1138> Didn't locomotion show switch states visually? 17:42:14 <peter1138> More pixels to show it in, of course. 17:42:40 <Morloth> glx: Sorry to bother you again, but I'm still not sure how to submit a patch which changes almost all methods in NoAI static. Should I create a patch which applies to all files or do you want a different patch per file? 17:43:22 <glx> if you can do it in steps it's better 17:43:53 *** Guest534 [~dihedral@dslb-088-066-135-000.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:44:26 <Morloth> glx: ok :) 17:46:01 <LordAzamath> how could I force compiling of specific revision? 17:46:03 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: smatz * r12186 /trunk/src/sound.cpp: -Fix [FS#1784](r12169): assert when trying to play tile sound at NW border of map (placing buyos, leveling land) 17:46:41 <Sacro> peter1138: yes, i do want it to be more real 17:46:57 <Sacro> though i would prefer it if i could make sure a train cannot switch lines on a crossover 17:47:02 <Sacro> until we get digonal bridges 17:47:03 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i577B76D7.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 17:48:07 <Eddi|zuHause2> LordAzamath: svn up -rXXXX 17:48:35 <LordAzamath> agh.. what's revision for beta4 then? 17:48:41 <LordAzamath> I downloaded source this time 17:48:44 <Sacro> LordAzamath: /tags/0.6.0-beta4 17:49:03 <LordAzamath> so svn co .../tags/0.6.0-beta4 ? 17:49:11 <LordAzamath> or can I up it too? 17:49:15 <Sacro> no ... 17:49:18 <glx> co 17:49:18 <Sacro> oh 17:49:25 <Sacro> yes, http://... 17:49:41 <glx> you can also export if you don't plan to modify it 17:49:43 <LordAzamath> I would've thought it's svn... 17:50:06 <LordAzamath> glx, I originally asked for that.. exporting in that case 17:50:15 <LordAzamath> I didn't know how to call it :D 17:50:20 <Eddi|zuHause2> LordAzamath: if you have source without svn, there is a ./configure option for the revision string 17:50:31 <LordAzamath> ./configure and? 17:50:35 <glx> not needed for releases 17:50:39 <Eddi|zuHause2> ./configure --help 17:50:39 <Sacro> make! 17:51:30 <Eddi|zuHause2> also, you can svn switch if you have a trunk checkout 17:52:08 <LordAzamath> one question, why don't releases read the external location for data files? I now have to move manually all trg*r grfs.. :( 17:52:33 <Sacro> ./configure --prefix=? 17:52:36 <Eddi|zuHause2> you can also configure the paths it searches in 17:52:40 <Sacro> yes... 17:52:42 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: belugas * r12187 /trunk/ (readme.txt src/misc_gui.cpp): -Add: frosch as dev. Last, but not least 17:52:53 <Sacro> cos i have /usr/share/openttd{,-svn} 17:53:04 <LordAzamath> aghh nvm 17:53:14 <glx> and by default it tries install and home without specifying it in configure 17:53:27 <LordAzamath> I'll stay at compiling nightlys :D, easier.. 17:53:34 <debian__> Can it jump from station to station? 17:53:44 <LordAzamath> ? 17:54:07 <Sacro> debian__: pardon? 17:55:35 *** dih_ [~dihedral@dslb-088-066-142-195.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 17:55:45 <Gonozal_VIII> teleporting?^^ 17:55:47 <Sacro> dih_: bounce bounce bounce 17:57:01 <Sacro> Limitation disturbs me very sprites. Goes it throw out limitation? 17:57:41 *** UFO64 [UFO64@john-michael-murray.um.maine.edu] has joined #openttd 17:58:24 <dih_> Sacro: those are isp issues 17:59:33 <Sacro> dih_: hehe, sucky isp 17:59:38 * Sacro is on uni wifi 17:59:44 <Sacro> but my bouncer seems stable enough 17:59:51 <Sacro> ssh + screen + irssi ftw 18:00:00 <UFO64> irssi? 18:00:05 <Sacro> irssi! 18:00:09 <UFO64> oh 18:00:21 * UFO64 makes note to speak out words before he asks what they mean 18:00:40 <Sacro> jfgi ;) 18:00:55 <Prof_Frink> irssi! 18:02:07 *** dih [~dihedral@dslb-088-066-143-103.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:04:14 <Eddi|zuHause2> mtkritf! 18:05:44 *** dih| [~dihedral@dslb-092-074-232-158.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 18:06:03 <Morloth> Does somebody know how I can apply a couple of patches at once? I want to try something like: 'patch -p0 < `cat patches/*`' << But this construction doesn't work... 18:06:16 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host246-159-dynamic.56-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 18:07:08 <Wolf01> 'hello 18:07:21 <glx> cat patches/* | patch -p0 18:07:40 <Belugas> hello mister conflict, though... 18:07:45 <Belugas> hello Wolf01 :) 18:09:18 <Morloth> glx, thx :) 18:11:08 *** dih_ [~dihedral@dslb-088-066-142-195.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:13:04 *** dih_ [~dihedral@dslb-088-066-151-104.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 18:13:43 <debian__> What I meant was, can I move it from one track to another if tey are connected to the same station? 18:14:43 <Yexo> debian__, what do you want to move? 18:16:42 <Eddi|zuHause2> so much for IRC being a real time communication system ;) 18:19:18 *** dih| [~dihedral@dslb-092-074-232-158.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:21:10 <Morloth> glx: Is this better: http://bugs.openttd.org/task/1785 ? 18:21:11 <glx> Morloth: why opening a new task? 18:21:20 <Morloth> lol, that was fast :) 18:21:57 <Morloth> glx: Well I figured the old one was kind of depricated ? 18:22:26 <glx> you can add comments and attach new files 18:22:40 <glx> and the purpose of the patch didn't change 18:23:03 <debian__> Trains 18:23:50 *** UFO64-alt [UFO64@john-michael-murray.um.maine.edu] has joined #openttd 18:23:50 *** UFO64 [UFO64@john-michael-murray.um.maine.edu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:24:07 <Morloth> glx: you're right, my bad 18:24:54 <debian__> Can I get intrest for having money? 18:25:17 *** Tefad [~tefad@c-71-63-20-187.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 18:25:40 <Yexo> debian__, you don't get interest. 18:26:06 *** peter1138 [~petern@petern.bnsnet.co.uk] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 18:26:20 <Eddi|zuHause2> nobody gets interest from having money 18:26:29 <Yexo> and you can't move (in the sense of teleport) trains within a station 18:26:29 <Eddi|zuHause2> interest comes from investing money 18:27:41 *** Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-89-217-184-139.adslplus.ch] has joined #openttd 18:28:05 <Eddi|zuHause2> i miss using Alt+ââââ for moving the mouse :( 18:28:14 <debian__> Eddi|zuHause2: I get instres in my bank 18:28:36 <Eddi|zuHause2> debian__: yes, because you lend your money to the bank, not because you have the money 18:29:04 <Eddi|zuHause2> that is the easiest form of investment 18:29:09 <Eddi|zuHause2> also gives the least interest 18:29:09 <debian__> How much money should I have in 1980? 18:29:22 <Prof_Frink> Eddi|zuHause2: But that involves two keys, whereas <wiggles mouse> means your fingers don't leave the home row 18:29:25 <Eddi|zuHause2> i have 4.000.000.000 DM 18:30:02 <Eddi|zuHause2> Prof_Frink: occasionally, i get tired of holding the mouse 18:30:19 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 18:30:20 <Eddi|zuHause2> it's a little too small for my paws... 18:30:41 <Prof_Frink> Well, I'd have to move my fingers from the home row to use the mouse 18:31:49 <Eddi|zuHause2> these two statements seem opposite to me... or i am missing your point... 18:32:20 <debian__> I have -60.000 18:32:42 <Prof_Frink> I can haz ThinkPad 18:32:44 <debian__> I', just curious 18:33:12 <Eddi|zuHause2> oh that explains a bit ;) 18:33:27 *** Wezz6400 [~Wezz6400@145-118-108-75.fttx.bbned.nl] has joined #openttd 18:33:29 <Eddi|zuHause2> i hate touchpads... they always go off without me wanting to... 18:33:42 <Tefad> some laptops have a touchpad silence button 18:33:51 <Prof_Frink> Eddi|zuHause2: Again, ThinkPad. 18:33:54 <debian__> My oil thing dissapeared... Why? 18:34:05 <Gonozal_VIII> they do that 18:35:19 <debian__> Annoying 18:35:32 <debian__> Now most of my inncome dissapeared 18:35:53 *** Zaviori [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:35:53 <Gonozal_VIII> you have to adapt 18:35:59 <Eddi|zuHause2> around 1980, all oil wells close down, and instead oil platforms appear 18:36:17 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB46D7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Osai] 18:36:28 <Tefad> unless you have no water large enough, eh? 18:36:29 <debian__> But I donno how to build ships 18:37:22 <Eddi|zuHause2> look at the top of your screen, you have icons for railway track, road, waterways and airports 18:37:32 <Eddi|zuHause2> each stands for one transport type 18:37:47 <Eddi|zuHause2> use waterways for building ships and canals 18:38:18 <Eddi|zuHause2> you can hold the right mouse button, then it explains what this icon does 18:38:35 *** UFO64-alt [UFO64@john-michael-murray.um.maine.edu] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:38:39 *** UFO64 [UFO64@john-michael-murray.um.maine.edu] has joined #openttd 18:39:12 <debian__> But I donno how to build ships 18:39:18 <debian__> sorry 18:39:22 <debian__> Stupid putthy 18:39:40 <Prof_Frink> debian__: Much like trains or RVs. 18:39:40 <Gonozal_VIII> same way as other vehicles :P 18:39:50 <Prof_Frink> Build a depot, then click on it. 18:41:05 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d51A473D5.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: oO] 18:42:31 <debian__> I have only built trains 18:42:49 <Gonozal_VIII> see.. same 18:45:18 <Prof_Frink> Well, not quite 18:45:37 <Prof_Frink> You don't need to add wagons to ships 18:46:22 <Tefad> no rails 18:46:24 <Gonozal_VIII> hmmm there are ships that consist of linked parts in rl 18:46:27 <Tefad> no train crashes 18:46:52 <Tefad> but you do have buoys, like waypoints 18:48:36 <fjb> Building stations with the new grfs is fun: http://www.myimg.de/?img=QNCGmbH17Nov1935e6670.png 18:49:39 <fjb> Gonozal_VIII: That would hardly work in TTD, ships have no size. 18:54:35 <debian__> How can I make an railroad one wa`y? 18:54:35 *** tokar [~tokar@othala.n7mm.org] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:54:47 <glx> use signals 18:54:53 *** dih| [~dihedral@dslb-088-066-135-233.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 18:54:58 <debian__> Where? 18:55:20 <SmatZ> everything has 'no size', only collision distances :) 18:55:36 <Prof_Frink> debian__: http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/Signals 18:55:40 <fjb> Ships don't even have that. :-P 18:58:23 *** dih [~dihedral@dslb-088-066-150-186.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 18:58:57 <debian__> I dont understand that... 18:59:35 <fjb> Try it out. It is just a game. 18:59:46 <debian__> What if I crash an train? 19:00:43 <fjb> Then you have to buy a bew one. 19:00:46 <fjb> buy 19:00:50 <fjb> new 19:00:56 <fjb> Sorry. 19:01:07 *** dih_ [~dihedral@dslb-088-066-151-104.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:01:32 *** Zaviori [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 19:02:59 *** peter1138 [~petern@217.151.109.242] has joined #openttd 19:03:00 *** mode/#openttd [+o peter1138] by ChanServ 19:03:16 *** dih_ [~dihedral@dslb-088-066-138-146.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 19:03:47 *** dih| [~dihedral@dslb-088-066-135-233.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:04:05 *** tokar [~tokar@othala.n7mm.org] has joined #openttd 19:04:52 *** dih| [~dihedral@dslb-088-066-157-235.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 19:05:06 *** UFO64 [UFO64@john-michael-murray.um.maine.edu] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:05:27 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc332161-a.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:05:29 *** yorick [~yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 19:06:27 <Eddi|zuHause2> or reload ;) 19:06:55 *** XeryusTC [~irc@cc332161-a.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has joined #openttd 19:07:38 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:08:03 <debian__> How can I get billions without doing nothing? 19:08:17 <Prof_Frink> By doing lots of things. 19:09:37 *** dih [~dihedral@dslb-088-066-150-186.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:10:16 *** dih [~dihedral@dslb-088-066-157-255.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 19:10:54 <peter1138> By cheating :D 19:11:08 <debian__> peter1138: Listening... 19:11:17 *** dih_ [~dihedral@dslb-088-066-138-146.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:11:23 <peter1138> Well that's all I was going to say... 19:12:00 <Eddi|zuHause2> well, you'll have to find that button on your own i presume ;) 19:13:14 <Eddi|zuHause2> hm... i take suggestions for beautification of this station... www.informatik.uni-halle.de/~krause/Ravenswald%20Transport,%202.%20Mai%201985.png 19:14:17 *** dih| [~dihedral@dslb-088-066-157-235.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:15:02 <peter1138> What's that middle track doing there? 19:15:24 <Eddi|zuHause2> hm, that's an old track for reversing trains 19:15:41 <Eddi|zuHause2> commonly known as "Spitzkehre" 19:16:16 <Eddi|zuHause2> it's not used anymore since the opening of the western goods tracks 19:16:51 <Eddi|zuHause2> i leave it there for hysterical raisins 19:17:52 <Eddi|zuHause2> trains would come from the northwest, turn around, and leave to the southwest 19:18:43 <Eddi|zuHause2> and vice versa 19:19:19 <Eddi|zuHause2> it reached the limits of capacity very quickly, though ;) 19:19:34 *** White_Rabbit [whiterabbi@cpc1-oxfd8-0-0-cust590.oxfd.cable.ntl.com] has quit [] 19:27:09 *** planetmaker is now known as pm|away 19:28:44 <Eddi|zuHause2> fjb: which grf is that? 19:29:12 *** Bjarni [~Bjarni@0x50a46c2b.virnxx14.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 19:29:13 *** mode/#openttd [+o Bjarni] by ChanServ 19:29:21 <Gonozal_VIII> bjarni! 19:29:25 <Eddi|zuHause2> fjb: and why are your buffers not electrified? 19:29:36 <Bjarni> life is a bitch 19:29:51 <fjb> Eddi|zuHause2: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=27112 19:30:04 <fjb> Don't know why they are not. 19:30:08 <Eddi|zuHause2> fjb: and how do you get a BR 75 to carry 500t coal? 19:30:24 <fjb> Eddi|zuHause2: flat land. 19:32:14 <Eddi|zuHause2> "- PBS sensitive tiles: some tiles react when they detect a train entering the track. The "train shed" facility opens its doors, for example." <- does that work in OpenTTD? 19:32:53 <Bjarni> hmm 19:32:57 <Bjarni> not that I know of 19:33:09 <Eddi|zuHause2> i mean with the patch ;) 19:33:15 <fjb> Eddi|zuHause2: it does 19:33:18 *** dih [~dihedral@dslb-088-066-157-255.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:33:41 <fjb> It does yapp 4.x 19:33:55 <Bjarni> btw we are really late regarding PBS 19:34:22 <Bjarni> I found an old plan this weekend and it claimed PBS to be finished sometime in May 2006 19:34:31 <Eddi|zuHause2> well, we had PBS two years ago, but someone had to rip it out ;) 19:34:36 <Bjarni> so even if it's finished right away it's almost 2 years late :P 19:35:11 <Bjarni> according to the plan it's YAPF based PBS without the issues we had back then 19:35:39 <peter1138> Yeah... 19:35:53 <Eddi|zuHause2> well, then blame KUDr ;) 19:37:35 <Bjarni> that's not what I meant 19:37:52 <Bjarni> the idea is good enough 19:37:53 <fjb> Better late than never. 19:38:45 <Bjarni> the first implementation just told us how it could be done and the limitations it had so starting over with a new design to avoid those limitations is a good thing 19:39:00 <Bjarni> but it's always a help to know how NOT to do it ;) 19:39:03 <peter1138> And YAPP rocks... 19:39:24 <fjb> Yeah, it does... 19:39:33 <debian__> yapp? 19:39:52 <Eddi|zuHause2> limitation disturbs me very signal ;) 19:40:31 <Gonozal_VIII> hehe who wrote that? 19:40:40 <Eddi|zuHause2> i did. 19:40:46 <Eddi|zuHause2> right there â 19:40:54 <Gonozal_VIII> no i read that in the forum some time ago 19:41:21 <Eddi|zuHause2> yeah. i know... but i forgot who it was 19:47:20 *** Gekz [~brendan@CPE-124-183-21-103.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 19:54:00 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 19:54:41 *** Zaviori [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:55:19 *** Zaviori [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 19:57:06 <DJ-Nekkid> im makeing a grf, and i want the elrails to be more/higher priced then non-electrified ones ... how? ;) 19:57:09 <SpComb> tcp6 0 0 2002:5282:1012:123:3979 :::* LISTEN 18955/openttd 19:57:09 <SpComb> tcp6 0 11 2002:5282:1012:123:3979 2002:5282:1012:12:45794 ESTABLISHED18955/openttd 19:57:09 <SpComb> tcp6 11 0 2002:5282:1012:12:45794 2002:5282:1012:123:3979 ESTABLISHED19754/openttd 19:57:45 <SpComb> I'm running an IPv6 openttd server on qmsk.ipv6.myottd.net, feel free to join :) 19:58:09 *** Jacy [~personal@212-123-177-242.ip.telfort.nl] has left #openttd [] 19:58:10 <yorick> is that even possible? 19:58:19 <SpComb> evidently 19:58:25 *** Zaviori [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [] 19:58:28 <yorick> :O 19:58:58 <Morloth> SpComb: Isn't that working because of a IP6 -> IP4 tunnel? :) 19:59:10 <SpComb> no, I added in IPv6 support to the code 19:59:20 <SpComb> still needs a bit of tweaking though, doesn't work via e.g. the ingame gui, but it does via -n 20:00:02 <peter1138> Ah... 20:00:15 <peter1138> The server list protocol doesn't support that, of course... 20:00:43 <SpComb> nope, needs a fair amount of work 20:00:57 <SpComb> http://misc.marttila.de/wiki/OpenTTD_IPv6 20:01:25 <SpComb> that's next, first I need to eat... 20:01:44 *** eQualizer [~lauri@dyn15-194.dsl.spy.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Quit: reboot] 20:03:25 *** UnderBuilder [~chatzilla@168.226.106.206] has joined #openttd 20:04:28 *** Bjarni [~Bjarni@0x50a46c2b.virnxx14.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:05:43 <SpComb> status 20:05:43 <SpComb> Client #2 name: 'Player' status: 'active' frame-lag: 1 company: 1 IP: 2002:5282:1012:1234:250:8dff:fed5:c0b9 unique-id: '28e6e7edefe5bd5fa1bb6a6c44bb4cc7' 20:06:03 * SpComb wonders how many things that will break 20:06:45 *** Gekz [~brendan@CPE-124-183-21-103.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 20:07:01 <peter1138> :) 20:09:22 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N748P012.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:10:40 *** eQualizer [~lauri@dyn15-194.dsl.spy.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 20:13:01 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N931P020.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 20:20:11 *** LordAzamath [~LordAzama@ip208.cab23.ltln.starman.ee] has left #openttd [Kopete 0.12.5 : http://kopete.kde.org] 20:25:36 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@xdsl-81-173-234-128.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: NE:RD 1337] 20:34:17 *** Axamentia [~SlayerRag@78.105.140.209] has joined #openttd 20:38:50 *** Leviath [~thomas@z037133.its-s.tudelft.nl] has joined #openttd 20:42:20 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i577B76D7.versanet.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:44:57 *** KritiK [~Maxim@78-106-213-109.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 20:45:56 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i577B76D7.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 20:47:13 *** yorick [~yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Quit: cya] 20:57:48 *** Osai_old [~Osai@pD9EB46D7.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 20:57:48 *** Osai_old is now known as Osai 21:05:05 <DJ-Nekkid> doesnt the prop 0E for trains action0 work as it (might) do in ttdp? 21:05:54 <DJ-Nekkid> 0D \b255 0E 9A 4B 00 00 <-- points at aircraft puch cost 21:07:03 <DaleStan> It works as long as you specify one of the three documented pointers. Pick another value and all bets are off. Never mind that the documentation says you can point to other base costs too. 21:07:49 <DJ-Nekkid> so only steam/diesel/electrics? 21:08:27 <peter1138> Yes, only those work in OpenTTD. 21:08:35 <DJ-Nekkid> oh... 21:08:41 <DJ-Nekkid> damn :) hehe 21:08:51 <DJ-Nekkid> gotta figure out something else then... 21:09:25 <DJ-Nekkid> there is something about the general action 0, prop 08 ... 21:09:26 *** Brianetta [~brian@77-103-231-158.cable.ubr05.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 21:09:38 <DJ-Nekkid> but thoose seem to effect all costs? 21:10:18 <peter1138> Yes, that's what base costs are. 21:10:40 <DJ-Nekkid> but if i use that prop08 it will change all base costs? 21:12:46 <DJ-Nekkid> -1 * 0 00 08 01 01 2A 08 <factor> should change the 2A (steam running cost) by some kind of factor? 21:13:13 <DJ-Nekkid> *try* 21:16:57 *** Zealotus [~Nemesis@217-211-211-179-no70.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #openttd 21:21:02 <DJ-Nekkid> hmm... 21:22:48 <DJ-Nekkid> yey 21:23:31 <SpComb> yay, now I get to replace every call to inet_ntoa etc. with something proper 21:30:31 <debian__> Can openttd utilize dual-core cpus? 21:30:56 <Gonozal_VIII> no dual core, no gpu 21:33:38 <debian__> No gpu? 21:34:07 <debian__> So I can run it without 3d acceleration? 21:34:30 <peter1138> No 3D acceleration is involved... 21:34:31 <Gonozal_VIII> does it look 3d?^^ 21:34:38 <debian__> Kinda... 21:34:46 <debian__> Can I apt-get it? 21:35:05 *** tokar [~tokar@othala.n7mm.org] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:35:05 <debian__> On debian? 21:35:20 *** tokar [~tokar@othala.n7mm.org] has joined #openttd 21:35:38 <DJ-Nekkid> peter1138: im not sure if it's a bug ... or if it should be filed as one but: if i add running costs to a wagon via newgrf, it dont show up in the buy menu... 21:37:01 <Gonozal_VIII> wagons have running cost? 21:37:16 <DJ-Nekkid> not usually perhaps, but they should... 21:37:24 <DJ-Nekkid> and it's possible to add it 21:37:52 <DaleStan> debian__: Debian unstable, I believe you can. 21:38:16 <debian__> DaleStan: I have super stable... 21:38:25 <debian__> DaleStan: Can I still have it? 21:38:28 *** tokar [~tokar@othala.n7mm.org] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:38:37 <Eddi|zuHause2> why would you do that? 21:39:09 <DaleStan> debian__: Yes. "$ ./configure && make" 21:39:24 <debian__> DaleStan: Compiling? 21:39:45 <DaleStan> Or you can download the package. 21:39:50 <peter1138> DJ-Nekkid, OpenTTD does not support running costs for wagons. 21:40:06 <DJ-Nekkid> peter1138: it support it, it just dont show in the menu 21:40:20 *** tokar [~tokar@othala.n7mm.org] has joined #openttd 21:40:35 <DJ-Nekkid> or something 21:40:35 <DJ-Nekkid> hmm 21:40:37 <Eddi|zuHause2> hm, mountain routes would be so much easier if i had diagonal slopes, stations and tunnels/bridges 21:41:03 <debian__> OpenTTD doesnt use 3d accelleration? 21:41:17 <Eddi|zuHause2> nothing is 3D about openttd 21:41:21 <Prof_Frink> no, openttd still does not use 3d acceleration 21:41:30 <Gonozal_VIII> change the map to 6 sided tiles :-) 21:41:31 <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause2, lots is 3D... 21:41:38 <debian__> Does it run on 600mhz duron? 21:41:52 <Gonozal_VIII> it runs on cell phones 21:41:54 <debian__> peter1138: Now I'm relly confused... 21:41:58 <Eddi|zuHause2> TT original ran on 25MHz 21:42:02 <debian__> Gonozal_VIII: Where to download? 21:42:08 <Gonozal_VIII> forum... 21:42:20 <peter1138> Where to download what? 21:42:47 <debian__> peter1138: openttd for my cellularphone! 21:43:09 <DJ-Nekkid> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=35942 21:43:10 <DJ-Nekkid> there 21:43:57 <Eddi|zuHause2> Gonozal_VIII: the advanced daylength patch, does that reduce town growth? 21:44:10 <Gonozal_VIII> nope 21:44:18 <Gonozal_VIII> should it? 21:44:26 <Eddi|zuHause2> do you accept feature requests? :p 21:45:00 <Gonozal_VIII> i accept features in patch form^^ 21:45:23 <debian__> But it needs symbian... 21:45:28 <Eddi|zuHause2> that is easy ;) 21:46:48 <debian__> Eddi|zuHause2: Can I install symbian on an java phone? 21:47:02 <Eddi|zuHause2> debian__: i was not replying to you 21:47:06 <Wolf01> 'night 21:47:11 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host246-159-dynamic.56-82-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 21:47:29 <Gonozal_VIII> port it to java ;-) 21:47:45 <debian__> Gonozal_VIII: Port openttd or symbian for java? 21:47:51 <Gonozal_VIII> openttd 21:48:08 <Gonozal_VIII> wouldn't make sense to run an os in java^^ 21:48:18 <debian__> Gonozal_VIII: Could be done 21:49:21 <debian__> So then I have to learn java and c++. Is it difficult to open-source games? 21:50:18 <Gonozal_VIII> java and c++ have a lot in common 21:50:33 <Gonozal_VIII> but the data type stuff is completely different 21:50:45 <debian__> But if I find an game, is it hard to opensource it? 21:50:50 <Eddi|zuHause2> i don't think that attempt will lead anywhere :p 21:51:02 <DJ-Nekkid> debian__: reverse engeneering 21:51:56 <debian__> DJ-Nekkid: How long? 21:52:09 <ln-> for you, approximately 75 years and 3 months. 21:52:17 <debian__> LoL 21:53:09 <debian__> But open tdd only took a few years? 21:53:25 *** Jortuny [~octernion@r253186120.resnet.cornell.edu] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 21:54:32 <DJ-Nekkid> it started in 2001 or something i think 21:55:08 <Gonozal_VIII> and it will be finished in the year 3001 or something^^ 21:55:27 <DJ-Nekkid> prolly :) 21:55:32 <Eddi|zuHause2> Gonozal_VIII: in town_cmd.cpp, there is a function "void OnTick_Town()", add there a line like "if (_tick_counter % _patches.daylength != 0) return;" 21:56:23 <ln-> has anyone tried compiling C code for the JVM? 21:56:48 <ln-> after appropriate conversion. 21:56:57 <Belugas> debian__, your question about the lenght of a conversion project is related to the size of the original binary 21:57:09 <Belugas> and of course, your skill levell 21:57:14 <Gonozal_VIII> isn't there other stuff that happens based on ticks too? 21:57:19 <Gonozal_VIII> in towns.. 21:57:24 <ln-> Belugas: and if one has to ask, the skill level is zero. 21:57:56 <Belugas> not to me to judge ;) 21:58:06 <Eddi|zuHause2> Gonozal_VIII: i see only calls to GrowTown(.) and UpdateTownRadius(.) 21:58:15 <debian__> Ok 21:58:29 <debian__> But is every game beeing open-sourced? 21:58:44 <ln-> of course not. 21:59:00 <Eddi|zuHause2> Gonozal_VIII: you can also go one level higher in landscape.cpp, then you can also affect tree growth and stuff 21:59:02 <Belugas> lol 21:59:14 *** NukeBuster [~wouter@a62-251-21-79.adsl.xs4all.nl] has quit [Quit: using sirc version 2.211+KSIRC/1.3.12] 21:59:18 <Belugas> night, going home 22:00:04 <Gonozal_VIII> ic ic... if (_patches.daylength_towngrowth && _tick_counter % _patches.daylength != 0) return; 22:00:25 *** UFO64 [~UFO64@brodeurmb2.umeres.maine.edu] has joined #openttd 22:01:27 <Gonozal_VIII> but i'm busy watching anime^^ 22:01:44 <Eddi|zuHause2> i've ran out of doctor who episodes... 22:01:49 <Gonozal_VIII> me too 22:02:04 <Gonozal_VIII> but i only watched the three new seasons 22:02:07 <Eddi|zuHause2> i'm not through, the rest is just not finished 22:02:35 <glx> <Gonozal_VIII> but i'm busy watching anime^^ <-- which one? 22:02:38 <Gonozal_VIII> hmmm sarah connor thingy should be tere too 22:02:48 <Eddi|zuHause2> it is... 22:03:14 <Eddi|zuHause2> it's in the queue right after skins ;) 22:03:31 <Eddi|zuHause2> but knight rider is not finished yet 22:03:42 <Eddi|zuHause2> it's taking forever 22:03:56 <Gonozal_VIII> it's called ah (or oh) my goddess, a friend gave me a link to it earlier today 22:04:02 <Eddi|zuHause2> 1 Day 9:46 22:04:09 <glx> Gonozal_VIII: nice one 22:04:33 <Eddi|zuHause2> i don't usually watch anime... 22:04:33 <glx> I saw both seasons and the 20th anniversary episodes 22:05:43 <Gonozal_VIII> but watching japanese with english subs is suboptimal... can't watch and read well at the same time 22:06:03 <glx> I have it with french subtitles :) 22:06:17 <Gonozal_VIII> yes, he gave me that link first^^ 22:06:29 <Gonozal_VIII> very useful^^ 22:07:16 <Gonozal_VIII> i found some episodes of the first season in german and/or english dub 22:07:52 *** NukeBuster [~wouter@a62-251-21-79.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 22:08:22 <Gonozal_VIII> but that was on youtube... low quality and split up in 3-4 parts per episode 22:08:32 <Eddi|zuHause2> german dub of animes is often cut 22:08:50 <Eddi|zuHause2> because they are usually shown in daytime program 22:09:11 <Gonozal_VIII> no blood or nakedness there anyways... 22:10:26 <Eddi|zuHause2> also often, "strong language" is reduced in the dub 22:11:15 <Eddi|zuHause2> i already fear what they are going to do to the poor dexter... 22:12:10 <ln-> i'm assuming you are not talking about Darkly Dreaming Dexter? 22:12:49 <Eddi|zuHause2> sure i am 22:13:30 <ln-> the crime scene investigator? 22:13:38 <Eddi|zuHause2> yes, that one 22:14:29 <ln-> a nice series. 22:14:41 <Eddi|zuHause2> one of the greatest series of all times ;) 22:14:51 <ln-> but not much strong language, as far as i remember. 22:15:05 <Eddi|zuHause2> ever listened to Deb talking? 22:15:30 <Eddi|zuHause2> like every second word out of her mouth is "fuck" 22:15:34 <ln-> ah, yes, that's true. 22:15:49 *** NukeBuster [~wouter@a62-251-21-79.adsl.xs4all.nl] has left #openttd [] 22:15:50 <ln-> maybe i just ignore most of what women say? :) 22:16:12 <ln-> the novel is a-ok too. 22:16:50 <Eddi|zuHause2> like that one conversation she has: [witty comment from someone] "Fuck you!" [another witty comment] "Fuck you twice" 22:18:17 *** Yexo [Yexo@32-88-ftth.onsneteindhoven.nl] has quit [Quit: Ik ga weg] 22:19:55 <SpComb> hmm... does does OpenTTD's build system work? I'm getting linker errors because I'm trying to use two functions from network/network.cpp in network/network_udp.cpp 22:20:31 <ln-> the current build system is crap. 22:20:45 <glx> it's better than it used to be 22:20:54 <ln-> it used to be better. 22:21:18 <SmatZ> ln-: come with something new and better, and it may be implemented 22:21:43 <peter1138> You're entitled to your opinion, even if it is wrong... 22:22:00 <SpComb> nevermind, some issues with argument const-ness 22:22:44 <ln-> Eddi|zuHause2: the author often uses three-D combinations such as "Darkly Dreaming Dexter", "Dearly Devoted Deborah", ... some work for german translators. 22:23:14 <Eddi|zuHause2> ln-: this kind of thought usually gets totally translated away... 22:23:58 <Eddi|zuHause2> like when in Charmed, all episode titles are references to movies or common phrases... nothing left in the translation, except in some rare incidences... 22:24:08 *** NukeBuster [~wouter@a62-251-21-79.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 22:25:12 <ln-> the first ~110 pages of the novel are exactly as in the tv series, but then things start going different. 22:25:45 <Eddi|zuHause2> you can't stick to the books forever... 22:27:37 <ln-> the Da Vinci Code movie was good at it. 22:27:50 <ln-> though the book was written like a movie script. 22:29:19 *** UFO64 [~UFO64@brodeurmb2.umeres.maine.edu] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:29:54 <Eddi|zuHause2> pretty much all movies that i know books for divert quite a bit 22:30:11 <Eddi|zuHause2> but i read about as many books as i watch anime ;) 22:31:49 <UnderBuilder> I don't understand why the dedicated server requires the TTD files 22:31:58 <UnderBuilder> it doesn't use it 22:32:58 <ln-> it does 22:33:02 *** DJ-Nekk|d [~DJNekkid@static128-249.adsl.no] has joined #openttd 22:33:04 <Eddi|zuHause2> in the past, some game mechanics depended on sprite sizes and stuff 22:33:43 <Eddi|zuHause2> what you can try is replace all sprites with empty ones 22:33:45 *** fjb_ [~frank@p5485C7F0.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 22:35:58 *** helb [~helb@62.240.176.23] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:36:08 *** DJ-Nekkid [~DJNekkid@static128-249.adsl.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:37:09 *** mcbane [~Maui_key@p5498CEB8.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [] 22:37:20 *** helb [~helb@62.240.176.23] has joined #openttd 22:41:11 *** fjb [~frank@p5485D291.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:41:37 <Eddi|zuHause2> passenger wagons are too short :( 22:41:48 <Gonozal_VIII> too short? 22:42:05 <Eddi|zuHause2> yes, they'd look much better if they were 50% longer 22:43:17 <Eddi|zuHause2> i have 10 tile cargo trains, but 10 tile passenger trains look ugly 22:43:47 <Gonozal_VIII> longer wagons would look weird in curves 22:43:55 <Eddi|zuHause2> with 50% longer wagons, 12 wagons would be 9 tiles, plus engine 22:44:09 *** divo [~asd@0x4dd443c6.adsl.cybercity.dk] has quit [Quit: Quitting] 22:44:10 <Eddi|zuHause2> that is a different issue ;) 22:45:40 <Eddi|zuHause2> but fact is, the passenger wagons are artificially shortened 22:47:38 *** fjb_ is now known as fjb 22:54:40 <SpComb> http://misc.marttila.de/wiki/OpenTTD_IPv6 <-- feedback? 22:54:48 <SpComb> it's at the point that it "works" now 22:55:24 <ln-> IPv4 ought to be enough for anyone 22:55:53 <ln-> not really :) 22:56:45 <glx> like 640KB is enough :) 22:57:04 <SpComb> no working broadcast either 22:57:28 <Gonozal_VIII> memory and ips are not really the same 22:58:02 <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause2, ah... and I always remember the people waiting for 32bpp who thought that would solve every problem... 22:58:08 <Gonozal_VIII> current ips could still be enough for lots of years if they were used differently 22:58:18 <SpComb> but eventually, they will run out 22:58:32 <SpComb> you might be able to delay it until, oh, 2020, but it's still going to happen 22:58:38 <Prof_Frink> Eventually, the sun will run out of hydrogen 22:58:40 <Gonozal_VIII> yep 22:58:52 <glx> mainly because 1 country reserved more than 50% 22:58:55 <Eddi|zuHause2> or the earth run out of oil... 22:58:55 <Prof_Frink> SpComb: You only need to delay it until 2038 22:58:57 <Eddi|zuHause2> err... wait... 22:59:04 <Prof_Frink> The the unixverse ends. 22:59:20 <Prof_Frink> ^n 22:59:22 <Eddi|zuHause2> the real y2k ;( 22:59:23 <Eddi|zuHause2> ;) 23:00:15 <Gonozal_VIII> what will they do then? extend to 64 bit? 23:00:52 <peter1138> Just change the epoch ;) 23:01:08 <ln-> there must be a lot of unused IPv4 addresses... i've been told that a lot of small companies in finland who need maybe ~8 static IPs have been given the whole 65k block of IPs. 23:01:13 <SpComb> time_t is already 64 bits these days, isn't it? 23:01:19 <ln-> "a lot" = more than 1 23:01:33 <ln-> SpComb: on what platform? 23:01:34 <Fujitsu> SpComb: No. 23:01:42 <SpComb> 64-bit linux? 23:01:46 <Fujitsu> SpComb: There are issues with compatibility with file formats, so it's 32-bit. 23:01:59 <SpComb> so time64_t or somesuch? 23:02:02 <Fujitsu> If time_ts weren't in lots of file formats, it'd be easy to change. 23:02:15 <Eddi|zuHause2> SpComb: actually, making it unsigned would give them another 70 years 23:02:44 <Gonozal_VIII> it's signed? why that? 23:02:56 <Eddi|zuHause2> because someone thought that was funny ;) 23:02:58 <ln-> Gonozal_VIII: the negative time for the past. 23:03:13 <ln-> time_t can express dates from ~1901 .. 2038 23:04:21 <Gonozal_VIII> who needs that? 23:04:51 <Prof_Frink> alan@frinkserv:~$ date --date="Jan 01 2039" --> date: invalid date `Jan 01 2039' 23:04:54 <Prof_Frink> alan@frinkpad:~$ date --date="Jan 01 2039" --> Sat Jan 1 00:00:00 GMT 2039 23:05:23 <ln-> Gonozal_VIII: dunno, but it's for example a valid range for expressing anyone's birthday on this channel. 23:06:01 <ln-> it's also a valid range for expressing any employee's birthdate in any company. 23:09:26 <ln-> which was true even in 1970. 23:11:06 <ln-> remains to be seen if time_t is used in 2038 anymore. 23:12:51 <ln-> speak! 23:13:08 <Prof_Frink> No. 23:13:12 <Prof_Frink> Oh, bollocks. 23:13:44 *** DJ-Nekk|d [~DJNekkid@static128-249.adsl.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:18:26 <ln-> sie wissen wir haben kein elefant. 23:19:58 *** lobster [~aap@86.89.201.189] has quit [Quit: i have your testiculae. be afraid.] 23:21:11 <Gonozal_VIII> ln? 23:21:24 <Gonozal_VIII> what a strange thing to say 23:21:53 <Gonozal_VIII> incorrect too.. 23:25:03 <Eddi|zuHause2> wah, my E94 are getting old... 23:25:13 <Eddi|zuHause2> how dare they 23:26:53 *** TinoM [~Tino@i59F57D51.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 23:27:23 <Eddi|zuHause2> when's the next livery due? 1987? 23:27:59 *** DJ-Nekkid [~DJNekkid@static128-249.adsl.no] has joined #openttd 23:28:33 <fjb> Eddi|zuHause2: What color do they have? 23:28:48 <Eddi|zuHause2> the E94? grey 23:28:57 <Eddi|zuHause2> the green ones are younger 23:29:28 <Eddi|zuHause2> the grey ones are mainly on the woods route, the green ones on the coal route 23:29:33 <fjb> That is usual. Why do you think they are odd? 23:29:47 <Gonozal_VIII> old, not odd 23:29:58 <fjb> Oh, sorry. 23:30:06 <fjb> I think I need new glasses. 23:30:45 <fjb> Next livery will be cream blue, mid 70s to late 80s. 23:31:15 <Eddi|zuHause2> i'm already 1985 23:31:44 <ln-> Gonozal_VIII: you have an elephant? 23:31:52 <fjb> Not all got repainted. E94 looked much better in green livery anyway. 23:33:15 <Gonozal_VIII> you wrote "you/they know we have no elephant" 23:33:36 <ln-> yes, that's exactly what i wrote. 23:33:53 <Gonozal_VIII> but it should be keinen not kein 23:33:56 <Eddi|zuHause2> it's "keinen" though 23:34:15 <ln-> ah, i suspected that. 23:34:18 <Gonozal_VIII> and it doesn't make any sense 23:34:24 <Eddi|zuHause2> and "Elefanten" 23:34:46 <ln-> it's supposed to be singular. 23:34:47 <Eddi|zuHause2> though most germans probably wouldn't recognise this error either 23:35:12 <Gonozal_VIII> is that mandatory? 23:35:44 <Eddi|zuHause2> yes, but it's Akkusativ ;) 23:36:20 <Gonozal_VIII> that doesn't matter, it's plural 23:36:37 <Gonozal_VIII> normal akkusativ singular would be elefant 23:36:42 <fjb> Eddi|zuHause2: Most germans won't recognise it? It sounds horribly wrong. But maybe you are right... 23:37:08 <Gonozal_VIII> den elefant 23:37:20 <Gonozal_VIII> that plural thing is some other rule 23:37:27 <fjb> "keinen Elefanten" is singular. "keine Elefanten" is plural. 23:38:26 <Gonozal_VIII> the word elefanten is plural of elefant 23:38:37 <Eddi|zuHause2> you are generalising too much 23:38:56 <Eddi|zuHause2> "mit dem Elefanten/ohne den Elefanten", both singular 23:39:09 <Eddi|zuHause2> google is about 50/50 on that... 23:39:24 <Gonozal_VIII> yes but why is it in plural form? 23:39:35 <Eddi|zuHause2> it is not plural form 23:39:40 <SmatZ> :-D 23:39:40 <fjb> It is not pliural. 23:39:57 <Gonozal_VIII> elefant is singular :P 23:40:05 <SmatZ> do people in Austria so different than people in Germany? 23:40:09 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-136-225-75.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:40:11 <SmatZ> *speak 23:40:25 <fjb> Gonozal_VIII: You are Austrian, you don't understand that. That is german. 23:40:32 <Gonozal_VIII> ^^ 23:40:38 <Eddi|zuHause2> SmatZ: the grammar shouldn't differ that much, but the pronounciation is evil ;) 23:40:48 <SmatZ> :-) 23:40:54 <fjb> SmatZ: That is because we didn't allow them to be germans. 23:40:59 <SmatZ> :-x 23:41:09 <Gonozal_VIII> host wos gegn mei aussproch? :O 23:41:11 <ln-> Eddi|zuHause2: pronunciation 23:41:34 <Eddi|zuHause2> ln-: that looks horrible... 23:41:49 <ln-> Eddi|zuHause2: yeah, don't blame me for the spelling, but that's how it's spelled. 23:41:52 <Eddi|zuHause2> Gonozal_VIII: nix effektives 23:42:01 <Gonozal_VIII> :P 23:42:41 <Gonozal_VIII> evil 23:46:48 *** Osai is now known as Osai^zZz 23:47:24 <Eddi|zuHause2> it's bad that you cannot repaint engines 23:48:20 <ln-> the lines/minute has gone too low, attempting recover. 23:48:28 <ln-> dÃŒrer hat nie ein autovermietungsfirma. 23:48:51 <Sacro> ich bin vergessen 23:48:57 <Eddi|zuHause2> "hatte" 23:49:19 <ln-> ok 23:49:29 <Eddi|zuHause2> "nie" always with past or future, doesn't make sense with present 23:49:30 <fjb> eine Autovermietungsfirma. 23:49:37 <fjb> Firma is female. 23:49:37 <Sacro> mein hatte es hatta drei corners... 23:50:01 <Eddi|zuHause2> Sacro: almost ;) 23:50:26 <fjb> Eddi|zuHause2: What color do you want your trains? 23:50:57 *** lobster [~michielbi@86.89.201.189] has joined #openttd 23:51:19 <Eddi|zuHause2> fjb: nothing specific right now, but you can't repaint e.g. the grey engines green, or the green engines blue (in case you actually had an E18) 23:51:57 <fjb> E18 would alsways be kind of blue, never green. 23:52:00 <ln-> has anyone else watched the Monty Python special that was made in german? 23:52:30 <fjb> ln-: They don't show that in Germany, the Monty Python people don't allow that. 23:54:01 <Eddi|zuHause2> hm, i actually don't know what colour the E18 originally had 23:54:31 <fjb> One of the most colorful locomotives was the E41. Blue, green, cream blue, read, another kind of red. 23:54:46 *** peter1138 [~petern@217.151.109.242] has quit [Quit: bwaaahahaha, te eeeh eeehee boingk!] 23:54:47 <ln-> fjb: i though it was made for the german audience. 23:54:57 <Eddi|zuHause2> "Die Museumslok E 18 08 im grÃŒnen Lieferanstrich" 23:56:04 <fjb> E18 was blue from the beginning because it's top speed was above 120km/h. 23:56:59 <fjb> ln-: No, it was for english audience. The hat fun speaking a strange kind of german. 23:57:25 <Eddi|zuHause2> fjb: i thought that was the new livery scheme in the 1950's 23:57:56 <ln-> http://youtube.com/watch?v=sE1q0UDZD2U 23:58:08 <Gonozal_VIII> there are some german words in the funniest joke ever 23:58:28 <fjb> Hm, maybe, but I thought that scheme is older. 23:58:59 <fjb> They also did a german version of the lumberjack song. 23:59:03 <Eddi|zuHause2> "Ãber die Lieferfarbe der E 18 wurde schon öfters spekuliert. Der Regelanstrich zu dieser Zeit sah einen blaugrauen Lokkasten vor. Allerdings gibt es Hinweise, dass zumindest einige E 18er mit einem dunkel-grÃŒn-grauen Lokkasten (wie die E 18 08 heute) geliefert sein sollen." 23:59:14 <Eddi|zuHause2> fjb: that's the link ln- gave 23:59:59 <fjb> Maybe it was invented at the same time as the blue color scheme for high speed engines.