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00:00:03 <TrueBrain> svippy: well, other people find Palin awesome (indeed scary), girls like artists, guys love Windows 7, and gay people love Monkey Island 4 ... everyone his 'sane' hobby ;) 00:00:03 <Eddi|zuHause> what he meant to say: find a girlfriend 00:00:06 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@161-18-80-78.strcechy.adsl-llu.static.bluetone.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:00:15 <glx> svippy: you know TrueBrain owns a bot ;) 00:00:15 <Char> Rubidium: still, this is not zimbawe 00:00:17 <TrueBrain> Eddi|zuHause: tnx ;) 00:00:24 <Char> and yes, inflation is on, but it is before 2000 00:00:43 <svippy> glx: I used to. It was crap. 00:00:57 <svippy> Eddi|zuHause: If so, I won't be betting on it, if I were you. 00:01:03 <svippy> Hell, *I* wouldn't even bet on it. 00:01:10 <TrueBrain> svippy: okay, find a boyfriend 00:01:12 <TrueBrain> we don't really care 00:01:16 <svippy> Neither. 00:01:27 <svippy> I am just saying my chances are slim. 00:01:30 <svippy> Wait, you don't care. 00:01:31 <svippy> Got it. 00:01:40 <TrueBrain> wow, he is fast! 00:01:45 <TrueBrain> and yes, I was dissing Futurama 00:01:52 <svippy> TrueBrain: You cannot be serious. 00:02:02 <TrueBrain> can you? 00:02:05 <svippy> I can. 00:02:10 <svippy> And I am right now. 00:02:52 <Eddi|zuHause> i can't ever stay serious when talking about futurama... 00:03:04 * benjamingoodger has probably entered the conversation at a bad time 00:03:05 <svippy> Really? 00:03:07 <TrueBrain> I am trying to hold back, but I have to agree with Eddi|zuHause on this one .. I fail too either :) 00:03:16 <TrueBrain> benjamingoodger: is there ever such thing as a good time? :) 00:03:22 <svippy> Well, just proves how good I am, TrueBrain and Eddi|zuHause. 00:03:26 <svippy> s/good/great 00:03:27 <benjamingoodger> possibly not 00:03:43 <benjamingoodger> as such I am unable to determine whether svippy is a troll or is being picked on unnecessarily 00:03:45 <TrueBrain> svippy: great in which opinion? Of the small people? 00:03:58 <TrueBrain> benjamingoodger: I still wonder about that too :) 00:04:16 <Eddi|zuHause> and it's not even friday 00:04:21 <svippy> TrueBrain: Obviously, the conversation of Futurama did not lead you to suspect I was quoting the very same show. 00:04:23 <glx> well he's Danish ;) 00:04:41 <TrueBrain> svippy: to 'detect' a quote, you have to be an addict 00:04:43 <TrueBrain> which clearly, I am not 00:04:54 <svippy> True, I am an addict, and my friends call it scary. 00:05:01 <svippy> And now that I think about it, it is a bit scary. 00:05:03 <TrueBrain> so ... where does the sane part come in? 00:05:16 <benjamingoodger> oh, for goodness' sake 00:05:22 <svippy> TrueBrain: I stand corrected. It what was all along did not keep me sane. 00:05:35 <svippy> I wonder what does keep me sane then? 00:05:37 <benjamingoodger> I can quote the episode title and, in many cases, number of practically any futurama quote you care to give me 00:05:42 <benjamingoodger> this does not make me insane 00:05:51 <murr4y> I stand correct 00:05:59 <svippy> And the title captions as well, benjamingoodger? 00:06:01 <TrueBrain> I tihnk I should now go to an other channel, and say: I cannot tolerate the other channels, NNN, I have a guy who supports Palin (scary!), a girl who's an artist (need I say more?), some guy keeps making love to Windows 7 (talk about foreplay), some guy who thinks Monkey Island 4 is a great game, and some guy loving Futurama (for heavons sake) 00:06:27 <benjamingoodger> svippy: only for one episode. 00:06:28 <TrueBrain> benjamingoodger: clearly you missed a part of this beautiful conversation 00:06:32 <svippy> Ooo, benjamingoodger. 00:06:36 <svippy> Not good enough. 00:06:41 <benjamingoodger> TrueBrain: I already said that 00:06:45 <TrueBrain> :) 00:06:53 <benjamingoodger> svippy: my point is that I am not insane for knowing all of this 00:06:55 <Eddi|zuHause> i could not name a single episode, let alone arrange them in any order 00:07:03 <svippy> I don't consider myself insane, benjamingoodger. 00:07:04 <TrueBrain> I wouldn't even know what it is about :) 00:07:18 <benjamingoodger> well, I don't consider you insane either 00:07:33 <benjamingoodger> well, that's to be determined, but I don't consider you insane due to futurama obsession 00:07:35 <svippy> Well, well. Seems like we've settled something here tonight. 00:07:37 <Eddi|zuHause> says one crazy person to the other 00:07:46 <TrueBrain> svippy: no, you just agree'd with benjamingoodger on something 00:07:52 <TrueBrain> Eddi|zuHause and I still think you are insane 00:07:57 <svippy> And that is not settling something? 00:08:06 <svippy> Still? You had settled that earlier? 00:08:10 <TrueBrain> nah 00:08:13 <TrueBrain> we just established that 00:08:14 <Eddi|zuHause> but i am not denying it :p 00:08:18 <benjamingoodger> do calm down, everyone 00:08:23 <svippy> Damn politician, Eddi|zuHause! 00:08:30 <TrueBrain> lol @ Eddi|zuHause 00:08:40 <TrueBrain> benjamingoodger: don't take everything too seriously :) 00:08:51 <svippy> benjamingoodger: I just mentioned I ran a Futurama Wiki, and suddenly I am insane. 00:08:58 <benjamingoodger> oh, cool 00:09:11 <benjamingoodger> I have been patiently struggling to start a wiki for some time :) 00:09:28 <svippy> Why would you start a competing wiki? 00:09:31 <TrueBrain> svippy: no, what makes you insane, is that you can't tolerate people who love Windows 7, but we should tolerate you loving Futurama? 00:09:35 <benjamingoodger> not a competing wiki 00:09:55 <svippy> No, TrueBrain, I cannot tolerate *this specific guy* who loves Windows 7. 00:10:01 <svippy> I have met him in Real Life. 00:10:06 <benjamingoodger> this wiki is to document the goings-on of a separate canon I propose to establish with my first book, for purposes of allowing people to make creative-commons stuff using it 00:10:25 <svippy> Your first book? 00:10:35 *** mcbane [~Maui_key@p5498C9FB.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [] 00:10:36 <benjamingoodger> yes, I intend to write others afterward 00:10:44 <svippy> And your first book be about? 00:10:57 <benjamingoodger> well, generally, it's about politics and economics 00:11:06 <svippy> Sounds fun. 00:11:14 <svippy> A lot different from my book. 00:11:16 <benjamingoodger> but it takes the form of a black comedy 00:11:18 <svippy> Which is about space and the future. 00:11:31 <svippy> Oh, so it is fun? 00:11:36 <TrueBrain> and your book comes off the shelves, and benjamingoodger write his own 00:11:54 <benjamingoodger> it's meant to be funny, yes 00:11:56 <svippy> No, TrueBrain, I am actually writing it. 00:12:08 <TrueBrain> a summary of Futurama, I guess? 00:12:11 <svippy> No. 00:12:11 <benjamingoodger> but the characters deal with economic issues 00:12:17 <svippy> What you think I am, stupid, TrueBrain? 00:12:21 <svippy> I have a wiki. 00:12:25 <svippy> That ought to be enough. 00:12:31 <svippy> Write a book about Futurama. 00:12:42 <TrueBrain> svippy: no, the words 'scary' and 'insane' only passed by I believe 00:12:44 <svippy> I mean come on!? I might as well just print the wiki. 00:13:14 <svippy> Anyways, TrueBrain, we were talking about benjamingoodger's book, not mine. 00:13:20 <TrueBrain> benjamingoodger: can we get a pre-copy when it is done? 00:13:39 <TrueBrain> svippy: you started about your book 00:13:54 <benjamingoodger> TrueBrain: well, sure, it will be available online as creative commons. but I will be asking for donations toward a planned film version 00:13:55 <Eddi|zuHause> i should start a book... 00:14:04 *** sigmund_ [~sigmund@91.80-202-245.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd 00:14:11 <benjamingoodger> svippy: email me at benjamingoodger*at*flesbooks.com when your book is complete and I will personally ensure that you receive a high royalty rate if you wish to publish with my company 00:14:19 <svippy> TrueBrain: I just mentioned it, you made me seem silly. 00:14:21 <benjamingoodger> yes, everyone write books 00:14:24 <benjamingoodger> lots of books 00:14:35 <svippy> What is your company, benjamingoodger? 00:14:39 <svippy> And where is it based? 00:14:51 <benjamingoodger> FLES Books, based in the United Kingdom 00:14:55 <TrueBrain> I can only write boring books ;) 00:15:00 <svippy> Mmm... United Kingdom. 00:15:03 <benjamingoodger> TrueBrain: your book can be boring if you like 00:15:14 <svippy> Good thing, benjamingoodger, my book is written in pure British English. 00:15:23 <benjamingoodger> svippy: we only work online though, so please notify my email address above 00:15:49 <benjamingoodger> well, we don't discriminate against other languages... 00:15:52 *** sigmund [~sigmund@91.80-202-245.nextgentel.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:15:55 * Rubidium likes the retro design of http://flesbooks.com/ 00:16:01 <svippy> You should, against American English, benjamingoodger. 00:16:06 <benjamingoodger> Rubidium: nice, isn't it :D 00:16:11 <svippy> Ooooh, it tickles me when I see 'colour' spelt wrong. 00:16:29 <benjamingoodger> Rubidium: the webapp is in final stages of testing, I promise you 00:16:31 * SmatZ colors svippy 00:16:32 <Eddi|zuHause> svippy: there is not even an authority that can divide the two apart 00:16:37 <svippy> Nooooooooo, SmatZ. 00:16:49 <TrueBrain> benjamingoodger: btw, I was serious, I have a high interest in what you are writing :) 00:16:49 <benjamingoodger> Eddi|zuHause: except the Webster and Oxford dictionaries 00:17:06 <TrueBrain> (just to underline the rest is /me being bored ;)) 00:17:08 <benjamingoodger> TrueBrain: ah, in that case, permission to PM? 00:17:12 <TrueBrain> sure 00:17:32 <svippy> TrueBrain: On the contrary to my book, which your assumption about has already dismayed it entirely. 00:17:44 <svippy> Oh, boy, maybe I shouldn't write it at all now! 00:17:55 <benjamingoodger> calm down, svippy 00:17:56 <TrueBrain> svippy: you just made a bad entry, and made yourself a really easy target :) 00:18:04 <svippy> Yeah. 00:18:05 <benjamingoodger> perhaps if you told us about it 00:18:07 <TrueBrain> but I will refrain myself from dissing you any further :) 00:18:08 <svippy> But you are sweet, TrueBrain. 00:18:24 <TrueBrain> I know 00:18:27 <svippy> ;) 00:18:34 <svippy> That's why they call them sweets in Britain. 00:19:11 <svippy> benjamingoodger: I also know a scary bit of difference between British and American English. Despite being dyslexic. 00:19:26 <TrueBrain> lysdectic :) 00:19:36 <svippy> Ooooh, he's a funny one. :) 00:19:47 <TrueBrain> no, I always tell peopple that, then they understand immeaditly what you mean :) 00:19:49 <SmatZ> haha 00:19:53 <Eddi|zuHause> pterodactylus? 00:20:08 <Rubidium> Eddi|zuHause sees them flying... 00:21:06 * Eddi|zuHause never understood why the english people can't speak a "p" before a "t" or an "s" 00:21:35 <Eddi|zuHause> in many greek words, the germans say the "p" while it is silent in english 00:22:29 <svippy> Fear not, Eddi|zuHause. 00:22:32 <Tefad> pseudo 00:22:34 <benjamingoodger> you say "pa-neumatic"? 00:22:47 <svippy> A campaign in the UK is moving Latin words out of English, Eddi|zuHause. 00:22:51 <glx> I just say "pneu" 00:22:58 <svippy> On the grounds that "e.g." could be confused with "eggs". 00:23:00 <Tefad> puh-new 00:23:10 <Tefad> but fast 00:23:35 <benjamingoodger> good grief 00:23:45 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, we germans speak the "p" also in "pneumatisch" 00:23:54 <benjamingoodger> without e.g. where will we get our exemplary gratuities? 00:23:58 *** Yabada [~yabada@151.Red-83-50-22.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [] 00:24:09 <svippy> I dunno, people use "i.e." thinking it stands for "in example". 00:24:10 <TrueBrain> people here are trying to ban english words from the dutch language ... the alternatives they bring are so much fun :) 00:24:13 <svippy> Which btw, doesn't make sense either. 00:24:20 <Tefad> isn't ie 'such that' or similar 00:24:20 <svippy> What the hell is "in example"? 00:24:27 <svippy> I know, Tefad, id est. 00:24:29 <svippy> That is. 00:24:34 <TrueBrain> svippy: from german/dutch, that does make sense ;) 00:24:35 <Tefad> ah 00:24:48 <svippy> :P TrueBrain. 00:24:51 <Tefad> so why not get rid of all the latin phrases in law and science? 00:24:57 <svippy> e.g. is exempli gradia. 00:25:05 <Eddi|zuHause> svippy: we germans have a proper german abbreviation for "zum Beispiel" 00:25:16 <Tefad> i think the problem is lack of education 00:25:21 <svippy> Indeed. 00:25:25 <svippy> I am no fan of plain English. 00:25:28 <benjamingoodger> the problem is a lack of common sense 00:25:33 <svippy> I spell mêlée with the diacritics. 00:25:52 <benjamingoodger> people feel more intelligent by saying "your present interlocutor" than they do by saying "I" 00:26:05 <Tefad> i know people that say mee-lee 00:26:07 <Tefad> )(@#$ 00:26:08 <TrueBrain> L.S. ;) 00:26:44 <svippy> Naïveté is one of my favourites. 00:27:02 <glx> that's french 00:27:03 <Eddi|zuHause> i have never had a conversation where i felt the need to use the word "mêlée" 00:27:13 <TrueBrain> melee attack?! :) 00:27:17 <svippy> glx: But also exists in English. 00:27:22 <glx> Eddi|zuHause: just talk about rugby 00:27:23 *** Yeggstry is now known as Yeggzzz 00:27:34 *** Yeggzzz [~mind@cpc1-rdng14-0-0-cust946.winn.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:27:37 <svippy> Or play some D&D. 00:27:43 <Eddi|zuHause> i have never had the need to have a conversation about rugby either 00:27:53 <svippy> Who has? 00:29:12 <Eddi|zuHause> svippy: that'd still require the D&D game to be held in english, which is rather unlikely 00:29:22 <svippy> Ah, true. 00:29:36 <svippy> You guys translate everything in order to be as bad as English as possible. 00:29:39 <svippy> Just like the French. 00:29:58 <benjamingoodger> svippy: I have college tomorrow, but do please email me about your book if you want my company to publish it... we quote 70% as a royalty rate*, which at a very rough estimate is about 3⬠per copy 00:30:01 <svippy> Watching Futurama in French or German is not my cup of tea. 00:30:04 <benjamingoodger> good night, everybody 00:30:15 <svippy> Good night. 00:30:17 <benjamingoodger> oh, and americans: 00:30:33 <benjamingoodger> if you don't vote tomorrow, and mccain wins, I will hold you personally responsible 00:30:38 <svippy> I'll consider it, benjamingoodger. But I am still far from getting to publishing stages. 00:30:42 <benjamingoodger> night 00:30:59 <svippy> To translate what benjamingoodger wrote, "Don't fsck this up, America!" 00:31:09 <benjamingoodger> indeed. 00:31:13 <Eddi|zuHause> someone said that mccains program sounds actually better for europe 00:31:13 <TrueBrain> night benjamingoodger 00:31:25 <Eddi|zuHause> but nobody listens to what politicians say anyway 00:31:29 <Eddi|zuHause> it's all about charisma 00:31:59 <svippy> Eddi|zuHause: You know, Conservative Europeans. 00:32:06 <svippy> O_O Some guy said something. 00:32:12 <svippy> Better print it on the front pages. 00:32:49 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B77D55.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [] 00:33:09 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B77D64.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 00:33:11 <Eddi|zuHause> well, for the purpose of my statement, it is irrelevant who said it or if it was actually true... 00:33:21 *** benjamingoodger [~ben@host217-44-221-18.range217-44.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: +++ Out Of Cheese Error +++] 00:33:59 *** benjamingoodger [~ben@host217-44-221-18.range217-44.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 00:34:58 <svippy> Dropped you a mail, benjamingoodger. 00:35:12 <benjamingoodger> thank you, sir 00:35:16 * benjamingoodger is away, however 00:35:25 <svippy> I can tell. 00:35:40 <benjamingoodger> quite 00:35:43 <benjamingoodger> thank you for your email 00:35:46 <benjamingoodger> good night 00:35:52 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, from what i have seen of mccain, he seems like a sensible person, and as soon as mister gwb is gone, the low point should be over, no matter who is next 00:36:07 <svippy> I like McCain. 00:36:23 <SmatZ> I like Palin, she's sexy 00:36:31 <TrueBrain> I dig Palin 00:36:34 <TrueBrain> but damn, she is stupid 00:36:39 <SmatZ> hehe 00:36:41 <Eddi|zuHause> i know nothing really about palin 00:39:46 <welshdragon> is nachname surname? 00:39:51 <Eddi|zuHause> the only thing i know is that tina fey played palin a sketch, and then palin played fey in a sketch 00:40:00 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, welshdragon 00:40:31 <welshdragon> Eddi|zuHause, fill this in for me http://www.rhb.ch/Checkout.546.0.html?&L=83168 00:41:18 <welshdragon> or at least tell me what the cell titles are :P 00:41:22 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-136-225-75.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:41:39 <Eddi|zuHause> dict.leo.org 00:42:48 <Eddi|zuHause> and i can't imagine swiss pages not being available in at least half a dozen languages... 00:43:33 *** benjamingoodger [~ben@host217-44-221-18.range217-44.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: +++ Out Of Cheese Error +++] 00:44:08 <Eddi|zuHause> i mean they have 4 native languages anyway... 00:44:40 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, i can't see the page you are seeing... it tells me i have no products selected 00:45:23 <welshdragon> the chechout's still in german :( 00:45:42 <welshdragon> yeah, it's because it uses cookies.... bastard 00:50:51 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-39-137.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:56:04 <welshdragon> aye 00:56:12 <welshdragon> i'll have to wait for my SchrÀgglas 00:59:39 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-39-137.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 01:02:38 <welshdragon> that was fast o_O 01:08:15 *** rubyruy [~ruy@76-10-185-116.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #openttd 01:13:42 *** KritiK [~Maxim@89-178-94-153.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:14:32 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@89.246.176.68] has joined #openttd 01:15:43 <SpComb> Current date: 37686-10-19 01:15:54 <TrueBrain> failure 01:16:20 <Eddi|zuHause> stardate? 01:16:33 <SmatZ> hehe 01:16:41 <SmatZ> Captain's log... 01:16:59 <SpComb> well, grab 0.5.3 and join said game... 01:17:09 <SpComb> but it's too late now, I just shut it down 01:17:39 <TrueBrain> 0.5.3 ... 01:17:42 <SpComb> hmm... forgot to take a look at how much CPU time they had accumulated 01:17:45 <Eddi|zuHause> i have never had a release build since 0.4.0.1 01:17:51 <SpComb> might have reached into the thousands of hours by now 01:18:07 <TrueBrain> why would you use 0.5.3 ... 01:18:09 * SpComb shut down myottd 01:18:13 <TrueBrain> ah 01:18:14 <TrueBrain> that explains :) 01:19:00 <SpComb> # Uptime | System Boot up 01:19:00 <SpComb> ----------------------------+--------------------------------------------------- 01:19:02 <SpComb> -> 1 356 days, 10:46:57 | Linux 2.6.18-5-amd64 Tue Nov 13 16:31:54 2007 01:19:13 <SpComb> hmm... only nine more days until a full year... 01:19:28 <SpComb> well, as someone on thedailywtf forums just said, there's 356 days to a year 01:19:42 <TrueBrain> 356, lol :) 01:19:46 <Eddi|zuHause> 2:19am an 8 Tage 12:03, 18 Benutzer, Durchschnittslast: 0,06, 0,21, 0,32 01:20:11 * SpComb just shut it down as well 01:20:19 <TrueBrain> 55 days here :p 01:20:33 * SpComb has 577 days on his other server 01:20:46 <TrueBrain> 110 days on an other .. 01:20:51 <TrueBrain> 110 days ago we moved to a new DC.. 01:20:55 <TrueBrain> though luck :p 01:21:03 <Eddi|zuHause> well, i have a faulty disk, and my system is much more stable since i realised i still had swap on that disk :p 01:21:30 <glx> hehe 01:21:34 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@89.246.180.47] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:21:35 <SmatZ> :) 01:21:46 <glx> how did it take for you to realise that? 01:21:48 <SmatZ> my server lock ups for some unknown reason 01:21:58 <SmatZ> temperature is normal, nothing is going on 01:22:01 <TrueBrain> 02:21:54 up 333 days, 22:17, 1 user, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00 01:22:02 <SmatZ> then it locks up... 01:22:06 <TrueBrain> 333 days .. hmm .. :) 01:22:08 <SmatZ> :) 01:22:09 <TrueBrain> SmatZ: kernel panic? 01:22:20 <Eddi|zuHause> SmatZ: yeah, that's the same symptom as my problem 01:22:31 <SmatZ> TrueBrain: I don't know, I am running X there (it is used as TV sometimes) 01:22:40 <SmatZ> but keyboard doesn't blink 01:22:44 <TrueBrain> 03:22:28 up 3:23, 4 users, load average: 0.01, 0.07, 0.08 <- Hahahahaha :) (my working station :p) 01:22:44 <SmatZ> it just locks 01:23:25 <TrueBrain> anyway, good night to you all :) 01:23:34 <SmatZ> 02:23:22 up 5 days, 5:58, 1 user, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.03 01:23:35 <Eddi|zuHause> glx: quite long, i'm afraid 01:23:52 <SmatZ> TrueBrain: CEST there? 01:23:52 <Eddi|zuHause> on average, the system ran for a week for the past few months 01:24:04 <SmatZ> same here :) 01:25:27 <SmatZ> http://paste.openttd.org/150122 I don't think the disk is broken there 01:26:34 <Eddi|zuHause> well, it could be faulty RAM as well 01:37:01 <rubyruy> i am trying to edit nshp_ecs.grf (it updates newships to work with ecs) so i can fix the Bulk Freighter not accepting Fish... is this actually much harder then it sounds? :/ 01:38:37 <rubyruy> so 1 little mistery right off the bat is... are the cargo IDs mentioned in this list: http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=ECSCargoTypes going to be the same values used in the nfo file? 01:39:23 <Aali> thats very simple actually, just modify the refit mask 01:39:25 <Aali> they might be 01:39:34 <Aali> unless there's a cargo translation table 01:39:36 <rubyruy> because you'd think then that every cargo ID would have to be mentioned in the nfo file at some point... but for instance 1D (Fiber corps) shows up nowhere in the nfo 01:39:54 <Aali> nah 01:39:59 <Aali> thats not how it works 01:40:07 <Aali> you can use cargo classes, for example 01:40:17 <Aali> and the refit mask is just a bitfield, not a list 01:40:31 <rubyruy> but wouldn't a line somewhere have ot add 1D to whatever cargo class at least? 01:40:40 <rubyruy> oh shoo ... that could be in one of the ecs base grfs right? 01:40:44 <Aali> cargo classes are a property of the cargo 01:40:50 <rubyruy> riiiiight 01:41:27 <rubyruy> http://pastie.textmate.org/306900 <- nfo file 01:41:52 <Aali> either way, try just flipping the listed bit in action 0, property 1D 01:42:25 <rubyruy> like by adding a new line? 01:42:26 <Aali> if that doesn't work you can look for the cargo translation table 01:42:40 <rubyruy> where could i look up cargo classes for ecs? 01:42:46 <Aali> you're not very comfortable with editing nfo files, eh? 01:43:00 <rubyruy> no this is the first time i'm trying it 01:43:01 <Aali> cargo classes and which cargoes belong to which classes are listed on the wiki 01:43:31 <rubyruy> also not very comfortable with binary data formats in general... never thought i'd ever say this but it sure would be nice to be working with an XML based format ;) 01:43:43 <Aali> thats the whole nfo? 01:44:15 <rubyruy> yeah 01:44:18 <rubyruy> that's just nshp_ecs.grf 01:44:35 <Aali> oh, right, ships, i was thinking of trains 01:44:39 <rubyruy> right 01:44:54 <Aali> let me just look that up and i'll fix it for you 01:45:14 <rubyruy> cool thanks :) 01:45:44 <rubyruy> if you can point me in the right direction that would be great too - i'd love to be able to work with these things on my own 01:45:54 <Aali> that long string of upper case characters is a cargo translation table btw 01:46:15 <Aali> read up on action0 01:46:17 <rubyruy> yeah i was actually going to ask - isn't that defined in the ecs base grfs somewhere? 01:46:47 <Aali> cargo translation tables only apply to the vehicles defined in the same grf 01:47:16 <rubyruy> ah ok 01:47:39 <rubyruy> also i did look up action 00 08 but i just found out it can set 'global variables' didn't find out what exactly that entails 01:47:45 <rubyruy> i assume the translation table is stored in such variable? 01:47:52 <Aali> indeed 01:48:15 <rubyruy> is "01 20 00 09" the 'name' ? 01:48:21 <rubyruy> i guess it would be a location 01:49:27 <rubyruy> or wait is the format of action 08 the same as action D ? 01:49:55 <Aali> its an action0 01:50:02 <Aali> feature 08 01:50:51 <Aali> 20 is the size of the table 01:50:58 <Aali> 09 is the code for cargo translation 01:51:16 <rubyruy> oh OHHHHH 01:53:18 <Aali> what does this ship accept? 01:53:39 <Aali> because i assume you dont have the vehicle ID 01:54:35 <rubyruy> http://www.grabup.com/uploads/557ea4f5d4b8cf792b4eb08aee42847c.png 01:55:15 <rubyruy> so the line says set 01 properties of size 20 of variable 09 (cargo table)... what does the 00 mean? 01:55:24 <rubyruy> the spec says "id" 01:55:35 <Aali> 20 00 is actually a word 01:55:46 <rubyruy> ahhhh 02:00:15 <rubyruy> hey so if i read that table right fiber (FICR) is still ID 1D 02:00:30 <Aali> indeed 02:00:43 <Aali> it seems that you're using pikka's construction vector though 02:00:48 <rubyruy> i am 02:00:57 <Aali> so all of the cargoes wont be correct 02:01:02 <rubyruy> wait how can you tell from just the grf? :p 02:01:09 <Aali> the image 02:01:12 <rubyruy> ah 02:01:14 <rubyruy> right 02:01:25 <rubyruy> so where does fiber actually get added to the ship? 02:01:31 <Aali> that cargo translation table isn't used at all though 02:01:44 <rubyruy> because of the construction vector? 02:01:47 <Aali> the only thing that matters is the cargo translation table in newships 02:02:01 <Aali> but i assume they're the same 02:02:10 <rubyruy> i can check - i have it decompiled 02:03:00 <Aali> you should also check for action0 properties 18 and 19 02:03:00 <rubyruy> errr wait a sec but the newships cargo table won't have the ECS goods in it will it? 02:03:14 <rubyruy> like why would it? 02:03:29 <Aali> i think someone just assumed that cargo translation table would work anyway 02:03:35 <Aali> i did the same mistake 02:03:57 <Aali> but i actually moved around some of the cargoes, so i noticed it wasn't working ;) 02:04:14 <rubyruy> heh 02:04:33 <Aali> did you run grf2html on newships? 02:04:40 <rubyruy> nope 02:04:54 <Aali> that should make it easy to find refit masks/property 18/19 02:06:11 <rubyruy> like editing newships.grf directly rather then the ecs fix? 02:06:44 <Aali> nah, but you have to know if property 18/19 are set 02:06:51 <Aali> they change the meaning of the refit mask 02:07:19 <Aali> property 18/19 of course being refittable and non-refittable cargo classes 02:09:04 <Eddi|zuHause> 34 * 10 00 02 01 01 05 11 00 70 00 00 <- take this line for example 02:09:24 <Eddi|zuHause> it sets the refit mask of the ship with ID 05 02:09:36 <Eddi|zuHause> the last 4 bytes is the refit mask 02:09:55 <Eddi|zuHause> each bit refers to an entry in the cargo translation table 02:10:12 <Aali> there is no cargo translation table though 02:10:20 <Aali> or, there is one, but its never used 02:10:55 <rubyruy> grf2html == yay :) 02:11:09 <rubyruy> this is much nicer 02:11:34 <Eddi|zuHause> that may be true, but still you just need to flip the appropriate bit to enable the refit 02:13:28 <Aali> unless cargo classes are set 02:13:52 <Aali> they probably aren't though, since then you wouldn't need an ECS adapter 02:13:57 <Eddi|zuHause> newships is very old 02:14:16 <Eddi|zuHause> long before cargo classes and translation tables were introduced 02:14:24 <Aali> rubyruy: but now that you have newships in html form, you can just look up the vehicle ID 02:15:04 <rubyruy> well i'm not sure how actually :p 02:15:09 <rubyruy> oh wait form newships duh 02:15:23 <Aali> just find the name 02:15:28 <Aali> its an action 4 02:15:39 <Aali> the number will be your ID 02:16:24 <Eddi|zuHause> there aren't that many ships :p 02:16:57 <rubyruy> looks like 08 02:17:17 <Eddi|zuHause> the biggest problem with flipping a bit is finding the right bit to flip :) 02:17:32 <Aali> there's a nice table of all the bits 02:17:51 <rubyruy> so this is my line here ? 37 * 10 00 02 01 01 08 11 42 81 7B 78 02:17:54 *** Korenn [~kvirc@93-125-161-18.dsl.alice.nl] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 3.4.0 Virgo http://www.kvirc.net/] 02:18:05 <rubyruy> the one setting the refit mask for the bulk freighter 02:18:13 <Aali> yep 02:18:32 <rubyruy> ok where are these bitmasks specced? 02:18:47 <Aali> its in the cargo types table 02:18:50 <Eddi|zuHause> 42 81 6V 78 is the bitmask 02:19:58 <Eddi|zuHause> the "2" is the lowest nibble, 1=PASS, 2=COAL, 4=MAIL, 8=OIL_ 02:20:21 <Eddi|zuHause> so this ship can load coal, but not passengers, mail or oil 02:20:21 <glx> 6V ? 02:20:34 <rubyruy> which 2? 02:20:36 <Eddi|zuHause> B, not V 02:20:39 *** rortom [~rortom_@cpc4-cmbg3-0-0-cust464.cmbg.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:20:42 <rubyruy> in 42? 02:20:51 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, in 42 02:21:01 <Eddi|zuHause> the 4 is the next highest nibbles, defining the next 4 cargos 02:21:16 <glx> 787B8142 02:21:18 <Eddi|zuHause> then the 1 is the next higher, then the 8 02:21:28 <glx> 0x... 02:22:30 <Eddi|zuHause> the values are always 1,2,4,8 you add the ones that are allowed to be refit, so 7=1+2+4 meaning 3 cargos can be refit, and the 4th not 02:23:04 <Eddi|zuHause> B means 1+2+8 02:26:03 <Eddi|zuHause> next step: open the grf defining the cargo, and find out which ID the cargo has there 02:26:15 *** Dred_furst [~Dred_furs@resnet628.bournemouth.ac.uk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:26:28 <rubyruy> i think i need a more detailed description of the bitmask... i can't quite follow your description 02:26:30 <Aali> nah, just pull it from the ecs wiki page 02:29:21 <Eddi|zuHause> ok, more detailed. the bitmask is: "42 81 7B 78". these are bytes (8 bit) is in little endian notation, but we split it now in nibbles (4 bit) and rearrange them with the lowest nibble first 02:29:41 <Eddi|zuHause> 2 4 1 8 B 7 8 7 02:29:56 <Eddi|zuHause> now we split each nibble into bits 02:30:06 <Eddi|zuHause> the lowest bit first again 02:30:28 <Aali> the other way around 02:30:40 <Eddi|zuHause> 0100 0010 1000 0001 1101 1110 0001 1110 02:30:41 <Aali> 7 8 7 B 8 1 4 2 02:30:56 <Aali> and the table lists fish as 4000 02:31:02 <Eddi|zuHause> now these bits are exactly in the same order as the translation table above 02:31:08 <Aali> so we add 4 to 8, which makes C 02:31:21 <Aali> and the new mask is 7 8 7 B C 1 4 2 02:31:39 <Aali> or \dx787BC142 in nfospeak 02:33:22 <rubyruy> so .... 2 means "Starting with coal"... and then the 0010 refers to the refitability of coal mail oil and livestock respectively? 02:33:31 <rubyruy> er no that can't be right 02:33:55 <rubyruy> or do we just start from the beginning? 02:34:20 <rubyruy> so the first "0100" means -> PASS: NO, COAL: YES, MAIL: NO, OIL: NO 02:34:24 <rubyruy> and so forth 02:34:29 <rubyruy> ? 02:34:43 <rubyruy> also is Aali right about the whole thing being flipped? 02:34:45 <Aali> its really 0010, but yes 02:35:09 <Eddi|zuHause> PASS COAL MAIL OIL_ - 0100 02:35:12 <Eddi|zuHause> LVST GOOD GRAI WOOD - 0010 02:35:12 <Eddi|zuHause> IORE STEL VALU PAPR - 1000 02:35:13 <Eddi|zuHause> FOOD FRUT FISH WOOL -0001 02:35:15 <Eddi|zuHause> POTA SAND GLAS WDPR - 1101 02:35:16 <Eddi|zuHause> DYES FERT OLSD RFPR - 1110 02:35:20 <Eddi|zuHause> VEHI PETR BRCK SULP - 0001 02:35:20 <Eddi|zuHause> CMNT FICR LIME TOUR - 1110 02:35:21 <Eddi|zuHause> this is the refit mask 02:35:22 <rubyruy> got it 02:36:15 <Eddi|zuHause> so the possible cargos now are COAL, GRAI, IORE, WOOL, POTA, SAND, WDPR, DYES, FERT, OLSD, SULP, CMNT, FICR, LIME 02:38:38 <Eddi|zuHause> so to add FISH now, you flip the 0001 to 0011, which changes the value from 8 to 8+4 = 12 = C 02:39:20 <Aali> thats just confusing though 02:39:27 <Aali> you never write numbers like that 02:39:40 <Aali> 0011 is 3 02:39:51 <Eddi|zuHause> why not? just because you are too narrow minded? 02:40:09 <Eddi|zuHause> i said multiple times that my notation is the lowest bit first 02:40:25 <Eddi|zuHause> because that notation fits exactly with the table, where you start with the lowest index 02:40:26 <Aali> i'm narrow minded because i want the rest of the world to understand what i'm writing? :P 02:40:45 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't care about "the rest of the world" 02:48:19 <rubyruy> err small issue here 02:48:32 <rubyruy> why does CERE not show up in the cargo table list? 02:48:35 <rubyruy> (cereals) 02:48:41 <Eddi|zuHause> <rubyruy> also is Aali right about the whole thing being flipped? <- in maths, there is no "right" or "wrong"... you define it one way or another, and then stick with it, as long as it suits your needs best 02:48:41 <rubyruy> it does end up being an accepted good 02:49:16 <Aali> rubyruy: the cargo translation table has no effect, i thought we went over this 02:49:39 <rubyruy> oh right... but where is it getting the values form then? 02:49:48 <Eddi|zuHause> rubyruy: chances are, cereals just happen to overwrite one of the values from that list 02:49:48 <rubyruy> it can't be newships.grf 02:49:57 <rubyruy> ah 02:50:09 <Eddi|zuHause> it's defined in the appropriate newindustries grf 02:50:39 <Aali> cereals is ID 06 without a translation table 02:51:01 <Eddi|zuHause> which happens to be GRAI in this list 02:51:23 <Eddi|zuHause> so all vehicles that previously accepted grain, now accept cereals instead 02:51:42 <Aali> once again, that list has no effect 02:51:44 <rubyruy> riiiight 02:51:47 *** Char [~Ich@d83-180-237-149.cust.tele2.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:52:13 <Aali> grain isn't defined at all in ECS 02:52:29 <rubyruy> right 02:52:37 <Aali> and it doesn't have to be ID 6 in vanilla although it probably is 02:52:43 <rubyruy> i am still confused a but about the order differences 02:53:12 <Eddi|zuHause> you can write anything backwards, if that fits you better 02:53:14 <rubyruy> so grfcodec spits out 42 81 7B 78 02:53:27 <rubyruy> grf2html calls it 787B8142 02:53:46 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, the first is called little endian, the second is called big endian 02:53:50 <Aali> rubyruy: thats because its in little-endian 02:53:57 <rubyruy> ok so which is way does the game read it? 02:54:06 <Aali> the second is still little endian, but its reading the whole 4 bytes 02:54:16 <rubyruy> i.e. does 7 or 4 correspond to the first 4 goods? 02:54:27 <Aali> neither 02:54:29 <Eddi|zuHause> neither 02:54:32 <Aali> 2 02:54:48 <Aali> +is the first four goods 02:54:48 <rubyruy> 2 then 4 then 1 then 8 ? 02:54:56 <rubyruy> i.e. the second one reversed? 02:54:58 <Eddi|zuHause> the 2 stands for the first 4 goods. it appears in the end in the big endian notation 02:54:59 <Aali> basically, yes 02:55:06 <Eddi|zuHause> exactly 02:55:25 <Eddi|zuHause> you can now either reverse the bits, or reverse the translation table 02:55:37 <Eddi|zuHause> to make the bits match the translation table 02:55:40 <rubyruy> should i end up with this? "0010", "0100", "0001", "1000", "1011", "0111", "1000", "0111"] 02:55:46 <Eddi|zuHause> i chose the first option 02:55:54 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 02:56:03 <Eddi|zuHause> i now also reversed the bits 02:56:10 <Eddi|zuHause> so 0010 becomes 0100 02:56:21 *** Sacro_ [~ben@adsl-87-102-39-137.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 02:56:56 <rubyruy> ok i think that looks right finally 02:57:22 <rubyruy> ruby code i used (because i'm useless at bit ops yes you may laugh at me) refit_mask = "787B8142".reverse.scan(/./).map{|h| h.to_i(16).to_s(2).rjust(4,'0').reverse} 02:57:42 <Eddi|zuHause> that looks awful :p 02:57:42 <Aali> err 02:57:46 <rubyruy> yes yes it does 02:57:51 <Aali> just look at the table on the wiki 02:58:01 <Aali> add up the numbers under bit value 02:58:04 <Aali> and you're done 02:59:05 <Eddi|zuHause> table schnable... don't rely on someone else's knowledge if you can derive it yourself 02:59:05 <rubyruy> that doesn't help me with decomposing an existing mask though :p 02:59:19 <rubyruy> i can see Eddi is a purist :) 02:59:24 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-39-137.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:59:55 *** Sacro_ is now known as Sacro 02:59:57 <Eddi|zuHause> no, i'm just faster at decoding this bitmask than finding the place where the table might hide ;) 03:01:23 <Aali> if you're used to counting in hex you can work it out yourself in 2 seconds, yes 03:01:31 <Aali> rubyruy obviously isn't 03:01:58 <Eddi|zuHause> i went through that exact same procedure when i adjusted dbxl_ecs.grf for PBI cargos 03:02:20 <Eddi|zuHause> since i had no way of transporting clay 03:02:32 <rubyruy> hmm problem 03:02:51 <rubyruy> the bitmasks works out to the following cargos being accepted for the bulk freighter: 1, 6, 8, f, 10, 11, 13, 14, 15, 16, 1b, 1c, 1d, 1e 03:02:59 <rubyruy> which includes among other things potash and sand 03:03:07 <rubyruy> none of which are actually listed in the freighter in ttd 03:03:12 <rubyruy> is this because i use that construction set? 03:03:29 <Aali> i've made tropic refurbishment set carry ECS cargoes 03:03:30 <Eddi|zuHause> the cargos will only show up if an industry is defined that produces them 03:04:45 <Aali> i'm actually working on that now, but the refit masks are done, just have to set the right sprite groups for everything 03:04:46 <rubyruy> so it would vary with climate? or can it not show up if that industry is simply not on the map yet? 03:05:06 <Aali> rubyruy: new chemical vector doesn't have potash 03:05:23 <Eddi|zuHause> no, it's about which industries are defined, not which industries exist 03:05:40 <Eddi|zuHause> if you loaded a grf that provides a sand pit, then sand should show up as cargo 03:06:00 <Aali> sand does show up as a cargo 03:06:15 <rubyruy> so it is i'm just blind :p 03:06:21 <rubyruy> OKAY THEN 03:06:30 <rubyruy> i think that solves most misteries now :) 03:06:49 <rubyruy> Aali: do i still need to look into that action 18 business you were mentionining a while back? 03:06:57 <Aali> nope 03:07:07 <rubyruy> ok so just add fish to the bitmask and hope for the best eh? 03:07:10 <Aali> that was just in case the original grf defined it, but it doesn't 03:07:30 <Eddi|zuHause> like i said, newships is very old 03:08:01 <Eddi|zuHause> dbset also, which is why these extension grfs were necessary 03:08:22 <Eddi|zuHause> as no new versions are expected to be released in the near future 03:16:11 *** helb [~helb@84.244.90.203] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:17:22 *** glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: bye] 03:20:09 *** helb [~helb@84.244.90.203] has joined #openttd 03:24:40 <rubyruy> so i changed 81 to 83 and now the grf shows up blue in the settings :( 03:24:43 <rubyruy> and won't load 03:24:51 <rubyruy> no error message 03:25:44 <rubyruy> blue means not loaded right? 03:25:48 <Aali> its supposed to be C1, not 83, but that shouldn't cause anything like that 03:26:08 <Aali> did you press apply changes? 03:26:32 <rubyruy> i did 03:29:22 <Eddi|zuHause> does the change appear in the build vehicle window? 03:33:43 <rubyruy> hooray it works! 03:33:55 <rubyruy> must have been something i did and forgot about 03:34:02 <rubyruy> i redecoded and encoded the original 03:34:05 <rubyruy> works fine now :) 03:34:06 <rubyruy> FISH! 03:34:31 <rubyruy> if i were to edit this further to add tourists to the passenger ships is it worth putting up somewhere ya figure? 03:38:30 <rubyruy> http://www.grabup.com/uploads/f71ba664637c5808e9b9fcb4e29f319c.png that sure is a ship full of fish :D 03:39:13 <Eddi|zuHause> you should not just take someone else's grf, modify it, and redistribute it 03:39:14 *** Fuco [~dota.keys@fuco.sks1.muni.cz] has quit [Quit: Quit] 03:39:30 <Eddi|zuHause> you should at least talk to the original author 03:39:50 <Eddi|zuHause> which in this case is Michael Blunck 03:41:13 <rubyruy> oh right 03:41:20 <rubyruy> of course 03:52:21 <Sacro> banshee is using 790MiB of RAM 03:52:23 <Sacro> that's not good 04:01:15 *** roboboy [3aad2910@webchat.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 04:06:16 *** Singaporekid [~notme@cm44.psi140.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #openttd 04:28:00 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-39-137.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 04:31:09 *** Yexo [~Yexo@32-88-ftth.onsneteindhoven.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:52:26 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-39-137.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 04:54:51 *** Modulator^ [~modulator@host-212-149-236-107.kpylaajakaista.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:59:26 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-39-137.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:07:46 *** ln [~lanurm@castor.utu.fi] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:12:12 <rubyruy> YAY i managed to make the newships tankers refittable now! 05:12:13 <rubyruy> go me! 05:14:25 <rubyruy> hmm i wonder how to make the ferries behave 05:14:44 <rubyruy> is it possible to have a ship accept passengers OR tourists in any proportion? 05:17:11 <rubyruy> actually for that matter how do you set multiple cargo types per ship 05:17:43 <rubyruy> i see the default ferry has the 'cargo slot' property (0C) set to 00 (Passengers) - where does it's mail capacity come from? 05:19:26 <rubyruy> oh nvm it only carriers passengers 05:19:34 <rubyruy> do only airplanes get multiple cargo types? 05:23:53 <rubyruy> refitaable is probably sufficient 05:38:12 <Eddi|zuHause> airplanes are two vehicles 05:38:27 <Eddi|zuHause> the passengers are transported in the plane, and the mail in the shadow of the plane 05:49:06 <rubyruy> seriously? 05:49:07 <rubyruy> wow 05:50:12 <Eddi|zuHause> well, just like a train with a passenger wagon and a mail wagon 05:50:34 <rubyruy> oh god damn it... the ECS patch for the US set is broken as well 05:50:53 <rubyruy> tourists can ride mineral hoppers and the tanker can't transport refined products 05:51:15 <rubyruy> what is ECS suppose to be played with anyway grumblegrumble 05:51:48 <Eddi|zuHause> it isn't... it's beta :p 05:52:15 <rubyruy> right right 05:52:25 <rubyruy> still - promises were made http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=ECSSupport 06:01:13 <De_Ghosty> and 06:01:22 <De_Ghosty> what's wrong with riding the mineral hopper? 06:13:03 <George> Aali: I'd also suggest fix New ships GRF directly instead of fixing ECS adapter 06:14:05 <George> As for transporting wrong cargo in the wagon - shouldn't it be reported to vehicles set author? 06:15:04 <George> As for ECS adapters, it is very hard to make them work 100% correctly. It is much easier to change the GRF itself. 06:42:27 <rubyruy> i've been editing the adapters so far *shrug* 06:43:33 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@89.246.176.68] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:52:26 *** fjb_ [~frank@p5485FB1C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 06:56:13 *** ln- [~lanurm@castor.utu.fi] has joined #openttd 06:56:45 <ln-> guten morning 06:56:49 *** fjb [~frank@p5485E438.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:00:41 *** Mortal [~mortal@217.61.144.15] has joined #openttd 07:04:01 *** Netsplit charon.oftc.net <-> weber.oftc.net quits: Singaporekid, CIA-5, roboboy, Tefad 07:05:03 *** Netsplit over, joins: Singaporekid, roboboy, CIA-5, Tefad 07:07:48 <rubyruy> oh this is funny... the US set works perfectly WITHOUT the adapter 07:09:16 <rubyruy> i can finally play :p 07:17:34 *** Mortal [~mortal@217.61.144.15] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:38:34 *** AgentLeMan [~AgentLeMa@BAF17de.baf.pppool.de] has joined #openttd 07:38:49 <AgentLeMan> hello, everys body :o9 07:39:25 <AgentLeMan> im having kinda a problem with my feederservice (im trying to explain it better this time :o) ) 07:39:38 <ln-> *I'm 07:39:39 <AgentLeMan> but first.... is anyone there? 07:39:53 <ln-> i am not here. 07:41:52 <AgentLeMan> ln-, noted. 08:03:29 <petern> everys body? 08:04:06 <AgentLeMan> well °grins° 08:04:21 <AgentLeMan> bodies there are 08:04:52 <AgentLeMan> but as usual in IRC, not always minds, as many are idling around. 08:07:05 <AgentLeMan> are you then here, petern? 08:07:33 *** Yeggstry [~mind@cpc1-rdng14-0-0-cust946.winn.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd 08:13:55 *** elmex [~elmex@e180066015.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd 08:18:47 <dih> mornin 08:19:04 <AgentLeMan> morning dih 08:23:43 *** Yeggstry [~mind@cpc1-rdng14-0-0-cust946.winn.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:30:40 *** TinoM [~Tino@i59F5D082.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 08:30:46 <AgentLeMan> °waves° 08:30:52 <petern> Dihedral! 08:31:09 *** AgentLeMan [~AgentLeMa@BAF17de.baf.pppool.de] has quit [] 08:33:54 *** Gekz [~brendan@123-243-206-102.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #openttd 08:46:44 *** Singaporekid [~notme@cm44.psi140.maxonline.com.sg] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:52:12 *** welshdragon [~vista@87.102.21.185] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:55:15 *** Brianetta [~brian@client-82-26-69-27.bmly.adsl.virgin.net] has joined #openttd 08:56:04 *** Zahl [~Zahl@g229215238.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd 08:57:37 *** rubyruy [~ruy@76-10-185-116.dsl.teksavvy.com] has quit [Quit: Zzzz...] 09:14:07 *** Wezz6400 [~Wezz6400@145-118-111-36.fttx.bbned.nl] has joined #openttd 09:23:17 *** helb [~helb@84.244.90.203] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:28:00 *** helb [~helb@84.244.90.203] has joined #openttd 10:05:39 *** mikl [~mikl@0x5550c003.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #openttd 10:12:23 *** Brianetta [~brian@client-82-26-69-27.bmly.adsl.virgin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:12:46 *** Vikthor [~novotv6@pc404-53.feld.cvut.cz] has joined #openttd 10:21:42 *** Korenn [~kvirc@93-125-161-18.dsl.alice.nl] has joined #openttd 10:24:08 *** fjb_ is now known as fjb 10:39:39 *** fjb [~frank@p5485FB1C.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:45:26 *** Singaporekid [~notme@cm44.psi140.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #openttd 11:00:01 *** Bergee [~bergee@c-68-42-180-23.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:13:48 *** tokai [~tokai@p54B81267.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: icebears... take care of them!] 11:40:38 *** FloSoft [~sifldoer@g230005011.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd 11:42:29 *** roboboy [3aad2910@webchat.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 12:06:45 *** Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 12:08:38 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-136-225-75.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd 12:13:35 *** DJGummik1h [~joey@ip3057.saw.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #openttd 12:15:34 *** DJGummikuh [~joey@ip3057.saw.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:19:15 *** Osai^zZz is now known as Osai 12:24:25 *** Char [~Ich@d83-180-237-141.cust.tele2.ch] has joined #openttd 12:26:22 <TrueBrain> hi puzzies 12:29:42 * dih purrs 12:29:45 <dih> :-D 12:30:16 <TrueBrain> good boy! 12:31:24 *** helb [~helb@84.244.90.203] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:44:10 *** Burty [burty@88-108-19-205.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has joined #openttd 12:47:57 *** Burty [burty@88-108-19-205.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has quit [] 12:51:11 *** Singaporekid [~notme@cm44.psi140.maxonline.com.sg] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:53:15 <TrueBrain> lalala 12:55:42 <dih> nininini 12:57:50 *** _` [~suckyours@p5B28FBB5.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 12:57:59 *** _` is now known as davis- 12:58:14 * davis- hi 12:58:59 *** mikl [~mikl@0x5550c003.adsl.cybercity.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:01:48 <TrueBrain> hi davis- 13:01:54 <davis-> :) 13:05:44 *** Vikthor [~novotv6@pc404-53.feld.cvut.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:07:33 *** Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Quit: Today for president] 13:11:22 *** Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 13:25:56 *** Yexo [~Yexo@32-88-ftth.onsneteindhoven.nl] has joined #openttd 13:29:30 *** snorre [~snorre@cF6FC00C3.dhcp.bluecom.no] has joined #openttd 13:31:29 *** KritiK [~Maxim@78-106-179-136.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 13:33:45 *** welshdragon [~vista@87.102.21.185] has joined #openttd 13:51:03 *** welshdragon2 [~vista@87.102.21.185] has joined #openttd 13:51:13 *** mortal` [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 13:51:14 *** _` [~suckyours@p5B28FBB5.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 13:51:41 *** Wezz6400_ [~Wezz6400@145-118-111-36.fttx.bbned.nl] has joined #openttd 13:51:56 *** Wezz6400 is now known as Guest1462 13:51:56 *** bleepy [bleepy@5ad1d1be.bb.sky.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:51:57 *** Wezz6400_ is now known as Wezz6400 13:52:02 *** _` is now known as davis-- 13:52:21 *** bleepy [bleepy@5ad1d1be.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 13:55:10 *** bleepy [bleepy@5ad1d1be.bb.sky.com] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 13:55:10 *** bleepy [bleepy@5ad1d1be.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 13:56:32 <Yexo> petern: is there a reason that vehicle groups names need to be unique between all groups instead of only between the groups of one player (or even per vehicle type per player)? 13:56:40 *** benjamingoodger [~ben@host217-44-221-18.range217-44.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 13:56:59 *** Guest1462 [~Wezz6400@145-118-111-36.fttx.bbned.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:57:44 *** Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:57:54 *** welshdragon [~vista@87.102.21.185] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:57:54 *** davis- [~suckyours@p5B28FBB5.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:58:52 *** davis-- is now known as davis- 13:59:28 *** welshdragon2 is now known as welshdragon 14:03:40 *** [Nemesis] [~Ping@78-69-54-150-no70.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #openttd 14:05:42 <SmatZ> Yexo: it has been discussed ; problem may arise when you buy a company 14:05:42 *** bleepy [bleepy@5ad1d1be.bb.sky.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:05:42 *** mucht_work [~Martin@143.50.125.24] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:05:45 *** TrueBrain [truebrain@openttd.org] has quit [Write error: connection closed] 14:05:46 *** TrueBrain [truebrain@openttd.org] has joined #openttd 14:05:49 *** mucht_work [~Martin@143.50.125.24] has joined #openttd 14:05:52 <SmatZ> then the group would need to be renamed, removed or whatever 14:06:09 *** helb [~helb@84.244.90.203] has joined #openttd 14:06:10 <SmatZ> but yes, I think the current system is needlessly restrictive 14:06:21 *** bleepy [bleepy@5ad1d1be.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 14:06:32 <SmatZ> but nobody has complained so far 14:07:15 *** Zeal [~Ping@78-69-54-150-no70.tbcn.telia.com] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 14:08:51 <Yexo> It's a bit of a problem when starting my AI, since it always tries to create a group "Small planes", and only one of the AIs will succeed, the others end up with "Group 2" 14:12:10 *** fjb [~frank@p5485FB1C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 14:12:16 <fjb> Hello 14:12:41 *** mortal`` [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 14:14:16 *** mortal`` is now known as mortal 14:14:20 *** th1ngwath [~thingwath@morana.sks2.muni.cz] has joined #openttd 14:14:30 *** Kommer_ [~kommer@vestingbar.student.utwente.nl] has joined #openttd 14:14:33 *** helb_ [~helb@84.244.90.203] has joined #openttd 14:14:54 *** FauxFaux_ [faux@compsoc.sunion.warwick.ac.uk] has joined #openttd 14:14:57 *** Reemo [Dr_Jekyll@p57B0E855.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:14:57 *** sunkan [sunkan@sunkan.bsnet.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:14:57 *** Rexxie [~rexxars@62.113.133.253] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:14:57 *** tneo [~tneo@vs241204.vserver.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:14:58 *** tneo [~tneo@vs241204.vserver.de] has joined #openttd 14:14:58 *** thingwath [~thingwath@morana.sks2.muni.cz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:14:58 *** sigmund [~sigmund@91.80-202-245.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd 14:14:58 *** helb [~helb@84.244.90.203] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:14:58 *** Kommer is now known as Guest1473 14:14:58 *** TrueBrain [truebrain@openttd.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:14:58 *** FauxFaux [faux@molotov.compsoc.warwick.ac.uk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:15:02 *** Kommer_ is now known as Kommer 14:15:07 *** weltende [welterde@gandalf.srv.welterde.de] has joined #openttd 14:15:19 *** TrueBrain [truebrain@openttd.org] has joined #openttd 14:15:35 *** Guest1473 [~kommer@vestingbar.student.utwente.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:15:52 *** welterde [welterde@gandalf.srv.welterde.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:16:04 *** mucht_work [~Martin@143.50.125.24] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:16:14 *** sigmund_ [~sigmund@91.80-202-245.nextgentel.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:16:22 *** mucht_work [~Martin@143.50.125.24] has joined #openttd 14:16:55 *** Dr_Jekyll [Dr_Jekyll@p57B0E855.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 14:17:33 *** sunkan [sunkan@sunkan.bsnet.se] has joined #openttd 14:19:38 *** Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0DA23D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 14:19:41 *** mode/#openttd [+o Celestar] by ChanServ 14:19:51 *** glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 14:19:54 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 14:20:04 *** mortal` [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:21:46 *** weltende [welterde@gandalf.srv.welterde.de] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.2.6] 14:21:48 *** welterde [welterde@gandalf.srv.welterde.de] has joined #openttd 14:21:52 *** Rexxie [~rexxars@62.113.133.253] has joined #openttd 14:28:46 *** Dred_furst [~Dred_furs@resnet707.bournemouth.ac.uk] has joined #openttd 14:29:11 <Char> cool 14:29:16 <Char> a train cannot crash with itself 14:29:17 <Char> however 14:29:25 <Char> if you manage to get a train onto a circular path 14:29:31 <Char> where it would crash with itself 14:29:34 <Char> it will be there forever 14:29:36 <Char> because 14:29:50 <Char> you cannot get it off the circular path anymore 14:30:09 <Char> cause all the circular path is occupied and you cannot build a way out 14:30:32 <ln-> that's when you need to call chuck norris. 14:32:12 *** Aylomen [~a@DSL01.83.171.161.114.ip-pool.NEFkom.net] has joined #openttd 14:32:39 <Char> well 14:32:42 <Char> actually not 14:32:58 <Char> cause you cannot get the train on the perfect circular path in the first place 14:33:03 <Char> you need to have an entry 14:33:10 <Char> which you can later use as an exit as well 14:33:29 *** dfox [~dfox@r5cv134.net.upc.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:33:39 *** FauxFaux_ is now known as FauxFaux 14:33:45 <th1ngwath> you can remove it :-) 14:34:05 <Char> no you cant 14:34:09 <Char> cause there will be a train on it 14:34:09 *** dfox [~dfox@r5cv134.net.upc.cz] has joined #openttd 14:34:12 <ln-> *can't 14:34:26 <Char> sorry ln for my imperfect english 14:34:27 <Char> ;) 14:34:52 <Rubidium> Char: just ignore ln, he's annoying anyways 14:35:05 *** th1ngwath is now known as thingwath 14:36:11 <thingwath> but the train would have to turn around 14:36:43 <thingwath> to leave the circle 14:38:09 *** Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0DA23D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:38:47 *** murr4y [murray@2001:470:1f0a:1be::a1c0] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:47:43 *** mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Quit: Today for president] 14:49:25 *** Swallow [~chatzilla@5355F5FD.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd 14:52:29 *** murr4y [murray@2001:470:1f0a:1be::a1c0] has joined #openttd 14:54:37 *** batti5 [~batti5@92.84.6.144] has joined #openttd 14:59:52 *** Singaporekid [~notme@cm44.psi140.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #openttd 15:00:14 *** De_Ghosty [~s@76-10-139-208.dsl.teksavvy.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:00:31 *** KritiK_ [~Maxim@78-106-214-41.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 15:03:30 *** davis-- [~suckyours@p5B28F705.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 15:06:14 *** KritiK [~Maxim@78-106-179-136.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:06:26 *** KritiK_ is now known as KritiK 15:11:01 *** davis- [~suckyours@p5B28FBB5.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:21:00 *** Vikthor [~novotv6@pc404-64.feld.cvut.cz] has joined #openttd 15:21:59 *** helb_ [~helb@84.244.90.203] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:22:10 *** Zahl [~Zahl@g229215238.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:22:19 *** Zahl [~Zahl@g229215238.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd 15:22:37 *** mikl [~mikl@0x5550c003.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #openttd 15:24:19 *** Doorslammer [Doorslamme@144.138.223.208] has joined #openttd 15:42:56 *** mikl [~mikl@0x5550c003.adsl.cybercity.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:51:56 *** Char [~Ich@d83-180-237-141.cust.tele2.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:52:46 *** Char [~Ich@d83-180-237-141.cust.tele2.ch] has joined #openttd 15:53:31 *** Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 15:54:31 *** yorick [yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 15:54:38 *** De_Ghosty [~s@76-10-139-157.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #openttd 16:02:26 <Eddi|zuHause> <SmatZ> Yexo: it has been discussed ; problem may arise when you buy a company <- what speaks against prefixing the name with the company name of the old company in that case? 16:02:39 *** De_Ghosty [~s@76-10-139-157.dsl.teksavvy.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:02:53 *** De_Ghosty [~s@76-10-132-242.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #openttd 16:03:38 *** Doorslammer [Doorslamme@144.138.223.208] has quit [Quit: I'll get you next episode, Inspector Gadget! NEXT EPISODE!] 16:04:23 <Aali> or just renaming any conflicts 16:04:31 <Aali> still, someone has to code it 16:04:56 *** Char [~Ich@d83-180-237-141.cust.tele2.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:05:30 <Yexo> Eddi|zuHause: the maximum length of the names does 16:05:42 *** Zahl_ [~Zahl@g227073228.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd 16:06:48 *** yorick [yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:07:01 *** yorick [yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 16:07:08 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@89.246.176.68] has joined #openttd 16:07:17 *** ecke [~ecke@pc153-207.upce.cz] has joined #openttd 16:07:41 *** Zahl [~Zahl@g229215238.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:07:41 *** Zahl_ is now known as Zahl 16:07:46 <Yexo> Maybe just deleting all groups from the buyed company is a solution 16:08:19 <Eddi|zuHause> that seems a tiny bit radical... 16:08:34 <Yexo> buying companies isn't possible in multiplayer anyway and the current ai doesn't use groups. NoAI AIs can (and do) use groups, but the player may have his own view on groups 16:09:23 <SmatZ> I think it would be best to name groups (and vehicles) "SmallGroup (2)" or so if needed 16:09:29 <SmatZ> only when names conflict 16:09:30 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, but when you take over a company, you usually do not throw away that company's infrastructure and middle management, but slowly integrate it 16:09:51 <SmatZ> it doesn't matter it is longer than MAX_GROUP_NAME_LENGTH 16:11:03 *** ecke [~ecke@pc153-207.upce.cz] has quit [] 16:11:50 <Yexo> SmatZ: can having different (but both custom) names for groups/vehicles on the server and on clients lead to desyncs? 16:12:11 <SmatZ> Yexo: I don't think so 16:12:47 *** tokai [~tokai@p54B81267.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 16:12:50 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 16:13:11 *** Singaporekid [~notme@cm44.psi140.maxonline.com.sg] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:13:16 <Yexo> good, otherwise FS#1923 might give even more problems 16:13:59 <SmatZ> yes :) 16:14:57 <DaleStan> Belugas: For houses/industry tiles, George wants recolor mode 3 (bits 14&15 of the sprite number both set) to mean "do not draw this sprite in transparent mode". Thoughts? 16:15:13 <DaleStan> Could probably be added to stations too. 16:15:21 *** Zorni [zorn@e177225182.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd 16:15:46 *** Zorn [zorn@f054002032.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:15:49 *** yorick [yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:16:00 *** yorick [yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 16:16:01 *** d-mike [~mibindsei@p4FC25B66.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 16:19:44 <Belugas> DaleStan: i understand what you are proposing. not sure how easily it can be done, since we are translatin i load bits 14 and 15 meaning to our own representation 16:20:40 <Belugas> the consideration i have would rather be about user reactions: Would they consider it a bug that some of the objects on the map do not follow the transparent/invisible mode they requested? 16:21:01 <DaleStan> That's already the case with bit 31. 16:23:36 <DaleStan> That aside, the requested behaviour is already possible, by testing variable 1B (IIRC). This change would just make it easier. 16:23:55 <DaleStan> ... I'm not sure whether that's an argument for or against, actually. 16:25:45 *** fonso [~fonso@e178115073.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd 16:26:37 <Belugas> well... for sure, using 14 and 15 for something different simply mens that 14 and 15 and no longer separate flags, but are part of a new meaning, i think 16:28:03 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590ff162.pool.einsundeins.de] has joined #openttd 16:29:16 *** davis-- is now known as davis- 16:31:53 <Belugas> oh god.. i got it in reverse... 16:32:04 <DaleStan> I think it should be pretty easy on my end. 16:32:25 <Belugas> i tough it was "do not hide this sprite" instead... 16:32:56 <Belugas> i've got to take a look during my luunch hour 16:33:01 <Belugas> and talk to the guys 16:33:14 <Belugas> i think it might be easy too, not sure though 16:33:16 <frosch123> "TTDPatch will always keep variables 8E and 8F in sync with 93" <- what does that mean, or can I find the answer in the logs? 16:33:19 <DaleStan> We already have that -- bit 30 (which is what I meant when I said "bit 31".) 16:37:18 <DaleStan> frosch123: When an industry is created, vars 8E and 8F are set to "var9E * industryprod1rates[industry.type] / 16" and "var9E * industryprod2rates[industry.type] / 16", respectively (clamped to 0..FF, and with halves rounded up). TTDPatch preserves this through all changes of var9E. 16:38:26 <frosch123> ok, so they are recomputed 16:38:32 <DaleStan> Yes. 16:40:13 <DaleStan> Our code is at patches/newindu.asm:6020-6026 and :6045-6053. esi points to the industry, ebx is the industry id, and edi points to var 9E. 16:40:27 *** Dred_furst [~Dred_furs@resnet707.bournemouth.ac.uk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:41:57 <DaleStan> But I didn't copy that from TTD's industry initialization code, so it could have slightly different behaviour than TTD. 16:43:05 <frosch123> Thanks, I read the wiki as if they were also incremented and decremented, which did not make a lot of sense :) 16:44:24 <Belugas> reboot time 16:44:34 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.226] has quit [Quit: On snow, everyone can follow your traces] 16:45:09 <DaleStan> The first incarnation did exactly that, and Csaboka told me that no, that's not right. 16:45:24 <batti5> if (ind->produced_cargo[i] != CT_INVALID && GetCargo(ind->produced_cargo[i])->label == 'WOOD') return true;, this gives a warning = station_cmd.cpp:161:90: warning: multi-character character constant in station_cmd any ideas? 16:45:46 <frosch123> C is not Java 16:46:39 <frosch123> but despite of that, testing a cargolabel does not make a lot of sense 16:47:04 <DaleStan> Translate 'WOOD' to an integer. Or a named constant. (#define CARGOLABEL_WOOD <whatever>) 16:47:53 <frosch123> and make it endian aware :) 16:48:38 *** Vikthor [~novotv6@pc404-64.feld.cvut.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:48:49 *** Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:48:49 * davis- dislikes java 16:50:21 <DaleStan> <whatever> being 0x444F4F57 or 0x574F4F44, depending on endianness. 16:50:44 <glx> anyway better use cargoclass 16:50:50 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.226] has joined #openttd 16:50:51 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ 16:53:14 <Eddi|zuHause> batti5: i can immediately point out 3 flaws in there 16:53:15 <frosch123> DaleStan, Belugas: var 1B is not supported because of desyncs 16:53:55 <batti5> <Eddi|zuHause> what? 16:54:11 <Eddi|zuHause> 1) strings must be enclosed in "" 16:54:15 <frosch123> wrong 16:54:21 <frosch123> it is not a string 16:54:26 <batti5> <Eddi|zuHause> can you fixit? 16:54:39 <Eddi|zuHause> 2) == does not compare strings, but compares addresses of strings 16:55:12 <Eddi|zuHause> 3) comparing the lables is bad, compare IDs instead, where you previously stored somewhere the ID of the wood cargo 16:55:12 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: typedef uint32 CargoLabel; 16:55:21 <Yexo> Eddi|zuHause: 'WOOD' is an integer 16:55:29 <frosch123> 'DOOW' is alsa an integer 16:56:12 <batti5> all i tryed is to add a couple of stationnames 16:56:40 <batti5> i dident touch other 16:59:24 *** helb [~helb@84.244.90.203] has joined #openttd 17:02:06 *** Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 17:03:06 *** Char [~Ich@d83-180-97-46.cust.tele2.ch] has joined #openttd 17:03:12 * Belugas is heading for micro-wave hoven 17:03:17 <Belugas> lunch time has started 17:03:23 * Belugas waves hello to frosch123 17:03:24 <dih> enjoy 17:03:53 * petern hungers 17:04:03 <frosch123> DaleStan, Belugas, George: Using bits 14 and 15 would imply, that you can only draw normal sprites. I.e. no recoloured, e.g. with the random industry color ... 17:04:55 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-39-137.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 17:06:38 *** Franck|Away [~Franck@lns-bzn-51f-62-147-243-13.adsl.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 17:06:56 *** Franck|Away [~Franck@lns-bzn-51f-62-147-243-13.adsl.proxad.net] has quit [] 17:08:03 *** Timmaexx [~chatzilla@p5090A850.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 17:08:15 *** Timmaexx [~chatzilla@p5090A850.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has left #openttd [] 17:13:51 *** welshdragon [~vista@87.102.21.185] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:16:20 *** Purno [~Purno@5350931D.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd 17:20:41 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1E030.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 17:26:59 <George> frosch123: :( I hoped to see it recoloured. 17:27:01 <George> DaleStan: I understand that I can check a var and have different graphics. 17:27:02 <George> And what was the intention of bit 14? Were is it used? I mean could bit 15 mean recolour and bit 14 invisibility (bit 30 means visibility already, so a bit for invisibility is welcome). or may be a combination of bits 14,15 and 30 could define visibility/recolour? 17:27:31 *** Char [~Ich@d83-180-97-46.cust.tele2.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:27:58 <DaleStan> One of them means to draw "transparently"; the other means to draw with recoloring. 17:28:20 <frosch123> George: you can see the effect of bit 14 with standard station roofs 17:28:37 <frosch123> or the green glass in mb's newstations 17:29:36 <frosch123> when bit 14 is set, the current pixel color from the screen is read, recolored using the recolor sprite in bits 16..29, and written back 17:29:50 <frosch123> that is done for all pixels which are not transparent in the sprite of bits 0..13 17:30:21 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-39-137.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:30:27 <George> may be bit 14=1 and bit 30=1 would mean a normal sprite invisible in transparent mode? 17:30:28 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-39-137.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 17:31:16 <frosch123> no it means always transparent 17:31:41 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host124-61-dynamic.8-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 17:31:52 *** yorick [yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Quit: Poef!] 17:32:23 <Wolf01> hello 17:32:54 *** sigmund_ [~sigmund@91.80-202-245.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd 17:34:10 <George> frosch123: But how can it be transparent in transparent mode if it is transparent? what is changed with such a sprite when transparency is on? If nothing, than bit 30 is useless for it, and a combination of bit 14 = 1 and bit 30 = 1 could be a special value for special behaviour? 17:34:46 *** sigmund [~sigmund@91.80-202-245.nextgentel.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:36:44 <frosch123> currently bit 14,15,30 = (1,0,0) means that that the sprite modifies the screencontent using the recolor sprite from bits 16..29. When transparency is enabled it uses the default transparency-recolor sprite instead of bits 16..29 17:37:07 <frosch123> though I would not be surprised, when ttdp behaves differently 17:37:52 <frosch123> and (1,0,1) would mean that it always uses bits 16..29 17:38:55 <frosch123> however, George, one special value is not enough. 17:39:05 <DaleStan> That is, I believe, the way TTDPatch handles it too. 17:39:33 <SmatZ> 32bpp blitters don't use recolor sprites for BM_TRANSPARENT, that may be an issue 17:39:49 <frosch123> that's a different issue :) 17:40:10 <SmatZ> yeah, just if someone had idea to use "all to transparent" palette in this case :) 17:40:16 <SmatZ> it would fail 17:40:17 <Belugas> no free bits available on those sprites ids, don't they? 17:41:23 <frosch123> well, you could start that usually an action1 set will not contain 16384 sprites :) 17:41:35 <frosch123> but that would not solve the issue for non-action1 sprites 17:41:45 <Aali> yay, infinite loop 17:41:52 <Belugas> right 17:42:36 <frosch123> so, actually (1,1,0) and (1,1,1) are free 17:44:24 <George> Can one mean "Recoloured and hidden in transparent mode" and an other "Hidden in transparent mode"? 17:44:40 *** AgentLeMan [~AgentLeMa@BAF70a1.baf.pppool.de] has joined #openttd 17:45:18 <DaleStan> Waste of a setting. Recolor with 775 if you don't want recoloring. 17:45:53 <frosch123> true, that is also an option 17:46:09 <frosch123> maybe 0x3ff instead of 775? 17:46:22 <frosch123> 0x3fff actually 17:46:57 <DaleStan> And that frees up a spot for "transparent in normal mode, hidden in transparent mode". 17:47:25 <DaleStan> 0x3fff? 0x307 I can figure, but why 3FFF? 17:47:54 <frosch123> someone might change sprite 0x307 17:48:24 <frosch123> 0x0000 means using default recolour sprite, so maybe 0x0001 for none 17:49:27 <frosch123> but, true, 0x307 should be enough 17:50:49 <frosch123> however, imo (1,1,1) should be kept for something more useful than "transparent in normal mode, hidden in transparent mode" 17:52:44 *** AgentLeMan [~AgentLeMa@BAF70a1.baf.pppool.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:07:46 *** Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:14:21 <dih> src/string.cpp:70: char* strecpy(char*, const char*, const char*): Assertion `dst <= last' failed. 18:14:27 <dih> sorry - i dont have more info 18:17:01 *** Brianetta [~brian@client-82-26-69-27.bmly.adsl.virgin.net] has joined #openttd 18:17:04 *** Yexo [~Yexo@32-88-ftth.onsneteindhoven.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:19:03 *** Hirundo [~chatzilla@5355F5FD.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd 18:19:29 <frosch123> you could at least specify the revision :) 18:19:44 *** fonso [~fonso@e178115073.adsl.alicedsl.de] has left #openttd [Kopete 0.12.7 : http://kopete.kde.org] 18:19:49 <dih> always latest nightly ;-) 18:19:57 <dih> 14560# 18:20:01 <dih> without the hash 18:20:55 <CIA-5> OpenTTD: smatz * r14564 /trunk/src/network/network_server.cpp: -Fix (r14555): one more incorrect use of lastof() 18:20:57 <frosch123> ok, smatz is always faster 18:21:11 <SmatZ> :) 18:21:13 <planetmaker> :D THAT was quick. Fast as lightening 18:21:48 <dih> :-) 18:21:50 <SmatZ> :-) 18:21:54 * dih hugs SmatZ 18:22:01 <SmatZ> I am ill, dih! :) 18:22:02 <Eddi|zuHause> well, such bugs are easy to resolve when they are not the first incarnation 18:22:09 <dih> slowly i am thinking my server really is paying out 18:22:22 <SmatZ> hehe 18:22:23 <dih> Eddi|zuHause, it's just finding them all :-P 18:23:51 *** Swallow [~chatzilla@5355F5FD.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:23:58 <dih> eat that! 18:24:00 *** Hirundo is now known as Swallow 18:24:05 <dih> :-P 18:24:19 *** Ammler [~Ammler@vs241204.vserver.de] has quit [Excess Flood] 18:24:24 <dih> wow 18:24:32 <SmatZ> :-d 18:24:41 <frosch123> I was just about to construct that one: grep -rI strecpy * | grep lastof | grep -v svn | grep -v "strecpy(\([^,]*\),.*lastof()" 18:25:14 <SmatZ> frosch123: try it :) 18:25:34 <frosch123> in matches 5 other times 18:25:35 <George> DaleStan: Does it mean that bit 15 is useless, because I can use recolour 775, and that's why it can be considerate as always 1, while bit 15 is used for the other purpose - invisible mode in transparent mode. For example in GRF version 8? 18:25:44 *** Guest1514 [~Ammler@vs241204.vserver.de] has joined #openttd 18:26:10 <frosch123> George: bit 15 is traditional ttd, and it is faster to draw a sprite with bit 15 cleared 18:26:50 <George> frosch123: Draw a sprite? 18:26:53 <frosch123> hmm, grf version 8. that's an idea, one could remove bit 15 in grf version 8 18:28:14 <SmatZ> frosch123: are you going to check those matches? (grepped) 18:29:40 *** Guest1514 is now known as Ammler 18:29:50 <frosch123> vehicle_gui.cpp is ok 18:30:42 *** yorick [yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 18:32:09 <frosch123> driver.cpp does not neccessarily make sense, but should not trigger that assertion 18:33:41 <frosch123> macos.mm is ok, but is commented out anyway 18:33:53 <frosch123> SmatZ: done 18:34:27 <SmatZ> great frosch123 :) 18:34:30 *** Yexo [~Yexo@32-88-ftth.onsneteindhoven.nl] has joined #openttd 18:34:50 <frosch123> / } <- I will never again take a look at macos.mm 18:35:08 <frosch123> *//// 18:35:39 * frosch123 does not understand that slash logic, but he meant two 18:35:56 <SmatZ> hehe 18:36:25 <Prof_Frink> s/\//\/\// ? 18:36:34 <Aali> hmm 18:36:51 <Aali> i need to talk to Celestar 18:36:57 <SmatZ> s/V/W/ 18:37:04 <Aali> or someone else who understands the internal workings of cargodest 18:37:52 *** Ammller [~Ammler@adsl-84-227-144-250.adslplus.ch] has joined #openttd 18:38:00 *** Zahl [~Zahl@g227073228.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:38:08 *** Zahl [~Zahl@g227073228.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd 18:38:31 *** Reemo [Dr_Jekyll@p57B0EC4D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 18:39:11 <Eddi|zuHause> Aali: how about you just ask the real question? 18:40:00 <Aali> okay, is numskip ever supposed to be -1 in Routing_t::GetDestination? 18:40:56 <Eddi|zuHause> hm, ok, that is very internal ;) 18:41:02 <Aali> indeed 18:41:43 <Eddi|zuHause> could it mean something like "invalid destination"? 18:42:08 <Eddi|zuHause> -1 or 0xFF...F is a very popular value for those 18:42:11 *** Dr_Jekyll [Dr_Jekyll@p57B0E855.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:43:20 <Aali> yes, but guesswork isn't going to help here :P 18:44:20 <Eddi|zuHause> well, typically, those special values get a #define INVALID_<whatever> ((uint)(-1)) or something 18:44:31 <CIA-5> OpenTTD: translators * r14565 /trunk/src/lang/ (7 files in 2 dirs): (log message trimmed) 18:44:31 <CIA-5> OpenTTD: -Update: WebTranslator2 update to 2008-11-04 18:44:06 18:44:31 <CIA-5> OpenTTD: brazilian_portuguese - 5 fixed by tucalipe (5) 18:44:31 <CIA-5> OpenTTD: catalan - 5 fixed, 2 changed by arnaullv (7) 18:44:31 <CIA-5> OpenTTD: italian - 2 changed by lorenzodv (2) 18:44:33 <CIA-5> OpenTTD: latvian - 65 fixed, 1 changed by v3rb0 (66) 18:44:35 <CIA-5> OpenTTD: persian - 111 fixed by ali sattari (111) 18:45:25 <Aali> Eddi|zuHause: its just a number, so nothing like that 18:45:57 <Eddi|zuHause> of course it's just a number, because defines are resolved before compilation 18:46:13 *** welshdragon [~vista@87.102.21.185] has joined #openttd 18:46:16 <Eddi|zuHause> still such a define would occur in the code 18:46:29 <Belugas> here comes CHOCKY! 18:46:29 <Aali> let me rephrase that, its used as a number 18:46:41 <Aali> no magic values 18:47:51 <SmatZ> OTTD uses mostly enums and static consts, not #defines 18:48:04 <SmatZ> so the debugger should be able to assign the name for that value 18:49:18 <Aali> does hg have a feature that will tell me when and by whom a certain line was changed? 18:49:39 <SmatZ> Aali: hg blame 18:49:55 <Belugas> not me. I swear!! 18:50:11 <Aali> ah, just like svn 18:50:20 <Eddi|zuHause> * retval INVALID_STATION We can go to any station we wish to <-- straight from the documentation 18:51:08 <Eddi|zuHause> although appears to be missing a @ 18:51:23 <Eddi|zuHause> routing.h:201 18:51:58 <Aali> uh, yes, thats the return value 18:52:10 <Aali> not what i was asking for 18:55:46 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't see why numskip=-1 should be a problem 18:55:47 *** Mortal [~mortal@0x573a3da2.odnqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 18:56:35 <Aali> its not a problem if there are other stations in the routecache 18:56:49 <Aali> but if all stations end up with -1 you'll get an infinite loop 18:56:56 <Eddi|zuHause> if (RandomRange(maxnumskip) < numskip) continue; <- means this check is always false 18:57:21 <Aali> you do realize its unsigned, right? 18:57:24 <Eddi|zuHause> hm, no, it's an uint 18:59:25 <Eddi|zuHause> this function lacks some serious description on how you should read it 18:59:53 <Eddi|zuHause> uint sector = dist * 5 / maxdist; <- like what this value is supposed to tell us 19:00:04 *** Yexo [~Yexo@32-88-ftth.onsneteindhoven.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:01:31 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, if you replace the 2000 by 1999, the infinite loop should disappear 19:02:08 <Eddi|zuHause> might just be an oversight 19:02:18 <Aali> but then -1 might be acceptable, and the source of the problem could be somewhere else 19:03:07 <Eddi|zuHause> -1 should never be acceptable for an uint, unless it's specifically documented 19:03:36 <Aali> sure, it has other codestyle-related issues 19:04:10 <SmatZ> UINT_MAX is there for this purpose (or is it MAX_UINT?) 19:05:18 * Belugas nods 19:06:01 <Aali> but if this really is the source of the problem, any station that produces 2000 units of cargo in a month would cause openttd to hang 19:06:15 <Aali> i can't believe that would go unnoticed for two months 19:06:30 <SmatZ> stations don't produce cargo 19:06:46 *** helb_ [~helb@84.244.90.203] has joined #openttd 19:06:56 <SmatZ> and you are talking about cargodets, right? 19:07:16 <Aali> *any station recieves 2000 units of cargo from industries 19:07:19 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, cargodest 19:07:20 <Aali> are you happy now? 19:07:24 <Aali> :P 19:07:41 <SmatZ> yes :) 19:07:41 *** helb [~helb@84.244.90.203] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:07:51 *** batti5 [~batti5@92.84.6.144] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:07:54 *** tokai [~tokai@p54B81267.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:08:09 <SmatZ> where did they go? 19:08:34 <Eddi|zuHause> code says "origin this month", not "production this month" 19:08:54 <Eddi|zuHause> well, last month, but doesn't matter ;) 19:09:20 <Aali> yes, and it stores how much cargo originated at that station 19:09:32 <Eddi|zuHause> i never ever had a source station with that kind of throughput 19:09:43 *** tokai [~tokai@p54B83B70.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 19:09:46 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 19:10:27 *** Yexo [~Yexo@32-88-ftth.onsneteindhoven.nl] has joined #openttd 19:11:02 <Aali> i was waay over that when this happened 19:11:27 <Eddi|zuHause> i mean like... not in 2 months, but in like 15 years of TT... 19:11:36 <Aali> unless one unit of coal weighs more than a few tonnes 19:11:51 *** Yeggstry [~mind@cpc1-rdng14-0-0-cust946.winn.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd 19:12:17 <Aali> i was lucky enough to have all the coal mines on screen when it happened, let me get a screenshot 19:12:51 <Eddi|zuHause> don't bother 19:13:06 <Eddi|zuHause> i have seen plenty of these games... 19:13:24 <Aali> i used ECS in this game though 19:13:27 <Eddi|zuHause> they so totally do not match my style of playing 19:13:38 <Aali> you can get more than 1000 tonnes from a single coal mine 19:15:12 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, i occasionally had mines with output of 1000 (like 10 times of standard), but i never managed to have them grow beyond 2000 19:15:36 <Aali> http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/3063/cargodesthangjq4.png 19:16:03 <Aali> the station serves all those coal mines 19:18:25 <Aali> this was actually just a test game for very high cargo weight multiplier 19:18:36 *** ProfFrink [~proffrink@5ad683f6.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 19:18:41 <Aali> it was at x50 at that point, my poor trains were struggling :P 19:20:34 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5adb1db3.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:20:34 *** ProfFrink is now known as Prof_Frink 19:21:43 <Wolf01> which industries grfs are you using? 19:21:55 <Aali> ECS 19:21:56 *** Swallow [~chatzilla@5355F5FD.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:22:23 <Wolf01> uhm 19:22:36 <Wolf01> There's a new version? 19:22:44 <Aali> beta 5 19:22:47 <Wolf01> oh 19:22:57 <Wolf01> I bet I have beta 4 19:23:29 <Wolf01> I never managed to deactivate the stockpile function 19:23:45 <Aali> just change the grf parameter? 19:23:59 <Wolf01> Seem that with beta 4 doesn't work 19:24:10 <Aali> it should 19:24:47 <Aali> there's no instant cargo generation though, you can't change that 19:27:46 *** ProfFrink [~proffrink@5adb1dad.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 19:31:27 *** FloSoft [~sifldoer@g230005011.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:31:57 *** FloSoft [~sifldoer@g230005011.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd 19:33:14 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5ad683f6.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:33:14 *** ProfFrink is now known as Prof_Frink 19:42:41 *** d-mike [~mibindsei@p4FC25B66.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:42:46 *** d-mike [~mibindsei@p4FC27596.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 19:42:54 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@161-18-80-78.strcechy.adsl-llu.static.bluetone.cz] has joined #openttd 19:43:04 <Aali> ah, there was definitely something else going on 19:43:35 <Aali> the pickup station shouldn't be considered as a target 19:44:22 *** rubyruy [~ruy@76-10-185-116.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #openttd 19:45:06 <Aali> unless of course there was a coal mine at the drop and a power station at the pickup 19:45:18 <Aali> so thats why it hasn't been discovered before ;) 19:50:45 <Wolf01> ECS question: "No mine closure. The mine should never close unless it is exhausted." with mine you mean all primary industries or only coal/iron ore mines? 19:51:29 *** Yexo [~Yexo@32-88-ftth.onsneteindhoven.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:52:07 *** Fuco [~dota.keys@fuco.sks1.muni.cz] has joined #openttd 20:02:20 *** FloSoft [~sifldoer@g230005011.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:02:52 *** FloSoft [~sifldoer@g230005011.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd 20:06:36 <George> Mines are: iron ore, coal, copper ore, limestone, sand, potash, sulphur mines, oil wells and oil rig. Also brick works is planned to be recoded as a mine. 20:06:40 *** Swallow [~chatzilla@5355F5FD.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd 20:08:00 *** rortom [~rortom_@5acfc1f1.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 20:08:16 *** d-mike [~mibindsei@p4FC27596.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [] 20:10:50 *** Nite_Owl [~Nite_Owl@c-75-74-51-51.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 20:11:10 <Nite_Owl> Hello all 20:17:48 <Wolf01> thank you George 20:18:22 <Aali> that does indeed trigger it 20:19:35 <Aali> if 2000 or more cargo units originate at a station and you try to transport the same cargo type back to it, you'll get a nice complete lockup 20:27:47 *** Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0DA23D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 20:27:48 *** mode/#openttd [+o Celestar] by ChanServ 20:29:49 *** Gekz [~brendan@123-243-206-102.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 20:30:15 <Celestar> \o 20:30:30 <welshdragon> has anybody used putty to ssh tunnel via a server to play openttd? 20:30:41 <Aali> Celestar: just in time 20:31:06 <Aali> i have just pinned down a pretty nasty bug in cargodest 20:31:21 <Celestar> you have? 20:31:41 <Aali> < Aali> if 2000 or more cargo units originate at a station and you try to transport the same cargo type back to it, you'll get a nice complete lockup 20:32:05 <Aali> that was the last line before you joined, even :P 20:32:26 <Aali> the problem is in Routing_t::GetDestination 20:32:46 <Aali> numskip becomes -1 20:33:29 <Wolf01> George, is it normal that the coal left decrease with the time also with the parameter set to 15? (the remaining time is 0 months, so endless mines should be enabled) 20:33:29 <Aali> and since its unsigned, thats "bigger" than maxnumskip, and the loop never ends 20:33:53 <Celestar> but it doesn't lock up? 20:33:57 <Aali> yes it does 20:34:34 <Celestar> interesting 20:34:41 <Celestar> because it never did for me up to now ^^ 20:35:01 <Aali> well, you need more than 2000 cargo units flowing/month 20:35:11 <Celestar> with passengers, that should be possible, no? 20:35:22 *** Dred_furst [~Dred_furs@resnet707.bournemouth.ac.uk] has joined #openttd 20:35:23 <Celestar> hm .. guess not, it's only origin, not transfer 20:35:24 <Aali> passengers are special 20:35:37 *** NukeBuster [~NukeBuste@80.101.115.82] has joined #openttd 20:35:40 <Aali> well yes 20:36:14 <Celestar> so basically the -1 is stupid 20:36:28 <Aali> or you could make it signed 20:37:00 <Aali> that would fix the problem without changing anything else 20:37:14 <Celestar> that's not the idea (= 20:37:21 <Celestar> (it being signed I mean) 20:37:26 <Aali> yeah, i figured 20:37:54 <Celestar> I just wonder why the HELL I have the -1 there :P 20:40:00 <Celestar> I'll just remove it 20:40:01 <Aali> well, without it, numskip would become 40 for unserviced stations, but that shouldn't cause any problems 20:40:15 <Celestar> it shouldn't 20:40:23 <Celestar> at least 39 or 40 shouldn't cause problems, should it? 20:40:30 <Aali> nah 20:40:38 <Aali> try it ;) 20:40:43 <Celestar> er yes it will 20:40:51 <Celestar> if (RandomRange(maxnumskip) < numskip) continue; 20:40:54 <Celestar> same problem, other place (= 20:41:04 <Aali> oh, right 20:41:30 <Aali> just put +1 there then 20:41:38 <Aali> and get rid of the -1's 20:41:40 <Celestar> nah 20:41:44 *** dfox [~dfox@r5cv134.net.upc.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:41:44 *** Purno [~Purno@5350931D.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:41:49 <Celestar> <= instead of < i'd say 20:42:17 *** sigmund [~sigmund@91.80-202-245.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd 20:42:20 <Celestar> hm. 20:42:28 <Aali> ah, yes, that is a better solution 20:42:40 <Celestar> this whole GetDestination thingy is stupid. I need to complete my less-random approach 20:42:49 <Celestar> hm . 20:42:58 <Celestar> RandomRange(maxnumskip) will yield a number between 0 and 39 20:43:31 <Aali> so that wont work anyway 20:43:46 <Aali> unless you add +1 20:43:51 <Celestar> how did this work before? :P 20:44:06 *** sigmund_ [~sigmund@91.80-202-245.nextgentel.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:44:16 *** dfox [~dfox@r5cv134.net.upc.cz] has joined #openttd 20:44:16 <Celestar> hm .. 20:44:31 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-39-137.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:44:35 <ln-> @seen Bjarni 20:44:35 <DorpsGek> ln-: Bjarni was last seen in #openttd 1 week, 0 days, 18 hours, 39 minutes, and 16 seconds ago: <Bjarni> goodnight (what's left of it anyway) 20:45:45 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-39-137.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 20:45:48 <Celestar> Aali: http://www.fvfischer.de/obiwanfix.diff 20:45:49 *** Swallow [~chatzilla@5355F5FD.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:45:51 <Celestar> agreed on that? (= 20:46:44 <Aali> nah, put the +1 inside randomrange 20:47:02 <Celestar> products the world doesn't need: Audi demonstrated an A4 powered by Biogas. 20:47:04 *** TinoDidriksen [~projectjj@213.237.107.120.adsl.od.worldonline.dk] has joined #openttd 20:47:11 <Celestar> it had 585 HP and went 327km/h 20:47:28 * blathijs slaps himself 20:47:33 <blathijs> I read "585 Hitpoints" :-) 20:47:50 <Aali> and the other numskip assignment has a -1, while not a problem, that should probably go away as well 20:48:05 <Celestar> blathijs: lol .. me too on second thought :P 20:48:44 <Celestar> all the GetDestination was really a q&d solution. apparently it shows 20:49:04 <Aali> heh 20:49:27 <ln-> McCain! 20:49:30 <Aali> it has worked quite well up until now though 20:49:58 <Celestar> ln-: what about him? 20:51:12 <ln-> Celestar: i'm attempting to create discussion by creating the false impression that he has won or something. 20:51:26 <Celestar> ln-: YOU FAILED 20:52:01 <ln-> i have much experience with failing 20:52:04 <Celestar> and the thought of McCain winning is exactly scary for me personally 20:52:07 <Celestar> isn't 20:52:08 <Celestar> * 20:52:33 <ln-> freud? 20:52:43 <Celestar> not really 20:52:46 <Celestar> lazy fingers :P 20:53:18 <ln-> the problem is that i'm damn tired 20:53:40 <Celestar> I'm just amazed that most europeans think that with a new president, the whole US policy will do a one-eighty. 20:55:10 <Celestar> wth 20:55:15 <Celestar> [SRC] Compiling pbs.cpp 20:55:15 <Celestar> make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/vici/openttd-cargodest/objs/debug' 20:55:15 <Celestar> make: *** [all] Error 2 20:55:22 <ln-> well their president does have ridiculously much influence on their foreign policy and other stuff. 20:55:30 <Rubidium> Celestar: don't you? It'll change it's heading by approximately 1.80 degrees 20:55:45 <Rubidium> Celestar: sources.list contains a file that doesn't exist on the FS 20:56:04 <Celestar> Rubidium: I'd say maybe 15 degrees 20:56:31 <Celestar> it ALWAYS does a make reconfigure as well 20:56:32 <Celestar> :o 20:56:37 * Celestar goes cleaning this up 20:59:02 <Celestar> something is seriously rotten 20:59:19 <Celestar> the make gives me kioslave errors now O_o 21:01:38 <Celestar> http://www.thespacereview.com/article/1243/1 <= heh this is cool reading 21:02:57 * SmatZ wishes to have time to read it :) 21:03:36 *** Ammller [~Ammler@adsl-84-227-144-250.adslplus.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:03:45 <Ammler> Eddi|zuHause: do you know, how to disable "overhead" traffic in Konversation 21:04:38 <Ammler> if I connect twice to this server, I will be kicked with "Excess Flood" 21:05:22 <Celestar> back in 5 21:08:23 * Celestar wonders why the human digestive system misses a reset button 21:08:39 <Wolf01> 'night 21:08:42 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host124-61-dynamic.8-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 21:09:09 <Rubidium> Celestar: it has, but reboots aren't instant 21:09:30 <Celestar> apparently 21:09:34 <Celestar> my restting takes 3 days now 21:09:35 <Celestar> :S 21:09:37 <Celestar> resetting* 21:10:10 <SmatZ> :-x 21:10:18 <SmatZ> you don't eat? 21:10:47 *** yorick [yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Quit: Poef!] 21:10:56 <Celestar> I do 21:11:20 <Celestar> but mainly I'm drinking about 10 liters of water a day that get ejected very quickly on the wrong end. 21:11:42 <Celestar> I'm beginning to feel like a continuous-flow water heater. 21:12:04 <SmatZ> hehe 21:12:21 <SmatZ> I heard someone died after drinking too much water too quickly 21:12:27 <SmatZ> *read 21:12:48 <Aali> its a well known fact that you can die from an overdose of water 21:13:06 <Celestar> overdosing water is difficult if you shit 3 gallons of it a day. 21:13:11 <Aali> indeed 21:13:22 <Celestar> keeping the electrolytes balanced is another issue ... 21:13:31 <dih> Celestar, you are not supposed to punp it up your ass 21:13:51 <Celestar> oh .. 21:13:56 <Celestar> I'm not? 21:15:28 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590ff162.pool.einsundeins.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:15:54 <Celestar> :o Chelsea trails 0-3 21:17:16 <Celestar> 1-3 21:17:17 <Celestar> :P 21:19:10 * Celestar thinks he kind of killed the conversation 21:19:17 <Celestar> Aali: problem fixed on hg repo 21:20:17 <Aali> yeah, i saw it 21:21:47 <Celestar> dih: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uF2djJcPO2A 21:22:32 <dih> yeha - that things funny 21:23:02 * Celestar rofls 21:23:39 <Celestar> kannscht des grad bidde nommal sage? 21:23:48 <dih> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8DngrgIpS0 21:25:08 <TrueBrain> I hate youtube 21:25:28 *** TrueBrain [truebrain@openttd.org] has left #openttd [So long and tnx for all the fish] 21:26:01 <Celestar> dih: you know Bird and Fortune? 21:26:06 <dih> yes :-D 21:26:31 <Celestar> :D 21:26:55 <dih> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=attWI5Z_pok <- also a good episode :-) 21:27:00 <Celestar> still haven't decided which one is my favorite 21:28:16 *** fonso [~fonso@e178115073.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd 21:28:29 <dih> the germans :-P 21:29:02 <Celestar> ? 21:29:22 <Celestar> haven't seen that one yet 21:29:23 <dih> i love the nazi walk 21:29:50 <dih> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1k7U-_tJVmw 21:31:50 <dih> hihi - this is so funny 21:32:54 <dih> "you started it" 21:33:10 <Ammler> I got that msg (Reconfig done. Please re-execute make.), if I run make but compile continues, do I really need to rerun make? or did that happen automatically? 21:34:38 <dih> ? 21:34:50 <dih> lost me right there 21:35:13 *** XeryusTC is now known as Xeryus|bnc 21:35:21 *** Aylomen [~a@DSL01.83.171.161.114.ip-pool.NEFkom.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:40:40 <rortom> good evening all 21:41:29 <rortom> uhm 21:41:37 <rortom> about me desync problems 21:41:47 <rortom> same GRF, 0.3.6 = stable 21:42:01 <rortom> nightly = desync always after ~50 game years 21:42:13 <Ammler> 0.3 :P 21:42:36 <rortom> *0.6.3 ;) 21:42:52 <rortom> was a long day for me today ;) 21:42:58 <Ammler> which GRF? 21:43:58 <Ammler> usually, 0.6 is going to desync, not nightly :-) 21:43:58 *** FloSoft [~sifldoer@g230005011.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Quit: computer has gone to sleep] 21:44:01 <rortom> http://www.openttd.org/en/server/3040 21:44:20 <rortom> nightly is much more unstable then 0.6.x atm :\ 21:45:08 <dih> rortom: hence 'nightly' 21:45:13 <dih> it's a snapshot build 21:45:21 <dih> you should know about those things 21:45:23 <SmatZ> why unstable? 21:45:42 <Ammler> but I have other experience about nightly 21:45:53 <SmatZ> [22:42:02] <rortom> nightly = desync always after ~50 game years <-- not that serious... 21:47:29 <rortom> dih: normally nightlies are more stable then the last release for me, just not recently 21:47:52 <dih> your 'normally' is not the definition of a snatpshot build 21:48:01 <rortom> SmatZ: its bad if you cannot continue a game because its just desyncing, frustrating 21:48:07 <rortom> sure 21:48:12 <rortom> i just said 21:48:27 <rortom> im used that you provide good snapshot quality ;) 21:48:40 <SmatZ> aha 21:50:07 <Aali> if you can reproduce the desync 10 times out of 10 it should be easy to fix 21:50:25 <Aali> since it doesn't happen in 0.6.3 21:50:41 <rortom> it was "just" 4/4 times, then switched back to 0.6.3 21:52:47 <Celestar> Rubidium is _the_ desync killing man 21:53:10 <rortom> hehe ;) 21:53:28 <rortom> i guess its manualy bug finding every time? 21:53:38 <rortom> with printf and lots of work involved? 21:53:52 <Aali> rortom: so how do i reproduce it? whats your setup? 21:54:06 *** TinoDidriksen [~projectjj@213.237.107.120.adsl.od.worldonline.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:54:14 <rortom> Aali: http://www.openttd.org/en/server/3040 21:54:15 *** TinoDidriksen [~projectjj@213.237.107.120.adsl.od.worldonline.dk] has joined #openttd 21:54:21 <rortom> oh wait 21:54:24 <rortom> wrong setup 21:54:27 <rortom> let me restart it 21:54:39 <Celestar> rortom: http://wiki.openttd.org/wiki/index.php/OpenTTDDevBlackBook/Network/Desync_debugging 21:54:41 * SmatZ doesn't let rortom restart it, sorry :-x 21:54:47 <Aali> well, i would have to run it on my machine 21:59:21 <rortom> Aali: pls refresh, should run with the correct GRFs now 21:59:29 <rortom> thanks Celestar and Aali :) 22:00:00 *** Char [~Ich@d83-189-152-249.cust.tele2.ch] has joined #openttd 22:00:06 <Aali> those grfs shouldn't be a problem 22:00:27 <rortom> yeah, *should* ;) 22:00:45 <rortom> could be that 0.6.3 removed some GRFs :( 22:00:48 *** Chrill [~chrischri@c80-216-96-107.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #openttd 22:00:50 <rortom> from the list i mean 22:01:18 <Aali> does the server get alot of traffic? 22:01:24 <Ammler> I only know of desyncs if you mix GRF with static grfs 22:01:43 <Ammler> but that should be fixed in trunk 22:04:42 <Celestar> Aali: what does that have to do with anything? 22:05:41 <Aali> Celestar: i assume it doesn't just desync all by itself without anyone actually playing :P 22:06:23 <Celestar> Aali: the server can't desync 22:06:25 *** De_Ghosty [~s@76-10-132-242.dsl.teksavvy.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:07:01 <rortom> mh i should start a second test server 22:07:08 <rortom> and let that desync with the nightlies 22:07:10 <Aali> Celestar: of course not, but if no-one is building anything, it's not going to desync unless there's something wrong with the server 22:07:17 <rortom> mh 22:07:29 <rortom> maybe test it with stupid multiplayer ai? 22:07:30 <Celestar> Aali: it can desync even then 22:08:14 <Celestar> if there's a bug 22:08:45 <Aali> Celestar: sure, if the bug is in any of the features that run without player interaction 22:09:10 <Celestar> a *lot* a features run without players 22:09:39 <Aali> but not all of them, and if there was a problem with them, everyone would get these desyncs 22:09:46 <Celestar> aye 22:09:47 *** NukeBuster [~NukeBuste@80.101.115.82] has quit [Quit: http://www.interplay.com/] 22:10:03 <Celestar> Aali: you need to understand what a desync is first. 22:10:16 <Aali> i know what a desync is 22:10:29 <Celestar> good. 22:10:32 <Celestar> cuz few do (= 22:11:23 <rortom> ;) 22:11:27 <rortom> thanks for the help :) 22:11:31 <Celestar> np 22:11:32 <Ammler> another pro for noai on clients 22:11:38 <Celestar> ? 22:11:40 <rortom> dont you do some MP stress testing games stuff? 22:11:51 <Ammler> you could let them play until it desyncs :-) 22:12:00 <rortom> ^ thats what i mean :) 22:12:15 <Aali> rortom: if you can, leave a game running with a few dummy clients and see what happens 22:12:22 <Celestar> rortom: why stress testing? 22:12:33 <rortom> idk why it happens really 22:12:41 <rortom> but i will try to setup such a game 22:12:45 <Ammler> but sadly, "they" decided to not let ai runs on cleints :-( 22:12:46 <Aali> if it does indeed desync on its own, it'll be a simple matter of finding the revision where it was introduced 22:12:54 <rortom> can you speed up the game's internal clock somehow? 22:13:23 <Aali> not in MP 22:13:26 <rortom> like simulate as fast as possible? 22:13:27 <rortom> mhm : 22:13:29 <rortom> :\ 22:13:40 <rortom> if i hack server and client? 22:13:51 <Ammler> it might desync then :P 22:13:52 <Celestar> rortom: I know why it happens 22:13:52 <planetmaker> rortom: daylength patch 22:14:02 *** Netsplit synthon.oftc.net <-> scorpio.oftc.net quits: wgrant 22:14:05 <rortom> o_O 22:14:10 *** Netsplit over, joins: wgrant 22:14:12 <planetmaker> patch by Celestar ! yeah :) 22:14:16 <rortom> daylenght patch? 22:14:24 <rortom> was it added finally? 22:14:34 <planetmaker> that's a patch which modifies game speed. No, it's still a patch. 22:14:48 <Celestar> rortom: it happens because the PRNG on the server and clients have different outputs :P 22:15:38 <Ammler> still a patch, not a advanced setting :-P 22:16:01 <planetmaker> yeah. That's a place where this distinction is quite adequate :) 22:16:05 <Aali> anyways, the whole thing is more or less meaningless if you're not using the original, unmodified nightly 22:16:18 <Celestar> the TTRS can cause problems 22:16:24 <Celestar> well .. 22:16:29 <Celestar> afaik it's known to cause problems 22:16:43 <rortom> Celestar: oh, really :P 22:16:52 <Celestar> mostly in the year 1970 or so 22:17:04 <Ammler> rortom: if it desync, did you need to restart the server? 22:17:08 <rortom> yes 22:17:19 <Ammler> or just rejoin and continue? 22:17:25 <Celestar> sounds very TTRSish to me 22:17:28 <rortom> i can rejoin and directly desync again 22:17:47 <rortom> ~ 10 secs ingame or so 22:17:56 <Ammler> Celestar: something similar we had on our test server? 22:18:18 <Celestar> possibly yes. 22:18:29 <Aali> wasn't that fixed? 22:18:43 <Celestar> afaik that cannot be fixed, since it is a flaw in the TTRS or summin 22:18:51 <Celestar> I'm sure petern and Belugas know more about it 22:19:07 <Aali> someone should fix TTRS, then 22:19:37 <Celestar> or make a workaround grf :P 22:19:51 <Ammler> hmm, was that George? 22:21:42 <Ammler> good night everybody... 22:22:34 <planetmaker> night Ammler 22:22:47 <rortom> night 22:23:13 *** fonso [~fonso@e178115073.adsl.alicedsl.de] has left #openttd [Kopete 0.12.7 : http://kopete.kde.org] 22:27:04 *** TinoM [~Tino@i59F5D082.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 22:29:10 *** nekx [~asd@0x3e42e6e6.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #openttd 22:30:21 <Celestar> I'm going to sleep as well. 22:30:25 <Celestar> gnight 22:30:46 *** Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@p5B0DA23D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:36:36 *** Jezral [~projectjj@213.237.107.120.adsl.od.worldonline.dk] has joined #openttd 22:38:14 *** welshdragon2 [~vista@87.102.21.185] has joined #openttd 22:41:36 <ln-> 20 dead in germany :/ 22:42:40 <tokai> Only? I expected much more people die everyday in Germany. 22:43:00 <rortom> huh? 22:43:16 *** TinoDidriksen [~projectjj@213.237.107.120.adsl.od.worldonline.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:43:34 <rortom> argh, highway accident :( 22:44:21 <Nite_Owl> Later all 22:44:30 *** Nite_Owl [~Nite_Owl@c-75-74-51-51.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Read You Soon] 22:44:56 *** welshdragon [~vista@87.102.21.185] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:45:29 *** welshdragon2 is now known as welshdragon 22:46:15 <thingwath> 20 people in a single highway accident? 22:49:51 <ln-> tokai: an excellent topic to joke about. 22:50:23 <tokai> ln-: I didn't joke. 22:52:08 <Rubidium> when it's 20 at once it's notable, when there are 10 accidents with 3 nobody cares... 22:53:25 <ln-> "Beim Brand eines Reisebusses auf der Autobahn A2 bei Hannover sind Polizeinangaben zufolge mindestens 20 Menschen, Ìberwiegend Rentner, ums Leben gekommen. Das Fahrzeug hat wÀhrend der Fahrt Richtung Berlin Feuer gefangen - ein Fahrgast soll heimlich auf der Toilette geraucht haben." 22:56:02 <thingwath> Rubidium: such accidents are quite often driver's fault 22:57:44 <ln-> thingwath: not this time, as seen above. 22:59:00 <thingwath> would have to translate it with google or something :-) 22:59:12 <thingwath> and I meant those smaller accidents 23:08:20 *** Foto2 [~Foto2@cpe.atm2-0-12958.0x3ef276f2.abnxx10.customer.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 23:10:45 *** Sacro_ [~ben@adsl-87-102-39-137.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 23:14:31 *** Sacro [~ben@adsl-87-102-39-137.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:15:27 *** Yeggstry [~mind@cpc1-rdng14-0-0-cust946.winn.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:20:30 *** Foto2 [~Foto2@cpe.atm2-0-12958.0x3ef276f2.abnxx10.customer.tele.dk] has quit [Quit: Bye for now!] 23:22:52 *** De_Ghosty [~s@76-10-132-60.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #openttd 23:24:49 *** Sacro_ is now known as Sacro 23:27:48 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@89.246.176.68] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:28:33 *** Chrill [~chrischri@c80-216-96-107.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [] 23:38:13 *** Zahl [~Zahl@g227073228.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Quit: Rhabarberbarbarabarbarbarenbartbarbierbierbar] 23:38:35 *** Netsplit resistance.oftc.net <-> scorpio.oftc.net quits: wgrant 23:39:21 *** davis- [~suckyours@p5B28F705.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:41:18 *** Netsplit over, joins: wgrant 23:56:40 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1E030.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]