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00:31:15 *** KenjiE20|LT [~Kenji@host86-171-52-211.range86-171.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 00:31:40 *** KenjiE20 [~KenjiE20@92.22.13.88] has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- s0 d4Mn l33t |t'z 5c4rY!] 00:33:33 *** Nite_Owl [~Nite_Owl@c-76-109-50-97.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:43:30 *** Zahl [~Zahl@f051176048.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Quit: *schiel*] 00:44:37 *** Nite_Owl [~Nite_Owl@c-76-109-50-97.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 00:44:59 <Nite_Owl> PC Popsicle 00:49:55 *** fjb_ [~frank@p5485B320.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 00:53:43 *** fjb [~frank@p5485D637.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:00:57 *** SineDeviance [~jman@cpe-075-176-106-090.carolina.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:02:23 *** SHRIKEE [~shrikee@84-105-53-197.cable.quicknet.nl] has quit [Quit: SHRIKEE] 01:02:34 *** Brianetta [~brian@client-86-24-144-96.winn.adsl.virgin.net] has quit [Quit: Tsch?ss] 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[~jman@cpe-075-176-106-090.carolina.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:43:08 *** TinoDidriksen [~tino@port432.ds1-od.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #openttd 03:49:08 *** z-MaTRiX [~matrix@nude.lesbianbath.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:56:46 *** SineDeviance [~jman@cpe-075-176-106-090.carolina.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 04:21:46 *** Splex [~splex@c-24-245-55-70.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:34:05 *** stuffcorpse [~rick@121.98.136.241] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:34:22 *** stuffcorpse [~rick@121.98.136.241] has joined #openttd 04:34:24 *** z-MaTRiX [~matrix@nude.lesbianbath.com] has joined #openttd 04:34:27 <z-MaTRiX> hi 04:34:38 <z-MaTRiX> encountered a weird thing in OpenTTD 04:35:35 <z-MaTRiX> "unload all, and leave empty" option set, train having 275000 litres of oil after leaving 04:41:31 *** tokai [~tokai@p54B827DF.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:42:47 *** 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[~frosch@frnk-590ff3bb.pool.einsundeins.de] has joined #openttd 08:22:23 <petern> hmm, maybe we need to cull trees a bi more 08:27:03 <petern> frosch123, pikka's fixed the grf now :D 08:27:35 <petern> and it does indeed fix the desyncs, at least so far 08:28:48 <frosch123> :) 08:31:13 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1C0A3.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 08:47:12 *** dexistin [~dexistin@87-198-133-78.ptr.magnet.ie] has joined #openttd 08:55:04 <Pikka> woo! :o 08:55:53 *** ctibor_ [~ctibor@77.48.228.43] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 09:01:03 *** Azrael- [~azraeluk@cpc4-papw2-0-0-cust778.cmbg.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd 09:02:28 *** ctibor [~ctibor@77.48.228.43] has joined #openttd 09:02:37 *** Exl [~myself@cp1224652-a.roemd1.lb.home.nl] has joined #openttd 09:07:21 *** Aali_ is now known as Aali 09:11:08 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: rubidium * r16394 /trunk/src/ (16 files in 3 dirs): -Codechange: move (NewGRF) cache variables into a separate struct so (some vehicle related) NewGRF cache 'desyncs' can be tested easier. 09:20:43 *** divo [~asd@0x3e42e6e6.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #openttd 09:22:31 *** yorick [~Yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Quit: Poef!] 09:33:13 *** ctibor_ [~ctibor@77.48.228.43] has joined #openttd 09:36:52 *** ctibor [~ctibor@77.48.228.43] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:55:37 *** reldred1 [~reldred@115.131.192.130] has joined #openttd 09:55:38 *** reldred [~reldred@115.131.200.206] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:05:43 *** Xeryus|bnc is now known as XeryusTC 10:16:01 *** maristo [~maristo@host217-114-156-151.pppoe.mark-itt.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:16:53 *** Zahl_ [~Zahl@g226208112.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd 10:23:00 *** phidah [~phidah@1305ds3-oebr.0.fullrate.dk] has quit [Quit: phidah] 10:23:52 *** Zahl [~Zahl@g226208112.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:23:52 *** Zahl_ is now known as Zahl 10:24:34 *** Biolunar [mahdi@blfd-4db0732d.pool.einsundeins.de] has joined #openttd 10:30:22 *** dexistin [~dexistin@87-198-133-78.ptr.magnet.ie] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:35:45 *** dexistin [~dexistin@87-198-133-78.ptr.magnet.ie] has joined #openttd 10:45:31 *** reldred [~reldred@115.131.205.183] has joined #openttd 10:51:11 *** reldred1 [~reldred@115.131.192.130] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:53:31 <dexistin> hi, i am trying to figure out what is the best way to replace trains between different types of railways 11:04:05 <dexistin> i tried openttd yesterday after several months, and it lacks only complete graphics/sounds replacement to be perfect :-) 11:08:39 <Ammler> dexistin: use some newgrfs and the replacement is "almost" perfect ;-) 11:10:58 *** KenjiE20 [~KenjiE20@92.23.82.231] has joined #openttd 11:13:56 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: smatz * r16395 /trunk/src/ai/api/ai_sign.cpp: -Fix (r16379): max sign ID can be higher than total number of signs 11:20:25 *** dexistin [~dexistin@87-198-133-78.ptr.magnet.ie] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:22:28 *** reldred [~reldred@115.131.205.183] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:35:16 <Ammler> possible a grf made on linux or windows wtth the same nfo and same parameters can differ? 11:35:24 <Ammler> Is it* 11:39:50 <frosch123> you mean because of grfcodec? 11:40:04 <Ammler> frosch123: yes 11:40:11 <frosch123> then I would guess binary include sprites 11:40:28 <Ammler> yep 11:40:30 <frosch123> grfcodec is quite broken if it comes to them 11:40:51 <Ammler> it seems that comments on the nfo has influence on the grf too, possible? 11:41:07 <frosch123> it reads the filename until it encounters a linebreak. so it keeps trailing whitespace including sometimes \r or not 11:46:11 <planetmaker> well... the solution is to actually use identical nfo build scripts on linux and windows :P 11:47:34 *** Klanticus [~quassel@189.35.30.61] has joined #openttd 11:47:36 <Ammler> indeed, they make identical grfs now, so it seems fine. 11:56:38 *** Klanticus [~quassel@189.35.30.61] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:01:16 *** sailo [~simon@hyundai.csn.tu-chemnitz.de] has joined #openttd 12:01:21 *** sailo [~simon@hyundai.csn.tu-chemnitz.de] has left #openttd [] 12:04:33 *** z-MaTRiX [~matrix@nude.lesbianbath.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:05:50 <kkb1101> in ChangeIndustryProduction() function. the variable 'mult' is assigned first and assigned again without being used. 12:06:37 <kkb1101> oh sorry misread actually not 12:08:22 <Alberth> when in doubt, simply highlight all occurrences with the editor search function. 12:10:25 <kkb1101> ok thanks :D 12:13:54 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: rubidium * r16396 /trunk/src/ (11 files): -Codechange: split NewGRF spritegroup into multiple subclasses instead of using a big union 12:27:56 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: rubidium * r16397 /trunk/src/ (8 files in 2 dirs): -Codechange: move GetVehicleOrder/GetLastVehicleOrder into Vehicle 12:32:00 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@94-224-31-113.access.telenet.be] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:41:46 *** yorick [~Yorick@82-171-205-190.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd 12:42:49 *** Klanticus [~quassel@189.35.184.120] has joined #openttd 12:43:04 *** yorick [~Yorick@82-171-205-190.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:43:40 *** yorick [~Yorick@82-171-205-190.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd 12:45:17 *** yorick_ [~Yorick@82-171-205-190.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd 12:54:37 *** yorick_ [~Yorick@82-171-205-190.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Quit: leaving] 12:54:52 *** Klanticus [~quassel@189.35.184.120] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:56:42 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: rubidium * r16398 /trunk/src/newgrf_spritegroup.h: -Feature: make NewGRF callbacks work again; honouring the 'features' of 0.3.2.1, which was released only 5 years ago. 12:57:11 *** Muxy [~Muxy@smtp.bdelalande.net] has joined #openttd 12:57:55 <Muxy> Kiss from Goulp 12:58:04 <yorick> 0.3.2.1 features are building on FreeBSD and MorphOS 12:59:09 <yorick> ? 12:59:43 *** z-MaTRiX [~matrix@nude.lesbianbath.com] has joined #openttd 12:59:47 <z-MaTRiX> hi 13:00:03 <z-MaTRiX> this network is continuously disconnecting 13:00:32 <Eddi|zuHause> no, it's you. 13:09:47 *** Frostregen [~sucks@dslb-084-058-187-113.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 13:12:20 *** Pikka [~PikkaBird@CPE-124-187-66-158.qld.bigpond.net.au] has quit [] 13:14:41 *** yorick_ [~Yorick@82-171-205-190.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd 13:15:13 *** yorick is now known as Guest169 13:15:13 *** yorick_ is now known as yorick 13:18:09 * yorick looks at z-MaTRiX' hostname... 13:21:02 *** Guest169 [~Yorick@82-171-205-190.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:21:37 <Muxy> Is there a way to make an airport grow automatically ? 13:21:46 <yorick> there isn't. 13:22:31 <Muxy> programmatically speaking 13:22:33 <yorick> you mean like there's planes, and there's more planes, and then all of a sudden there's a bigger airport? 13:23:01 <Muxy> according to its traffic and quality level 13:23:15 <SmatZ> everything is possible 13:23:31 <Alberth> but far from trivial :) 13:23:44 <Muxy> it's a question of time and resources... i know 13:25:33 <Muxy> and of course time... because after plane evolution, there is no solution to use small airports 13:26:38 <Muxy> Yorck: You see what i mean ? 13:29:09 <SmatZ> Muxy: you can use that "Engines never expire" setting 13:29:25 <SmatZ> and helis can use small airports too :-p 13:36:17 *** Singaporekid [~notme@cm234.psi148.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #openttd 13:38:18 *** Yexo [~Yexo@32-88-ftth.onsneteindhoven.nl] has joined #openttd 13:38:42 <Yexo> hello 13:41:20 <z-MaTRiX> Eddi|zuHause, all other servers running ok 13:41:52 <z-MaTRiX> Muxy, there is way to make airport grow? 13:42:15 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: frosch * r16399 /trunk/src/newgrf.cpp: -Fix (r4540): Don't treat pointer values as integer. 13:43:00 <z-MaTRiX> yorick, like it? ;> 13:44:03 *** yorick_ [~Yorick@82-171-205-190.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd 13:50:32 *** yorick [~Yorick@82-171-205-190.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:52:26 *** yorick_ is now known as yorick 14:00:35 *** Boukev [~Boukev@195-240-200-232.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd 14:00:52 <Boukev> Hi all 14:01:04 <Alberth> hi 14:02:50 <Boukev> Was just wondering, is there any database of track layouts or something somewhere online? 14:03:12 <Alberth> the wiki, the openttdcoop wiki 14:03:20 <Boukev> Thanks will check 14:04:19 <z-MaTRiX> yeah 14:06:08 <Boukev> Some great junctions in there :) 14:08:34 *** Brianetta [~brian@client-86-24-144-96.winn.adsl.virgin.net] has joined #openttd 14:15:12 *** Klanticus [~quassel@189.35.30.61] has joined #openttd 14:26:48 *** z-MaTRiX [~matrix@nude.lesbianbath.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:27:18 *** PeterT [~Peter@c-76-19-209-23.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 14:30:53 *** PeterT [~Peter@c-76-19-209-23.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [] 14:34:04 *** z-MaTRiX [~matrix@2a01:270:dd00:7700:404:dead:beef:cafe] has joined #openttd 14:34:10 <z-MaTRiX> reloaded 14:35:24 *** Boukev [~Boukev@195-240-200-232.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [] 14:43:54 *** ctibor_ [~ctibor@77.48.228.43] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 14:44:19 *** ctibor_ [~ctibor@77.48.228.43] has joined #openttd 14:45:52 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@94-224-31-113.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 14:55:07 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: yexo * r16400 /trunk/ (9 files in 4 dirs): -Add [NoAI]: add AISignList that can be used to get a list of valid signs. This makes AISign::GetMaxSignID obsolete. 14:58:14 *** mdv is now known as neli 15:13:05 *** SineDeviance [~jman@cpe-075-176-106-090.carolina.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 15:23:36 *** fonsinchen [~alve@BAEc11f.bae.pppool.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:23:53 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: yexo * r16401 /trunk/source.list: -Fix (r16400): forgot to commit the changes to source.list (thanks SmatZ) 15:26:04 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: rubidium * r16402 /trunk/src/ (10 files): -Codechange: make Resolve a function of SpriteGroup 15:28:16 *** Hirundo_ [~chatzilla@5355F5FD.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd 15:28:17 *** lewymati [~lewymati@aejn21.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #openttd 15:33:46 *** Hirundo [~chatzilla@5355F5FD.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:33:57 *** Hirundo_ is now known as Hirundo 15:35:20 *** Fuco [~dota.keys@fuco.sks1.muni.cz] has quit [Quit: Quit] 15:37:05 *** lobstah is now known as lobster 15:39:13 *** Fuco [~dota.keys@fuco.sks1.muni.cz] has joined #openttd 15:42:12 *** dexistin [~dexistin@87-198-133-78.ptr.magnet.ie] has joined #openttd 15:46:12 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: smatz * r16403 /trunk/ (18 files in 5 dirs): -Codechange: move code related to subsidies to separate file 15:53:48 *** Frostregen [~sucks@dslb-084-058-187-113.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:00:13 *** TinoM [~Tino@i59F5D031.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:01:28 <z-MaTRiX> only ocean level can contain water? 16:01:59 <z-MaTRiX> (thinking about higher ocean level) 16:02:12 <frosch123> there are canals and rivers 16:02:17 <Eddi|zuHause> there is an old patch doing that 16:03:01 <z-MaTRiX> but unpatched its default right? 16:03:09 *** d3xistin [~dexistin@87-198-133-78.ptr.magnet.ie] has joined #openttd 16:03:57 <z-MaTRiX> have not seen water at higher levels, was just wondering 16:05:43 <_ln> it's realism. you know water will not stay above sea level in real life either. 16:05:59 <d3xistin> eh? 16:07:22 *** Dred_furst [~Dred@resnet749.bournemouth.ac.uk] has joined #openttd 16:07:49 <d3xistin> i guess z-M refers to lakes or maybe even rivers 16:09:31 *** dexistin [~dexistin@87-198-133-78.ptr.magnet.ie] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:09:38 <d3xistin> just saying it's real, imHo it's absolutely not worth implementing 16:09:58 <_ln> i know... i'm just trying to make Belugas believe it's being realistic now, so he could fix it to unrealistic. 16:10:52 <z-MaTRiX> _ln, well, if you higher the sea edges above sea-level... 16:11:43 <z-MaTRiX> d3xistin, yep that will be a lake 16:12:10 *** d3xistin is now known as dexistin 16:12:16 <Eddi|zuHause> z-MaTRiX: rivers and lakes are already implemented 16:12:39 <Eddi|zuHause> they are just not autogenerated 16:12:51 <Eddi|zuHause> feel free to address that ;) 16:12:58 <z-MaTRiX> oh ok 16:12:58 <z-MaTRiX> :) 16:13:14 <Eddi|zuHause> hey, idea: use squirrel for map generation :p 16:13:29 <Yexo> Eddi|zuHause: already done, and it's too slow :) 16:13:51 <planetmaker> :D 16:14:01 <z-MaTRiX> "save the trees, eat beavers!" 16:14:33 <dexistin> mm, how can you make a river? 16:14:48 <z-MaTRiX> guessing, map generator 16:14:58 <yorick> wrong... 16:15:01 <yorick> it's the river button 16:15:02 <z-MaTRiX> ;< 16:15:29 <z-MaTRiX> transport company makes rivers?:) 16:15:31 <z-MaTRiX> nice 16:15:42 <yorick> np 16:15:44 <yorick> no 16:15:48 <yorick> the scenario editor 16:15:53 <yorick> unless ammler has it his way 16:16:33 *** TinoM [~Tino@i59F5D031.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 16:16:35 *** EoD [~EoD@2001:6f8:11ba:3:230:48ff:fe42:121c] has joined #openttd 16:16:42 <EoD> hi 16:17:08 <Ammler> he? 16:17:13 <planetmaker> hm? 16:17:39 <Ammler> there is sadly no possibility to make rivers ingame, wrt realism. 16:17:59 <z-MaTRiX> 1000000000 euro should do it :) 16:18:18 <planetmaker> oh, yes 16:18:30 <EoD> Has anyone ever tried to compile openttd on sparc (32/64 bit)? 16:18:40 <_ln> EoD: o/ 16:18:40 <EoD> sparc/linux 16:18:45 <_ln> not linux 16:19:05 <planetmaker> well, not really, EoD :) 16:19:11 <planetmaker> Give me access and I might try :) 16:19:19 <Alberth> z-MaTRiX: sure, want my bank account number? 16:19:22 <EoD> ok, so i'll post a bug report 16:19:46 <EoD> i'm using openttd on my sparc(/linux) with 32bit userland for a while now, but 64 bit fails to execute 16:20:04 <EoD> With a "Bus error" 16:20:07 <z-MaTRiX> should ? refer to credits ?:) 16:22:21 <planetmaker> nice, EoD 16:22:31 <planetmaker> any idea why? Sounds like faulty memory access. 16:23:04 *** goodger [~ben@host86-156-60-33.range86-156.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: +++ Out Of Cheese Error +++] 16:23:17 *** goodger [~ben@host86-156-60-33.range86-156.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 16:23:23 *** DR_Jekyll [DrJekyll@p57B0B455.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 16:23:26 <EoD> no idea so far. I can assure that it don't have faulty memory, it's ECC Ram which is really fine 16:26:02 <EoD> I think it's some combination of (64bit) memory handling and big endian (as it works fine on amd64 and 32bit sparc) 16:28:20 <planetmaker> EoD: I didn't mean to imply that you have faulty memory :) 16:28:39 <planetmaker> I get bus errors, if I programme wrongly and access wrong parts of memory 16:29:02 <_ln> take the train 16:29:03 *** ctibor_ [~ctibor@77.48.228.43] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:29:28 <EoD> yeah, but bus errors also occur if you have faulty memory. Just wanted to mention that i don't have faulty memory :) 16:29:37 <planetmaker> ok :) 16:29:47 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@88.130.169.97] has joined #openttd 16:30:31 <frosch123> http://bugs.openttd.org/task/2909 <- bus error 16:30:33 *** Wolle [DrJekyll@p57B0C73F.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:31:30 <planetmaker> haha :) 16:31:54 <EoD> lol 16:36:52 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@89.246.175.250] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:40:08 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: rubidium * r16404 /trunk/src/newgrf_spritegroup.h: 16:40:08 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: -Fix [FS#2911] (r16378): the number of spritegroups got halved when the new pool was added, which mean there weren't enough spritegroups when you have more than about a dozen ECS vectors. 16:40:08 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: -Change: increase the spritegroup pool's maximum size to something more than the 16:40:08 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: number of real sprites that OpenTTD can handle; for example ECS has about 30 16:40:09 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: spritegroups per real sprite. With the 'old' limit that would mean 'only' about 16:40:09 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: 4000 real sprites worth of spritegroups could be loaded. 16:43:22 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:46:09 <Ammler> hehe, nice comment 16:50:56 *** Klanticus [~quassel@189.35.30.61] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:53:02 *** Splex [~splex@c-24-245-55-70.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 16:54:21 <EoD> I'll test sparc64 with some other revisions (without ipv6, without the dynamical memory handling and such things) before i post a bugreport 16:54:38 *** goodger [~ben@host86-156-60-33.range86-156.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: +++ Out Of Cheese Error +++] 16:59:53 <EoD> oldpool is gone? :( 17:01:01 <Alberth> no more swimming 17:08:36 *** DR_Jekyll [DrJekyll@p57B0B455.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: http://www.lagerwiki.de - das Wiki rund um's Thema Lager und Logistik] 17:09:52 <Eddi|zuHause> "goes it throw out limitation?" 17:10:44 *** Biolunar [mahdi@blfd-4db0732d.pool.einsundeins.de] has quit [Quit: bis dann] 17:13:37 *** yorick is now known as Guest190 17:13:41 *** yorick [~Yorick@82-171-205-190.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #openttd 17:16:53 *** Guest190 [~Yorick@82-171-205-190.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:17:47 *** theholyduck [~duckzorz@38.80-202-138.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd 17:18:08 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@94-224-31-113.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: oO] 17:22:07 <SmatZ> EoD: I am regularly testing it on sparc/solaris 17:22:52 <SmatZ> EoD: sparc is "sensitive" to unaligned 64bit memory access 17:23:17 <SmatZ> accessing unaligned 64bit ints 17:23:39 <SmatZ> but 32bit are no problem 17:24:24 <_ln> "sensitive" as in it crashes? 17:25:00 <SmatZ> with bus error 17:26:40 <_ln> is that a documented feature of sparc? 17:27:00 <SmatZ> I suppose so :) 17:27:10 <SmatZ> it would be strange not to have this documented 17:27:29 <SmatZ> I think special instruction is used to access 64bit data 17:27:31 <EoD> i had some problems with a dual-pci-x Intel NIC which ended in a bus error, too. 17:27:34 <SmatZ> and it requires them to be aligned 17:27:36 <SmatZ> or so 17:27:43 <Alberth> It is not uncommon, the M68000 didn't allow 32 bit value access unaligned. 17:28:31 <SmatZ> actually maybe most architectures require aligned access :) 17:29:52 *** tokai [~tokai@p54B822A2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Icebears are cute. Please, take care of them!] 17:29:54 *** ctibor_ [~ctibor@77.48.228.43] has joined #openttd 17:30:15 <petern> the question is where is it unaligned 17:31:13 *** ecke [~ecke@213.195.202.11] has joined #openttd 17:32:09 *** tokai [~tokai@p54B822A2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 17:32:12 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 17:32:12 <EoD> what exactly does this mean for openttd? 17:32:18 <Eddi|zuHause> SmatZ: but is that than not a bug of the compiler which inserts that instruction in places where it is not safe? 17:32:26 <Eddi|zuHause> *then 17:33:19 <SmatZ> Eddi|zuHause: the code is breaking the standard 17:33:25 <SmatZ> so it's not compiler bug 17:33:52 <Eddi|zuHause> why would high level language code care about alignment? 17:34:53 <_ln> C++ is not that high-level. 17:35:43 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, which part is the broken standard then? 17:36:48 <EoD> join #openttd.nightly6 17:36:52 <EoD> sorry 17:37:33 <SmatZ> Eddi|zuHause: pointer to type x should be able to access type x 17:37:54 <SmatZ> if the programmer is messing with pointers, it's his fault the code doesn't work 17:39:44 <Eddi|zuHause> that does not explain why the compiler inserts an alignment-critical instruction in places where he cannot guarantee alignment (and thus should insert a non-alignment-critical function) 17:40:45 <Eddi|zuHause> and in places like this languages which allow range checking could be helpful 17:42:34 <_ln> well what should the compiler do if you have e.g.: long long a, *b = a; b += 2; 17:42:39 <SmatZ> it's defined "int64_t" is aligned at 8-byte boundary 17:42:47 <SmatZ> for that architecture 17:43:07 <SmatZ> so if you change the pointer so it doesn't point to 8-byte boundary, you will break the code 17:44:45 <Alberth> _ln: that will move b 16 byes (2*sizeof(long long)) 17:45:25 <Alberth> You'll need to create an unaligned pointer, then cast it. 17:45:40 <_ln> Alberth: you're right.. what if we assume we had violently casted it to a char*, which i forgot to mention. 17:45:57 <SmatZ> _ln: undefined behaviour 17:46:45 <_ln> hmm, or is the verb "cast, cast, cast"? it probably is. english only. 17:46:47 <Alberth> so a crash is acceptable behavior :) 17:47:51 <SmatZ> A pointer to an object or incomplete type may be converted to a pointer to a different 17:47:53 <SmatZ> object or incomplete type. If the resulting pointer is not correctly aligned57) for the 17:47:54 <SmatZ> pointed-to type, the behavior is undefined. 17:47:57 <SmatZ> Eddi|zuHause: ^^^ 17:50:27 <EoD> Is there any way i can help? 17:51:44 <SmatZ> EoD: correctly report the problem at bugs.openttd.org , ideally with a way to reproduce and backtrace :) 17:52:33 <EoD> backtrace is hard 17:53:44 <petern> why? 17:55:10 <Eddi|zuHause> just run a preprocessor that inserts an assert before each dereferencing operation? 17:55:50 <SmatZ> not needed, just gdb bin/openttd ; r ; crash it ; bt full 17:56:28 <EoD> I have a 32bit userland (Sparc/Gentoo), so it isn't that easy to get gdb or at least strace to compile 64bit compatible 17:56:31 <Eddi|zuHause> ./configure --enable-debug=1 && make run-gdb 17:57:17 *** dexistin [~dexistin@87-198-133-78.ptr.magnet.ie] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:58:35 <EoD> I already tried several ways to get straces compiled with -m64, but it didn't work so farr 18:00:56 <petern> strace is not useful anyway 18:01:17 <EoD> no it isn't, but it's much smaller than gdb ;) 18:06:55 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: alberth * r16405 /trunk/src/widget.cpp: -Codechange: Move widget drawing code to functions to allow re-use. 18:07:12 *** yorick [~Yorick@82-171-205-190.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:07:31 <SmatZ> EoD: I don't quite understand your problem 18:07:52 <SmatZ> you don't need 64bit system to use 64bit variables 18:08:39 <SmatZ> just install gdb the same way you installed OTTD 18:08:40 <EoD> 32bit gdb works with 64bit files? 18:09:00 <SmatZ> EoD: you are running 64bit OTTD on 32bit system? 18:09:03 <EoD> no 18:09:16 <EoD> I'm using a Sparc/Gentoo system which has a 64bit kernel but a 32bit userland 18:09:16 <SmatZ> so why would you need 64bit gdb for that? 18:09:34 <EoD> I don't? 18:09:34 <SmatZ> ah 18:09:48 * EoD gets confused 18:10:09 <SmatZ> hmm are you mixing 64bit kernel with 32bit glibc? 18:10:44 <EoD> Usually, yes 18:11:12 <EoD> But there someone published some doc to get multilib gcc/glibc on gentoo sparc, which allows to compile 64bit binaries 18:11:18 <EoD> it's a kind of confusing/complicated 18:11:31 <EoD> http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/base/sparc/multilib.xml 18:12:00 <petern> seems kind of pointless 18:12:09 <EoD> read the top and the bottom 18:13:19 <EoD> I'm not really that familiar with sparc architecture in general, but i never heard someone telling me that 64bit userland in sparc is any good 18:13:40 <EoD> except for e.g. mysql, iptables and some similiar applications 18:14:00 <SmatZ> well my guess is the crash is somewhere outside OTTD 18:14:44 <petern> sounds flakey 18:14:44 <petern> so 18:14:45 <EoD> hmmm. I thought about it, too. But why does ottd crash and my binaries don't? 18:14:57 <petern> so your userland is 32 bit 18:15:03 <petern> and your ottd is 32 bit? 18:15:25 <EoD> my 32bit ottd works just fine, my 64bit ottd doesn't 18:15:53 *** Hirundo [~chatzilla@5355F5FD.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.10/2009042316]] 18:15:54 <EoD> userland is 32bit, except for gcc and glibc 18:16:12 <petern> so basically 18:16:19 <petern> ignore 64 bit ottd 18:16:50 <EoD> so i have to set up some sparc64/debian system to post bug reports about ottd? 18:17:00 <SmatZ> and SDL is 32bit? 18:17:16 <EoD> it's a dedicated version without zlib 18:17:40 <EoD> the sparc is my server/router 18:21:24 <EoD> btw: ottd 0.4 segfaults on sparc64 (no bus error). I'll test ottd 0.5 18:21:38 <SmatZ> eh 18:22:07 <EoD> just digging out old versions to be sure no version ever worked on sparc64 :) 18:22:11 <SmatZ> don't care about <0.7 and <r16405 18:22:18 <EoD> how so? ^^ 18:22:31 <SmatZ> it's pointless 18:22:45 <SmatZ> nobody will fix bugs in 0.4 branch 18:22:49 <EoD> of course 18:22:51 *** goodger [~ben@host86-156-60-33.range86-156.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 18:23:24 <Eddi|zuHause> the possibility of this being a regression is very low 18:23:55 *** yorick [~Yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 18:25:47 <EoD> Is it possible to debug a 64bit binary with a 32bit gdb (i just read about "multi-arch" at the gdb homepage)? 18:29:23 *** [com]buster [~eternal@cust-03-55bf402e.adsl.scarlet.nl] has joined #openttd 18:30:36 <petern> you'll just have to try it 18:31:08 <EoD> already compiling 18:34:50 *** reldred [~reldred@115.131.197.110] has joined #openttd 18:37:27 <EoD> i'm afk until gdb finished compiling (~about tomorrow morning) 18:37:33 <EoD> good evening everyone 18:42:16 <Eddi|zuHause> if you have to compile anyway, why not simply compile as 64 bit? 18:46:18 *** PeterT [~Peter@c-76-19-209-23.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 18:46:32 *** Frostregen [~sucks@dslb-084-058-113-203.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 18:47:59 <EoD> then i have to compile ncurses, readline and lzma-utils as 64bit, too. This reduces the change of successful compilation a lot :) 18:48:24 <EoD> I'll try to compile gdb as 64bit if it doesn't work with the 32bit gdb version 18:48:58 <Eddi|zuHause> i have no idea why you go through the whole multiarchitecture trouble anyway 18:52:09 <EoD> to find a way to get openttd sparc64 compatible 18:57:14 *** Muxy [~Muxy@smtp.bdelalande.net] has quit [Quit: Kopete 0.12.5 : http://kopete.kde.org] 19:05:15 <EoD> i think i'm back tomorrow 19:05:17 <EoD> bye everyone 19:05:20 *** EoD [~EoD@2001:6f8:11ba:3:230:48ff:fe42:121c] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.10/2009042315]] 19:08:41 *** lewymati [~lewymati@aejn21.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:09:23 *** lewymati [~lewymati@aejk48.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #openttd 19:14:02 *** fonsinchen [~alve@BAEc11f.bae.pppool.de] has joined #openttd 19:17:58 <fonsinchen> @seen TrueBrain 19:17:58 <DorpsGek> fonsinchen: TrueBrain was last seen in #openttd 1 week, 4 days, 7 hours, 40 minutes, and 17 seconds ago: <TrueBrain> you catched on on that? :) 19:18:08 <planetmaker> he, yeah 19:18:13 <fonsinchen> where is he? 19:18:16 <planetmaker> both super-admins gone :P 19:18:23 <planetmaker> on Earth 19:18:39 <TinoDidriksen> Email them if you miss them so much? 19:18:39 <planetmaker> taking a well-deserved break, I guess :) 19:19:00 <fonsinchen> I don't have his email address 19:19:11 <planetmaker> well... but you could look them up? 19:19:31 <planetmaker> every dev has an e-mail address here 19:19:41 <planetmaker> dunno though, if they're read :D 19:21:09 <fonsinchen> where would I find that address? And is there anyone else I can talk to about building cargodist on the compile farm? 19:21:44 <PeterT> is there a way to resize a scenario by converting it to a height map? 19:21:50 <planetmaker> fonsinchen: I guess not 19:22:05 <planetmaker> PeterT: not really... 19:22:12 <PeterT> oh darn it 19:22:58 <Eddi|zuHause> fonsinchen: ever tried /msg TrueBrain <blah>? 19:23:14 <Eddi|zuHause> people do not need to be here to be here... 19:23:18 <fonsinchen> no, I didn't know that command 19:23:29 <Alberth> usually people don't like that 19:23:56 <Eddi|zuHause> and for reference, also try /whois TrueBrain 19:24:54 <fonsinchen> He's online actually 19:26:15 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: smatz * r16406 /trunk/src/ (subsidy.cpp subsidy_func.h): -Codechange: constify parameters of CheckSubsidised() 19:28:25 <Ammler> fonsinchen: the dir is up, if you still need a mirror for ;-) 19:32:18 <fonsinchen> I think I'll build my own windows binaries and host them myself until TrueBrain shows up again. Unfortunately I can't give anyone SSH access on that webserver so I might use your server later. Thanks. 19:37:26 *** Alberth [~hat@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has left #openttd [] 19:38:14 <Ammler> truebrain has already access there 19:39:12 <fonsinchen> Yes, I know. 19:43:21 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: smatz * r16407 /trunk/src/ (economy.cpp saveload/afterload.cpp station.cpp): -Fix [FS#2913]: set CargoPacket::source to INVALID_STATION when source station is deleted 19:45:20 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:a994:87e1:76e3:e5c1] has joined #openttd 19:45:23 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 20:03:50 *** Singaporekid [~notme@cm234.psi148.maxonline.com.sg] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:24:08 *** Dred_furst [~Dred@resnet749.bournemouth.ac.uk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:26:15 *** Polygon [~Poly@p54B47927.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 20:40:46 *** Muxy [~Muxy@smtp.bdelalande.net] has joined #openttd 20:49:46 *** tux_mark_5 [~kvirc@lan-84-240-29-163.vln.skynet.lt] has joined #openttd 21:07:56 *** Azrael- [~azraeluk@cpc4-papw2-0-0-cust778.cmbg.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:10:26 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@62.73.249.23] has joined #openttd 21:21:46 *** Zarb [~benoit@smtp.bdelalande.net] has joined #openttd 21:23:47 *** Zarb [~benoit@smtp.bdelalande.net] has quit [] 21:24:20 *** Zarb [~benoit@smtp.bdelalande.net] has joined #openttd 21:24:29 *** Zarb [~benoit@smtp.bdelalande.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:26:37 *** Goulp [~benoit@smtp.bdelalande.net] has joined #openttd 21:27:32 *** Goulp [~benoit@smtp.bdelalande.net] has left #openttd [] 21:28:18 *** Muxy [~Muxy@smtp.bdelalande.net] has quit [Quit: Kopete 0.12.5 : http://kopete.kde.org] 21:28:54 *** Muxy [~Muxy@smtp.bdelalande.net] has joined #openttd 21:29:53 *** z-MaTRiX [~matrix@2a01:270:dd00:7700:404:dead:beef:cafe] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:30:12 *** Goulp [~benoit@smtp.bdelalande.net] has joined #openttd 21:32:51 *** Polygon [~Poly@p54B47927.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 21:35:53 *** tux_mark_5 [~kvirc@lan-84-240-29-163.vln.skynet.lt] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:39:44 *** yorick [~Yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Quit: Poef!] 21:41:37 *** Goulp [~benoit@smtp.bdelalande.net] has quit [Quit: back to the Goulp :) !] 21:42:44 *** Muxy [~Muxy@smtp.bdelalande.net] has quit [Quit: back to the goulp aussi] 21:44:17 <Sacro> http://channelbee.com/move/gags#2945 21:45:21 *** fonsinchen [~alve@BAEc11f.bae.pppool.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:45:24 *** lewymati [~lewymati@aejk48.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [] 21:46:14 *** [com]buster [~eternal@cust-03-55bf402e.adsl.scarlet.nl] has quit [Quit: Operator, give me an exit] 22:14:50 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1C0A3.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:19:19 *** duckzor_ [~duckzorz@38.80-202-138.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd 22:23:42 *** duckzor [~duckzorz@38.80-202-138.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd 22:24:24 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: frosch * r16408 /trunk/src/newgrf.cpp: -Codechange: Silence a pointless newgrf debug message. 22:24:43 <Xaroth> SILENCE! :o 22:25:13 *** theholyduck [~duckzorz@38.80-202-138.nextgentel.com] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:25:47 *** Frostregen [~sucks@dslb-084-058-113-203.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: und weg] 22:30:26 *** duckzor_ [~duckzorz@38.80-202-138.nextgentel.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:30:57 <fjb> Pssssssst! 22:34:22 *** Rexxars [~rexxars@62.73.249.23] has quit [Quit: edgepro: A man who smiles when things go wrong knows who to blame.] 22:40:26 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: rubidium * r16409 /trunk/src/console_gui.cpp: -Change: don't add empty lines/duplicates of the previous command to the console's history 22:55:06 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590ff3bb.pool.einsundeins.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:55:37 *** duckzor [~duckzorz@38.80-202-138.nextgentel.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:32:40 *** KenjiE20|LT [~Kenji@host86-171-52-211.range86-171.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 23:33:03 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B7630A.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [] 23:33:22 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B772E8.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 23:36:02 *** KenjiE20 [~KenjiE20@92.23.82.231] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:39:26 *** Lachie [whitey@creep.bur.st] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:47:27 *** ctibor_ [~ctibor@77.48.228.43] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:48:12 *** Lachie [whitey@creep.bur.st] has joined #openttd 23:57:37 *** Exl [~myself@cp1224652-a.roemd1.lb.home.nl] has quit [Quit: Bitches.] 23:57:46 *** racetrack [~racetrack@c114-76-16-69.eburwd4.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd