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00:04:17 <Eddi|zuHause> George: triggers in callbacks are always ignored, only triggers in the graphics chain are processed 00:04:42 <Eddi|zuHause> when you specify the trigger callback, only the trigger callback is processed and the graphics callback is ignored as well 00:10:20 <George> needs clarification... if I have graphics in CC and the randomisation is done in colour_mapping, and a triger is service, it would never happen? 00:12:15 <NGC3982> hm 00:12:24 <NGC3982> I want to create a server game where time stands still 00:12:30 <NGC3982> It's always 1899 or something. 00:12:35 <NGC3982> I guess that is not possible. 00:17:54 <Eddi|zuHause> George: correct, the trigger in colour_mapping never happens, you need to add another random action in the graphics chain which only does the trigger 00:22:26 *** kais58 [~kais58@cpc8-cwma7-2-0-cust113.7-3.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:31:20 <NGC3982> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=43777&start=0 00:31:28 <NGC3982> I note Eddi's addition to the thread. 00:31:39 <NGC3982> I guess i can forget stopping time in a multiplayer game as it is. 00:32:52 *** retro|cz [~retro@ip-89-176-82-80.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 00:32:56 *** Zuu [~Zuu@gateway.sdr.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:47:05 *** KritiK [~Maxim@0001264a.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:48:31 *** FLHerne [~FLHerne@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:49:09 *** FLHerne [~FLHerne@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 01:06:25 *** roadt__ [~roadt@223.240.108.176] has joined #openttd 01:07:35 *** gelignite_ [~gelignite@i528C3680.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 01:14:45 *** gelignite [~gelignite@i528C3292.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:14:45 *** montalvo [~montalvo@ip68-108-148-173.lv.lv.cox.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:29:19 *** Progman [~progman@p57A180AD.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote 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09:58:13 *** DDR [~kvirc@154.20.134.39] has joined #openttd 10:00:44 <George> morning 10:00:57 <George> Could someone have a look at https://bugs.openttd.org/task/5848 10:02:07 <George> I can't understand what am I doing wrong, but I can't make parts of ARV to operate correctly with visual_effect_and_powered 10:03:27 *** Progman [~progman@p57A19A09.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 10:08:39 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 10:17:55 *** adf88 [~Thunderbi@wis-zul.spine.pl] has joined #openttd 10:30:20 *** FrenkyPohodar [~oftc-webi@ip-213-220-221-52.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 10:34:05 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 10:37:01 *** gelignite [~gelignite@i528C3680.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 10:38:34 <FrenkyPohodar> I wish you a nice day. I have a problem I do not know how to dispose of the company (dedikate server) One player that annoyed me. I outsourced the Rcon 1234 reset_company but how do I find the client_id (Company 5) thanks very much for your advice. 10:43:11 <Alberth> never played with the console, but http://wiki.openttd.org/Console_Commands suggests "clients" 10:52:35 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-5f741ceb.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 10:57:38 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:00:26 <FrenkyPohodar> So I found it much thanks. Field is rcon 1234 "reset_company 5" wanted to quote. 11:00:39 *** FrenkyPohodar [~oftc-webi@ip-213-220-221-52.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 11:01:31 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 11:08:00 *** FLHerne [~FLHerne@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 11:16:55 *** adf88 [~Thunderbi@wis-zul.spine.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:18:40 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@5070A0D5.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has joined #openttd 11:33:59 *** adf88 [~Thunderbi@wis-zul.spine.pl] has joined #openttd 11:37:02 *** oskari89 [oskari89@62-241-226-106.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 11:37:47 *** frosch [~frosch@frnk-4d01e416.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 11:39:52 * NGC3982 still wants to stop time and is stubborn as a moo-moo. 11:43:16 <FLHerne> NGC3982: You could stop the server, cheat back, and reload every year :P 11:43:25 <FLHerne> That might be kinda ugly 11:43:29 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-5f741ceb.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:53:11 *** tyteen4a03 [~T4@94.191.185.121.mobile.3.dk] has joined #openttd 11:54:10 *** Haube [~michi@77-20-40-44-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #openttd 11:57:18 <Alberth> play the year 4999999 ? 12:05:07 *** retro|cz [~retro@ip-89-176-82-80.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:10:33 <NGC3982> That defeats the purpose a bit. It would be preferable if i could simply play forever on <year> 12:10:38 <NGC3982> In multiplayer, that is 12:10:47 <NGC3982> Although, i know it's not possible with the current platform 12:10:59 <NGC3982> And frankly too much work to be cranky about. (-; 12:12:09 <Alberth> but it does, the year gets reset back to 4999999 12:12:36 <Alberth> although maybe you need to play in 5000000 instead, not sure when exactly the year wrap is done 12:14:08 *** retro|cz [~retro@ip-89-176-82-80.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 12:14:47 *** Elukka [~Elukka@a91-152-213-89.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 12:20:30 *** Midnightmyth [~quassel@93-167-84-102-static.dk.customer.tdc.net] has joined #openttd 12:24:38 *** Aristide [~quassel@tok69-5-82-235-150-75.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 12:25:50 *** JGR [~JGR@host86-182-38-225.range86-182.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 12:26:44 *** JGR_ [~JGR@host81-156-54-133.range81-156.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:28:06 *** gaghiel [~user@adsl-83.37.6.72.tellas.gr] has joined #openttd 12:28:16 <gaghiel> hello 12:28:34 <gaghiel> version: 1.3.3 with FIRS here. 12:29:13 <gaghiel> question: same station services a coal mine and iron ore mine. both accepts eng. supplies. I bring eng. supplies. which industry picks it up first ? 12:29:25 <Alberth> only one of them 12:29:29 *** Pereba_ [~UserNick@186.212.235.108] has joined #openttd 12:29:56 <Alberth> the other industry will not get any 12:30:06 <planetmaker> the industry closest to the station sign 12:30:07 <gaghiel> random? 12:30:21 <gaghiel> ah ok. 12:30:31 <gaghiel> damn :/ 12:30:53 *** Japa__ [~Japa@117.201.104.36] has joined #openttd 12:31:17 <planetmaker> transfer supplies and transport with vehicles to road stations adjacent to the industries 12:31:35 *** skyem123 [~skyem123@cpc1-walt4-0-0-cust432.13-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 12:31:59 <gaghiel> yeap 12:35:29 *** Pereba [~UserNick@179.186.29.139.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:35:30 *** Pereba_ is now known as Pereba 12:36:06 *** Japa_ [~Japa@117.201.104.36] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 12:41:50 *** Pereba_ [~UserNick@179.177.167.127.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has joined #openttd 12:46:20 *** Pereba [~UserNick@186.212.235.108] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:46:20 *** Pereba_ is now known as Pereba 12:46:24 *** DDR [~kvirc@154.20.134.39] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:48:15 <George> planetmaker: could you help me with FS#5848 12:51:22 *** FLHerne [~FLHerne@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 12:51:42 *** FLHerne [~FLHerne@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 12:54:43 *** KritiK [~Maxim@0001264a.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 13:10:10 *** yorick [~yorick@ip51cd0513.speed.planet.nl] has joined #openttd 13:19:12 *** Pol [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 13:23:11 *** retro|cz [~retro@ip-89-176-82-80.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:25:29 *** Pensacola [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:26:09 <Aristide> Yeah 13:26:34 <Aristide> Since Subway Extension, go to KFC is faster _o/ 13:37:00 *** SpComb^_ [terom@zapotek.paivola.fi] has joined #openttd 13:39:00 *** SpComb [terom@zapotek.paivola.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:45:16 *** kais58 [~kais58@cpc8-cwma7-2-0-cust113.7-3.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 13:52:52 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:56:01 *** Pol [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:12:59 *** Pensacola [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 14:17:34 <Flygon> Aristide: They extend the metro line to my area. Then they shut it down for HST works. Yay! :D 14:17:56 <Aristide> xD 14:17:59 <Aristide> HST ? 14:20:45 <Flygon> Sort of. 14:20:47 <Flygon> Basically 14:21:26 <Flygon> They're seperating the Diesel HST's from the Metro EMU's in inner Melbourne, and this requires railway line shutdowns to do so 14:21:38 <Flygon> But the thing is... this was done concurrently with the Sunbury electrification. 14:22:01 <Aristide> xD 14:22:02 <Flygon> So the electrification was completed while the inner urban area's getting random line shutdowns 14:22:13 <Flygon> Oh. Also, for more awkwardness with this. 14:22:32 <Flygon> The Sunbury line's only seperating HST's from Southern Cross (Melbourne) to around Albion... 14:22:54 <Flygon> So there's still going to be the VLocity DMU's catching up to Comengs on the HST section between Sunbury and Watergardens 14:23:04 <Flygon> Simply because the Comeng/Siemens EMUs aren't allowed to go over 115m/h 14:23:07 <Flygon> 115km/h* 14:23:09 <Flygon> Oops. 14:23:11 <Aristide> TCL work at night 14:23:25 <Flygon> The work's being done at both day and night 14:23:34 <Aristide> :') 14:23:51 <Flygon> The issue is that they're having to rebuild entire train stations, and build new bridges and... it's a complex mess 14:24:00 <Flygon> But basically. Bus replacements are necessary. 14:24:53 <Flygon> Just a shame the Comengs aren't being allowed to 130km/h (not that they have a very nice time reaching 115km/h going up the steep grades). And the Siemens were designed for 140-150km/h operation (line speed is officially 160km/h between Watergardens and Sunbury) 14:25:12 <Flygon> But neither'll likely be allowed over 115 due to strict crash standards. 14:25:31 <Aristide> A yeah :o 14:25:32 <Flygon> In Europe, the Siemens would probably be allowed to do 200km/h with a different gear ratio >_> 14:26:05 <Flygon> The stupid thing is 14:26:37 <Flygon> Is part of the reason the VLocity HSTs are having congestion issues in non-HST areas (under the Metro area), is.... because they're out-accelerating the EMU's 14:26:54 <Flygon> Only in Australia could Diesels accelerate faster than Electrics 14:27:16 <Aristide> Subway reaching 80 km/h here 14:27:56 <Flygon> (basically, the drivers push the DMUs to accelerate as fast as possible in urban areas to not lose train paths, or else Metro'll screw them over. But the Metro drivers don't have such requirements... note that a lot of lines lack byass tracks in stations) 14:28:23 <Flygon> I was actually surprised to learn that a lot of the world's Metropolitean trains don't break 80km/h 14:28:58 <Flygon> But, then again, your station spacing is much closer than Melbourne's, and you probably have a lower gear ratio for that acceleratory kick 14:29:20 <Flygon> Then again, our Trams practically fill the role of an inner urban subway anyway... 14:30:32 <Flygon> ...then again. They've also been driven to 110km/h in testing, so *waves his arms around like he's just given up understanding everything* 14:30:46 <Aristide> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OJ1pbpC46xU 14:30:50 *** FLHerne [~FLHerne@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:30:55 <Aristide> Flygon: Do you have a photo (or video) of your subway ? 14:32:41 <Flygon> Well... sort of subway 14:32:50 <Flygon> Except for the city loop, it's largely overground 14:33:20 <Aristide> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBBGOexcoZ4 From out 14:33:55 <Aristide> (All subway are underground here) 14:34:09 <Xaroth|Work> isn't that the entire idea of 'sub' way ? 14:34:22 <Flygon> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2cfU5pLGgk Oh my god... someone actually got a video recording on a Hitachi 14:34:39 <Flygon> I'm not sure how many other cities have had EMUs running underground with openable windows 14:34:41 <Flygon> But we have :P 14:36:02 <Aristide> EMUs ? 14:36:06 <Flygon> Electrics 14:36:16 <Aristide> Subways has not windows here 14:36:25 <Flygon> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-P1yMYHqaJQ But, this's one on an EMU type that's not likely to be retired for another 20 years 14:37:07 <Flygon> It's hard to imagine a train without windows 14:38:15 <Aristide> Trolleybus are good solution too 14:38:36 <Flygon> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hegGSV6o9Wc Would a Trolleybus have 64k RAM? :P 14:39:09 <Aristide> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMq0Md9Cy3Q :3 14:39:26 <Aristide> xD 14:39:27 <Flygon> Trolleybuses don't exist here 14:40:44 <Aristide> When Information system fail : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IF3gOpjFrHM 14:41:37 <Flygon> Diagnostic mode? Or just no input? 14:41:58 <Aristide> I don't know 14:42:02 <Flygon> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZwiA5rqRgX0 Plenty of Trams here (they tend to run on-street, tho) 14:42:04 <Aristide> But a « point » walking on screen xD 14:42:26 <Aristide> Its maybe a lost of internet connection in bus 14:42:51 <Flygon> Your buses need internet connection? 14:42:56 <Flygon> Such a thing would be impossible here 14:43:16 <Aristide> Flygon: I think, Information was sended in every bus if a problem is detected on NEtwork 14:43:26 <Aristide> INFO TCL appear and information displayed 14:43:35 <Flygon> Ahh 14:43:40 <Flygon> Everything is manually set by the driver here 14:43:49 <Aristide> Its automatic here 14:44:27 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 14:44:47 <Aristide> If bus is rerouted, its write on panel (INFO TCL : Line rerouted after <bus stop>) 14:45:08 <Aristide> And after this <bus stop>, INFO TCL : Deviation being 14:45:25 <Flygon> Here, it'd be CB radio+intercom 14:45:30 <Flygon> Except the intercom's usually broken 14:45:37 <Flygon> Also 14:45:41 <Flygon> The route only changes at terminuses 14:45:54 <Aristide> I receive SMS too 14:46:33 <Aristide> Ahaha on Tram T1 and T4 : « Security problem on « CollÚge Belcombe » xD 14:47:07 <Flygon> A security problem here is usually just a drunk guy on a train 14:47:12 <Aristide> xD 14:47:13 <Flygon> Then the entire line gets shut down for 3 hours 14:47:21 <Flygon> As in, Metro 14:47:29 <Flygon> V/Line and Yarra Trams handle this better 14:47:30 <Aristide> 12h50 to 13h35 14:51:19 *** George [~George@185.43.94.91] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:51:32 <Flygon> Aristide: How fast do your Trams normally go, anyway? 14:51:42 <Aristide> I don't know 14:51:45 <Kjetil_> 5 parsec 14:51:59 <Flygon> We have a few French Trams running about Melbourne, but they're restricted to specific routes because we have very tight curve radiuses >_< 14:52:03 <Aristide> 70km/h 14:52:17 <Aristide> (Wikipedia) 14:52:26 <Aristide> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lyon_tramway 14:52:46 <Flygon> Hmm 14:52:51 <Flygon> Alright, that'd explain a fair bit then 14:53:15 <Flygon> Because we still run a crapload of Z/B-classes on lines with 80-100km/h sections 14:54:04 *** GriffinOneTwo [~oftc-webi@adsl-68-123-204-94.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 14:54:39 <Flygon> Interesting to see a map including bus routes 14:54:57 <Flygon> Buses aren't really included on Melbourne's transport maps because nobody rides them 14:55:03 *** Twofish [~quassel@0001308f.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:55:09 <Aristide> Yes but this map is not up to date 14:55:26 <Flygon> Regardless, you have a nice network 14:55:34 <Aristide> Subway has already extended to Oullins Gare, and Tramway T1 to IUT Feyssine 14:55:51 <Aristide> But extend T1 to Debourg is in test phase 14:56:19 <Flygon> http://www.railmaps.com.au/melbourn.png 14:56:33 <Flygon> It's not exactly to scale though 14:56:58 <Flygon> There's enough distance between Deer Park and Melton, for example, to allow the VLocity DMUs to hit 200km/h (in testing. 160km/h in reality) 14:57:06 <Aristide> Southern Cross station :') 14:57:35 <Flygon> Flinders Street Station's more well known here... but, really 14:57:40 <Flygon> The two are like Brother and Sister 14:59:41 <Aristide> So, my Travel http://wstaw.org/m/2014/01/04/plasma-desktopNH1210.png \o/ 14:59:44 <Flygon> Aristide: The thing with Melbourne is, is due to how sprawling that map is 14:59:49 <Flygon> Er, the city is 14:59:58 <Flygon> Is that the map I showed doesn't actually show the whole commuter belt 15:00:03 <Aristide> Ok 15:00:32 *** oskari89 [oskari89@62-241-226-106.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 15:00:35 <Aristide> How many do you have subway in melbourne ? 15:00:40 <Aristide> (And Tramways) 15:00:44 <Flygon> How many? 15:00:49 <Aristide> yes 15:00:58 <Flygon> I'm not sure I understand how many of what 15:01:33 <Flygon> There's one subway/metro operator, Metro. One Tramway operator, Yarra Trams. V/Line runs the HST and long distance Diesel services (bar Stony Point line) 15:01:52 *** Japa [~Japa@117.201.101.41] has joined #openttd 15:02:06 <Aristide> How many subways line and / or tramways line for City transportation only 15:02:18 <Flygon> City Transportation only? 15:02:25 <Flygon> Do you mean the area that'd be considered Inner Melbourne? 15:02:28 <Aristide> Yes 15:02:53 <Flygon> That is a really really hard question to answer, hahaha 15:02:58 <Aristide> x) 15:02:59 <Flygon> Because, the CBD itself is a grid 15:03:13 <Aristide> CBD ? 15:03:37 <Flygon> And there's like... a crapload of track pairs criss-crossing it for the Tramways (that go out to the rest of the inner suburbs... and there's a LOT of independant routes. It's basically like a bus @_@) 15:03:57 <Flygon> The subway section, explicitly underground, goes in a 3/4 circle around the CBD 15:04:31 <Flygon> The section between Southern Cross and Flinders Street is an overhead railway. Inherited from the fact that it was built before electric trains even existed. 15:04:39 <Flygon> The city loop subway was only built in the late 1970s 15:05:25 <Aristide> ok 15:05:37 <Flygon> Outside of the CBD, the rest of the electric heavy rail network is overground, with a few lines having a LOT of grade seperations. The older ones are seperated by becoming overhead railways (or: VR got a lot of dirt, and piles it high, then place railway tracks on it) 15:05:49 <Flygon> This all makes sense when you realize most of the suburban network was built before 1890 15:06:06 <Flygon> And having smoke in tunnels from heavy locomotives going 80-100km/h isn't very nice, hahaha 15:07:11 <Flygon> Anyway, I can't give you a number of how many Tram routes there are, because there is too many, and the number fluctuates every year 15:07:47 <Flygon> There's currently 12 subway/metro heavy rail routes in inner Melbourne 15:08:00 <Flygon> And I say heavy rail exclusively to discount the two that're run by articulated Trams 15:08:04 *** Japa__ [~Japa@117.201.104.36] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:08:34 <Flygon> Pre-1960s, there was a lot more confusion in how many lines there are in Melbourne due to the Inner and Outer city circles 15:09:02 <Aristide> Ok 15:09:12 <Aristide> But listen « Two operators » in one city, its strange for me 15:09:59 *** Twofish [~IRC@46.228.54.111] has joined #openttd 15:10:05 <Flygon> Which do you mean? 15:10:12 <Flygon> Metro and Yarra Trams have 100% seperate networks 15:10:17 <Flygon> Oh! Right 15:10:19 <Flygon> Actually 15:10:21 <Flygon> I can explain this 15:10:35 <Flygon> V/Line and Metro used to be part of Victorian Railways before 1980 15:10:46 <Flygon> Then- gimmie a sec 15:10:50 <Flygon> Giving someone emotional support 15:11:48 <Flygon> Sorry about that 15:11:49 <Flygon> Anyway 15:11:55 <Aristide> Ok 15:11:58 <Aristide> xD 15:12:04 <Flygon> Yarra Tram's ancestor is the MMTB 15:12:20 <Flygon> Melbourne and Metropolitean Tramways Board 15:12:52 <Flygon> When VR was split into V/Line and the MTA/MTC/The Met (it's had a lot of names for the exact same company) 15:13:02 <Flygon> The MMTB was assimilated into the MTA/MTC/The Met 15:13:19 <Flygon> And a majority of buses were assimilated into the The Met livery 15:13:51 <Flygon> If you've ever been to Helsinki, you'll recognize the vehicle livery used across Trains, Trams, and Buses as a near copy of the one as the ones from the Helsinki Trams (the Green and Yellow one) 15:14:01 <Flygon> This livery was actually inherited from the MMTB's W-class Trams 15:14:20 <Flygon> http://www.melbourneplaces.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/six-w-class-trams-st-Kilda.jpg 15:14:37 <Aristide> Lol 15:14:51 <Flygon> V/Line operated 100% independantly as a Freight and Passenger operator for regional Victoria 15:15:08 <Flygon> Anyway 15:15:14 <Flygon> Let's skip ahead a bit 15:15:54 <Flygon> V/Line changed liveries from 80s orange http://www.precisionscalemodels.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/V-Line-B-Class-Diesel-Electric-Locomotive.jpg 15:16:14 <Flygon> To 90s Royal Blue http://www.johndarm.clara.net/Worldphots/melbourne.jpg 15:16:20 <Flygon> (which looks far nicer) 15:16:27 <Flygon> And the The Met kept everything the same 15:16:55 <Flygon> In the mid-late 90s, the Liberal Government elected (the Liberals here are the Conservatives. Try not to get confused :P) privatized the public transport services 15:17:04 <Aristide> xD 15:18:23 <Flygon> The Geelong/Warnambool line for V/Line was sold off to West Coast Railways. Known for operating a Steam hauled service from 1997ish to 2005 that was faster than their Diesel services (SERIOUSLY. The R-classes are a real determinator). The Seymour line was sold to some coach company that hired stuff from V/Line. V/Line itself was sold to National Express. 15:18:43 <Flygon> Any Brits here just shuddered upon the mention of those two words. 15:19:25 <Flygon> The V/Line Freight division was sold off to various freight companies (National Express, Australia National, uuuuh... QUBE, Pacific National, El Zorro) 15:20:22 <Flygon> West Coast Railways is, by railfans, practically reserecting regional Diesel thanks to offering actual customer service. Despite being forced to use 1950s Diesels and carriages (the R-class are also a 1950s design, and were designed to go over 110km/h for long distances, explaining their out-dieseling) 15:20:38 <Flygon> The coach company did a very "So Okay, It's Average" job (Flygon goes on TVTopes too much) 15:20:47 <Flygon> And National Express ran the rest of the system into the ground :| 15:20:54 <Aristide> :/ 15:20:59 <Flygon> Now, to get to the real meat of this 15:21:12 <Flygon> The Met was split into a lot of things 15:21:28 <Flygon> The bus companies got to use whatever liveries they wanted (they were always independant) 15:21:42 <Flygon> The Tramways was split into M>Tram and Yarra Trams 15:22:02 <Flygon> And the railways was split into Hillside Trains and Bayside Trains (iirc for the latter) 15:22:11 <Aristide> Ouch 15:22:18 <Flygon> Hillside was quickly renamed M>Train, and Bayside was quickly renamed Connex 15:22:37 <Aristide> Connex :') 15:22:46 <Flygon> The M> franchise quickly exhausted all it's money and sold off everything into the respective operators 15:23:06 <Aristide> I know a operator of bus named « Connex » owned by this fucking veolia 15:23:08 <Flygon> The M> company itself was actually really nice (nobody outright hated it, anyway), so it was sad to see it go 15:23:17 <Flygon> Connex and Veolia are the same company 15:23:26 <Aristide> Ok I don't like this company :x 15:23:29 <Flygon> Yarra Trams is generally regarded as a good operator 15:23:41 <Flygon> Connex is regarded as having been idiots. 15:24:14 <Flygon> They would cancel Comengs due to faulty aircons, and scrapped a lot of Hitachi (which outright lacked aircons, and were approaching 40 years old) 15:24:20 <Flygon> This upset a LOT of people 15:24:33 <Flygon> Oh! Just a bit of a side-story with rollingstock aquisition 15:24:51 <Aristide> :') 15:24:58 <Aristide> [04@16:23] <Flygon> Connex is regarded as having been idiots. â +100000 15:25:02 <Flygon> M>Tram and Yarra Trams aquired the C and D-class Trams. Citidas and... Flexity? I forgot about the latter. 15:25:12 <Flygon> But one was French, the other Italian 15:25:44 <Flygon> I mean no offense, but the Italian ones are regarded as having performed better (especially with air conditioning). Both types had issues with our sharp curves, though 15:25:50 *** adf88 [~Thunderbi@wis-zul.spine.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:26:24 <Flygon> M>Train aquired the X'trapolis trains that got manufactured here and Italy. The X'traps are regarded as terrible. I could rant all day, so let's halt that one here. 15:27:05 <Flygon> Connex aquired the Siemens (Nexas model). Which actually had a worse reputation than the X'traps initially, due to braking problems (especially with platform overshoots), and other minor issues 15:27:10 <Aristide> I don't like Connex. This company managed an old bus line 101 in Public/Private partnership with Department (RhÃŽne) ... And this busline take one breakdrone per week 15:28:10 <Flygon> And Siemens were refusing to fix stuff up, despite our (rather reasonable) reason that they gave us a faulty product 15:28:34 <Flygon> They're never going to get contracted out to give us anything rail related in Victoria for at least another 25 years. The fiasco was that bad. 15:29:02 <Flygon> The Siemens got fixed up by the local crew (out of Connexes and the Victorian Government's pockets), and are now considered to be the best EMU fleet Victoria has 15:29:08 <Flygon> Now, back to National Express 15:29:25 <Flygon> The Nat Express thing was SO bad, that they basically weren't allowed to renew their contract for V/Line 15:30:52 <Flygon> Everything defaulted back to the Government, who sold off the rest of the freight division (they were only interested in passenger), and ran the passenger service as an interum for the planned "Regional Fast Rail". See, they were in talks with NatExpress, West Coast Railways, and that coach provider (gotta love how Okay and Average they were!) about getting the lines upgraded for, at the time, 145km/h DMUs that could couple with the S 15:30:52 <Flygon> printers 15:31:31 <Flygon> Scope creep ended up with the plan going so long, that West Coast Railways went bankrupt, and the coach provider just shurgged, decided they just wanted to run buses, and gave the license back to the Government 15:32:14 <Flygon> Thus explaining how V/Line became Government owned once more (half the reason WCR went bankrupt is because of the Geelong line being shut down for RFR/'HST' upgrades. Which removed their main source of income) 15:33:35 <Flygon> By 2005-2006, we're running the VLocity at 160km/h (after testing it at speeds from 180km/h to 220-230km/h for... well, the hell of it. The 220km/h tests had vibrations so bad from the Diesel engines that parts of the vehicle fell off. Just asthetic attachements for prettiness sakes, but... wow. The hydralic transmission is rated for only 200km/h) 15:33:42 <Flygon> That wraps up V/Line 15:33:52 <Flygon> Now. Connex... Connex, Connex, Connex. 15:33:59 <Flygon> My dear god. CONNEX. 15:33:59 <Aristide> xD 15:34:04 <Aristide> CONNEX FUCK ! 15:34:14 <Flygon> Wait? I'm allowed to say fuck? 15:34:15 <Flygon> Good 15:34:17 <Flygon> Fuck Connex. 15:34:22 *** skyem123_ [~skyem123@cpc1-walt4-0-0-cust432.13-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 15:34:27 <Aristide> :o 15:34:31 <Aristide> stop 15:34:35 <Flygon> Alright x3 15:34:36 <Flygon> Anyway 15:34:36 <Aristide> You can catch viruses :3 15:35:20 <Flygon> The Connex fiasco was so bad here, that when their contract lapsed, and the Government put out tender for a new operator (typically the old operator picks up the reigns), Connex were practically blocked from getting it 15:36:13 <Flygon> The resulting consortium was a combination of the Victorian Government, a Hong Kong railway operator (which managed to upset the drivers unions over a few things... Aussies do not work well under Asian style management), and... someone else 15:36:15 <Flygon> Lemme check my docs 15:36:43 <Flygon> "John Holland Group (20%) and UGL Rail (20%).", sourcing Wikipedia 15:37:00 <Flygon> The Hong Kong MTR Consortium has 60% stake, the Vic Govt has the rest 15:37:10 <Flygon> Dunno what John Holland Group even ARE 15:37:21 <Aristide> xD 15:37:33 <Flygon> Anyway, does that explain why Melbourne has a confusing set of operators? 15:37:39 <Aristide> Yes :') 15:37:43 <Flygon> Alright :3 15:38:25 <Flygon> (just a note, Metro're beginning to have a reputation as bad as Connex here, due to shenanigans. Their grace period has worn off) 15:39:20 <Flygon> (V/Line's well loved. But commuters are frustrated by capacity constraints on the Ballarat/Bacchus Marsh/Melton line due to it needing to use crossing loops. Yes, we have a largely single track HST line. Don't expect the TGV here! Hahaha! :D) 15:39:40 <Flygon> (And Yarra Trams is... just sort of there. Not being terrible) 15:40:01 *** George [~George@185.43.94.91] has joined #openttd 15:41:30 *** skyem123 [~skyem123@cpc1-walt4-0-0-cust432.13-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:41:54 <Flygon> For the pre-1980s history. Basically. Victorian Railways was formed in 1859ish by the (at the time, sort-of national Government. We were a colony) Government to assimilate a railway company building what was considered a vital line, to just finish the damned thing. The resulting company, Victorian Railways, was essentially run as a private company from 1860 to 1970ish (self-sustaining). It assimilated multiple railway companies betwee 15:41:55 <Flygon> n 1860 to 1890 due to them all going bankrupt and having useful lines/assets 15:42:32 <Flygon> The Tramways used to be a lot of seperated Tramway and Cable Car companies, which were all assimilated by the MMTB for the exact same reasons as VR 15:46:35 <Aristide> :/ 15:47:15 <Aristide> Here, TCL Network is owned by SYTRAL, and the operator is Keolis Lyon (for 5 or 7 years I don't remember) 15:47:35 <Flygon> VR basically couldn't churn a profit between 1970-1980 due to a combo of car use, and management that lacked the guts to cut stations from routes for timetable reasons 15:47:43 <Aristide> Public/Private partnership 15:48:24 *** johnrambo [~jrambo@93-86-92-138.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has joined #openttd 15:48:24 <Flygon> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Deal_(railway) This was the end result of the VR disaster (it's a shame VR went so badly. In the 1970s, they designed some of Australia's best locomotives, alongside NSWGR) 15:48:41 <Flygon> Yeah, Private/Public is huge here 15:49:03 <Flygon> Even V/Line is technically Private/Public. In that the Government is a 100% shareholder, but lets management do whatever. 15:49:11 <Aristide> But Sytral is again owner of this network 15:49:25 <Flygon> Oh, owning the rail network.... oh my god 15:49:38 <Flygon> Do not get me into explaining what a s***storm that is in Victoria xD 15:49:39 <Aristide> And Keolis Lyon must respect contract 15:49:43 <gaghiel> version 1.3.3 with FIRS: suddenly a transfer station in the middle of nowhere starts accepting food/goods/petrol. it just transfers grain from a feeder system. 15:50:25 <gaghiel> anyidea how to check this ? 15:50:59 <Flygon> The MMTB had the same issue as VR. They had issues churning a profit, and couldn't actually raise fares (100% Government owned, like current V/Line). Raising fares was one of the few things management couldn't do. But they lacked any other real way to raise profits. The Trams were already decked out with adverts. 15:51:17 *** roadt__ [~roadt@223.240.108.176] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:51:30 <Flygon> The only real positive thing about 1970s Melbourne was that everyone loved Astro Boy 15:52:35 *** roadt__ [~roadt@223.240.108.176] has joined #openttd 15:52:50 <Flygon> Then he became even more popular in the 80s thanks to the 80s series :P 15:54:28 <Aristide> =) 15:55:00 *** jrambo [~jrambo@93-86-92-138.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:55:08 <Flygon> How popular is Astro Boy in France? 15:55:47 <Flygon> x3 France is really weird to me, I must admit 15:55:51 <Flygon> Completely different world 15:56:05 <Aristide> I don't know 15:56:08 <Flygon> You guys? You see a country with Kangaroo and go "OhmygodKANGAROOOOO" 15:56:14 <Flygon> I look at France 15:56:21 *** George [~George@185.43.94.91] has quit [] 15:56:23 <Aristide> xD 15:56:24 <Flygon> And think "OhmygodIWONTHITAKANGAROOWHENDRIVING" 15:57:34 <Flygon> ...craaaap 15:57:42 <Flygon> I got the 1980s Astro Boy theme stuck in my head now 15:57:50 <Aristide> Ok Free mobile has only 700 4G antennas >< 15:57:51 <Aristide> Fuck 15:57:55 <Flygon> "Da-da dah da duh-daaah" 15:58:13 <Flygon> Only 700? 15:58:18 <Flygon> Sounds better than Optus :P 15:58:26 <Aristide> Flygon: Yes but operator deply 4G network 15:58:32 <Aristide> Since End of December 15:58:36 <Flygon> Oh! Wow 15:58:43 <Flygon> 700 antanna since December? O_o 15:59:05 <Aristide> Yes 3G antennas already installed has already 4G Ready \o/ 15:59:08 <Flygon> x3 15:59:15 <Flygon> Here, there's issues with... hard to explain 15:59:20 <Aristide> Oh ok 15:59:22 <Flygon> Basically, Telstra has a gigantic 4G network 15:59:25 <Aristide> « qui a la meilleure 4G » is outdated 15:59:31 <Flygon> Then there's Optus, where it's patchy between 3/4G 15:59:38 <Flygon> And Vodaphone. Vodaphone are like Connex 15:59:39 <Aristide> A other website (independant) say 1445 15:59:39 <Flygon> Hahaha 16:00:09 <Flygon> Even if I had 4G, it'd be useless for me 16:00:16 <Flygon> Best plan I'd be able to get is 25GB/mo 16:00:22 <Aristide> Flygon: Me too, but 20GB of data per month is cool 16:00:25 <Flygon> Screw 150/150mbits internet if I can only get 25GB/mo 16:00:38 <Flygon> I'd rather just get ADSL2+ in my house 16:00:52 <Flygon> I'm lucky to get 19/1mbits. Most ADSL houses here get just 1.5-9mbits :( 16:01:13 <Aristide> :3 16:01:14 <Flygon> Cable is rare, and Fibre is... ... hard to explain. I won't bother explaining Fibre. 16:01:43 <Aristide> Ok in November, 168 Antennas has installed by Free Mobile :( 16:01:55 <Aristide> BUt I don't know if its 3 or 4G LTE 16:01:56 <Flygon> http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum/142 The change of Government's possibly ruined 93% of the nation getting 1000/400 capable Fibre by 2025 :( 16:04:30 <Flygon> Hmmm 16:04:35 <Flygon> Rolling out 3G by now would be dumb 16:04:40 <Flygon> Hopefully, it's 4G 16:05:02 <Aristide> Yes, but I thinks, Antenna installed can emmit in many frequencys (Both 3G and 4G) 16:05:05 <Aristide> But i'm not sure 16:05:44 <gaghiel> guys, when the the "auto-refit" button in the train orders is enabled? 16:07:08 <gaghiel> cant seem to find anything in the wiki ? 16:07:34 <juzza1> the vehicle/wagon must allow it 16:08:26 <gaghiel> so it's just an API thing? 16:09:31 <gaghiel> let me rephrase that, so the train grf must support it explicitly 16:11:24 <Flygon> Yes 16:14:20 <frosch> there are only like 2 sets, which support it 16:14:46 <frosch> some version of ogfx+trains (though no idea which), and maybe heqs and fish 16:15:20 <frosch> though i do no consider it useful for rv and ships, which leave some version of ogfx+trains :p 16:16:09 <frosch> try ogfx+trains 0.3.0 16:16:24 <Flygon> The UKRS (or a version of it) supports it 16:16:30 <Flygon> At least, I think 16:16:41 <Flygon> It's been over a year since I did a UKRS related game 16:16:58 <frosch> has there been a version of ukrs in 2012 or 2013? 16:17:53 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 16:18:17 *** Pol [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 16:18:47 <gaghiel> thanks! ogfx+trains indeed support it. 2cc does not 16:19:02 <gaghiel> however i'm taking a peek at the repo 16:19:19 <frosch> ogfx+trains repo is very different from 0.3.0 16:20:24 <frosch> it tried to head towards 32bpp graphics, which look very different to the previous 8bpp ones, which more or less resulted in derailing the whole set due to disagreement 16:21:03 <Flygon> I'm guessing the El Paso solution didn't come along? 16:21:26 <frosch> basically you can consider ogfx+train 0.3.0 and nightly separate train sets :) 16:21:48 <gaghiel> ooo. i see. 16:23:40 <andythenorth> disagreement :P 16:23:50 <andythenorth> BDFL is needed 16:24:12 *** Pensacola [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:24:52 <frosch> nah, i guess whoever picks it up, may branch it into two different projects 16:25:18 <frosch> both the 8bpp and 32bpp graphics are fine, but they do not fit under one "brand" 16:26:30 <Eddi|zuHause> so "opengfx+" and "z+"? 16:28:09 <frosch> i thought "z" stands for zephyris :p 16:28:41 <gaghiel> hg clone https://hg.openttdcoop.org/2cctrainset returns 502 bad gateway. 16:29:18 <frosch> immediately or after a minute or so? 16:29:35 <gaghiel> immediately. 16:29:52 <Eddi|zuHause> how would i know... 16:30:15 <frosch> yeah, rhodecode crashed or so 16:30:19 <frosch> planetmaker: ^^ 16:30:23 <frosch> ^Spike^: ^^ 16:31:24 *** Japa [~Japa@117.201.101.41] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:33:47 *** Japa [~Japa@117.201.101.41] has joined #openttd 16:34:01 <gaghiel> frosch: the actual tcpdump contains a 301 moved permanently response. hg reports is as 502 bad gw though 16:35:31 <frosch> https://rhodecode.openttdcoop.org/ <- yeah, it redirs to that one, but it is 502 as well :p 16:38:00 <andythenorth> so is the original terrain generator better than terragenesis? 16:38:32 <frosch> depends on the settings :p 16:38:44 <andythenorth> I used it by accident 16:38:52 <frosch> usually tgp is better, but you with the right/wrong settings it can be worse than original 16:38:59 <andythenorth> original seems to make better temperate and tropic terrain 16:39:07 <andythenorth> pretty shocking in arctic 16:39:12 <andythenorth> they're both shocking in arctic 16:40:13 <Eddi|zuHause> the original generator gets very repetitive 16:40:31 <frosch> the original generator also depends on the baseset 16:47:29 *** johnrambo [~jrambo@93-86-92-138.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:49:56 *** tyteen4a03 [~T4@94.191.185.121.mobile.3.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:50:45 *** tyteen4a03 [~T4@94.191.185.121.mobile.3.dk] has joined #openttd 16:52:50 *** jrambo [~jrambo@93-86-92-138.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has joined #openttd 17:01:03 <andythenorth> what does it depend on in baseset? 17:01:44 <frosch> the baseset contains small heightmaps as sprites, the original mapgen somehow composes them to a map 17:02:24 <frosch> so, most likely you get better results with the original baseset, since noone cared in ogfx age :) 17:02:29 <frosch> (and rightfully so) 17:05:44 <andythenorth> oic :) 17:15:35 <Flygon> Is it planning ahead too far if you're building Maglev lines for the 2CC set in 1985? 17:16:12 *** Japa [~Japa@117.201.101.41] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:16:34 <Eddi|zuHause> early development versions of transrapid? 17:17:51 <Flygon> I'm using one of those sidings lines as a placeholder 17:18:05 <Flygon> So clearly the Transrapid prototypes ran on 35km/h iron rail track 17:18:25 <Flygon> I'm 20 years early... at least I get to reserve the corridore :p 17:18:32 <Eddi|zuHause> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Vg2h_nW0bA <-- famous transrapid speach of then-bavarian-ministerpresident edmund stoiber :) 17:18:40 <Flygon> Though, having the early Transrapids in 2CC would be neat 17:19:06 * Flygon el listeno 17:19:39 <Flygon> Is the point the speech or the Gimmick? 17:19:43 <Flygon> Because I can't speak German x3 17:19:59 <andythenorth> right, what can we fix? 17:20:07 <andythenorth> maybe I could learn how a patch queue works again :P 17:20:23 <Eddi|zuHause> the point is that the speech is famous for the speaker struggling a lot to find the words that he meant 17:20:41 <Eddi|zuHause> so that guy made a "drum solo" out of this 17:20:51 <Flygon> O_o 17:21:17 <Flygon> Nobody ever accused the Europeans of being sane :D 17:22:07 <Eddi|zuHause> the topic of the speech was a planned transrapid line from munich main station (city center) to munich airport (far outskirts) 17:22:08 *** Aristide [~quassel@tok69-5-82-235-150-75.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:22:25 <Eddi|zuHause> which would have a travel time of 10 minutes 17:22:25 <andythenorth> frosch: so how do I apply the newsmoke patches? 17:22:32 <andythenorth> I have curl :P 17:22:52 <Eddi|zuHause> the project came into scrutiny for being too expensive 17:23:08 <Eddi|zuHause> (it was later cancelled completely) 17:23:32 <Flygon> Shame 17:23:37 <Flygon> They lodged the same thing here 17:23:41 <Eddi|zuHause> the speech was supposed to point out all the advantages the line would have 17:23:44 <Flygon> A radial railway line around Port Phillip bay 17:24:35 <Flygon> From Geelong, to Tarniet, to Whydnam Vale, to Sunshine, to the Airport, to... Thomastown I think it was? And then basically follow the Ring Road Freeway Corridore to Frankston 17:24:57 <Flygon> A 500km/h Maglev circle around Melbourne basically. Costed at bil 17:25:29 *** lobstar is now known as lobster 17:25:41 <Flygon> The idea was scrapped and the Regional Rail Link plan was implemented (same price) to desperate Diesel HST traffic from EMU Metro traffic, while also building a line for Tarniet and Vale 17:26:08 <Flygon> The only reason I can think that the Transrapid plan failed is because it didn't go through the CBD =/ 17:26:09 <Flygon> Shame 17:26:16 <Flygon> Because we desperately need an airport link 17:26:27 <Flygon> And it'd have really helped connecting the Eastern suburbs to the airport 17:26:31 <Flygon> I hope Transrapid try again 17:26:38 <Flygon> When the Regional Rail Link is complete 17:26:44 <Flygon> The idea will actually work very very well 17:26:59 <frosch> andythenorth: curl first diff | patch -p 1 17:27:04 <frosch> andythenorth: curl second diff | patch -p 1 17:27:12 <Eddi|zuHause> i think transrapid is fairly dead by now 17:27:14 <Flygon> Because it'll be very easy to run a HST service to Sunshine express from Southern Cross, to connect with a Transrapid airport train 17:27:29 <Eddi|zuHause> the test track was closed down after a serious accident 17:27:44 <Eddi|zuHause> and all projects within germany failed 17:28:06 <andythenorth> frosch: I guess the test grf is declared failure? o_O 17:28:14 <Flygon> (it wouldn't be going 160-200km/h, only 80-100km/h to Sunshine, but still, no stops. They achieve much nicer speeds past Sunshine, due to lack of signal confusion possibility) 17:28:24 <Flygon> Eddi: Shame... 17:28:32 <Flygon> And the Japanese solution would likely shape up to be very expensive 17:29:13 <Flygon> And building the same sort of system with Iron Rail is impossible 17:29:18 <frosch> andythenorth: i wrote some lines in the logs 17:29:26 <Eddi|zuHause> there was some western USA project (las vegas), which i have no information on whether it was actually picked up 17:29:36 <frosch> andythenorth: http://webster.openttdcoop.org/index.php?channel=openttdcoop.devzone&date=1388620800#1388699384 17:29:46 <Flygon> Half the appeal is the fast acceleration to 400-500km/h (or hell, even 100km/h) getting out of stations as fast as possible, to get good service frequency 17:29:47 <Eddi|zuHause> and the shanghai line, which is operational but a planned expansion was scrapped as well 17:29:54 <Flygon> And actually allow trans-outer suburb commuting 17:30:00 <Flygon> The USA thing was scrapped 17:30:17 <Flygon> The plan is an LA/SF to Las Vegas HST 17:30:26 <Flygon> But it's a bit of a s***storm 17:30:30 <andythenorth> thanks 17:30:43 <Flygon> Considering they can't even get LA and SF linked by a HST 17:31:09 <Flygon> Honestly, at this rate, they're better off just creating Diesel-Hydralic DMU's like the VLocity, but with tilt functionality 17:31:20 <Flygon> Er, except the line's probably electrified... 17:31:43 <Flygon> so, get Electric-Hydralic EMU's. Much faster acceleration, and the 200km/h speed cap isn't an issue anyway, given the line probably won't allow much higher... 17:31:58 *** oskari89 [oskari89@62-241-226-106.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 17:32:35 <Flygon> It's a shame Hydralic transmissions for over 220km/h aren't a practicality. The acceleration benefits for that sort of transmission are marvelous 17:34:02 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't think anything in california is electrified 17:34:45 <frosch> i believe the light is 17:34:51 <Eddi|zuHause> only afaik, only eastern USA has significant electrified lines 17:34:52 <andythenorth> frosch: visual effect property should be 0x41 or so? 17:35:00 <frosch> andythenorth: yes 17:35:11 <andythenorth> I wonder what nml has done there 17:35:16 <andythenorth> bit odd 17:35:46 <andythenorth> cb160 returns 1 = correct ? 17:35:51 <Flygon> Hmm 17:36:03 <Flygon> I'm genuinely surprised LA-SF isn't some sort of electric 17:36:22 <Flygon> Isn't there some sort of at-least-hourly rail service existing that also services communities between those two cities? 17:36:47 <Eddi|zuHause> i really don't know. 17:37:09 <Eddi|zuHause> but the USA are known to be very diesel-centric 17:37:14 <Flygon> Arf, sorry x3 17:37:18 <Flygon> Yeah, so is here 17:37:34 <Flygon> Only region with long distance electrics is Queensland 17:37:54 <Flygon> And two lines in Sydney that act as commuter services to Sydney, so... not sure if I count them as long distance 17:39:36 <frosch> oi, var 61 fails hard in debug gui :s 17:40:21 <Eddi|zuHause> i found debug gui for trains very useless 17:40:33 <Flygon> Though, with Diesel-Hydralic transmissions, a lot of advantages of electric (bar running costs for ultra-high frequency services... my god. V/Line only knows the pain of consuming absurd amounts of fuel when running services every 10-20 minutes on some lines with those HSTs) are lost 17:40:51 <andythenorth> debug gui is essential for industries, bit 'meh' for vehicles I've found 17:41:11 <andythenorth> meanwhile, I always try to visualise nml switches as varaction2, but I'm not smart enough 17:41:24 <andythenorth> and I can't seem to learn the proper nml syntax either 17:41:34 <andythenorth> so is this valid (no range checks)? 17:41:41 <andythenorth> http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/2970/ 17:41:50 <andythenorth> nlmc compiles it ok 17:42:13 <frosch> 0x100, not 100 17:42:34 <frosch> also, maybe return two values, makes it more fance 17:42:52 <frosch> s/values/smoke plums/ 17:45:42 <andythenorth> having one work would be good :P :) 17:45:46 <andythenorth> still failing :P 17:47:39 <andythenorth> frosch: I'm putting 0xFA in the registers, but shouldn't it be 32 bits? 17:48:15 <frosch> well, it's at position 0,0,0 relative to the vehicle 17:48:23 <andythenorth> ok 17:48:25 <frosch> if you supply more steam, you may want to vary the positions :p 17:49:06 <andythenorth> I don't know what nml does with the bits if I only supply a byte :P 17:49:18 <andythenorth> I was never good at this, and it's been a while :) 17:49:27 <andythenorth> something's wrong here anyway :) 17:51:45 *** narushevich [~oftc-webi@87.110.11.88] has joined #openttd 17:52:03 <andythenorth> might be my nml patch, might be my grf 17:55:25 <andythenorth> do I have to go read uncommented nfo :o 17:59:11 <Rubidium> andythenorth: nah, just open it in your favourite coding tool. Then select the whole contents of the file and do (usually edit->) comment. Then you got commented nfo ;) 17:59:20 <andythenorth> he he 18:00:11 *** Midnightmyth [~quassel@93-167-84-102-static.dk.customer.tdc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:01:24 <NGC3982> Alberth: Ill try it out. 18:04:52 <andythenorth> nmlc puts out pretty readable nfo 18:06:55 <andythenorth> this looks ok to me 18:06:56 <andythenorth> http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/2971/ 18:07:06 <andythenorth> the varaction2 looks ok, and var 1C looks correct 18:07:08 <andythenorth> afaict 18:12:34 * andythenorth misses nfo :) 18:13:02 *** Midnightmyth [~quassel@93-167-84-102-static.dk.customer.tdc.net] has joined #openttd 18:15:12 <Alberth> perhaps look a bit more at your paste? 18:16:25 <frosch> andythenorth: is there some callback? 18:16:34 <frosch> visual_effect also exists as callback 18:16:40 <andythenorth> I'll try that 18:16:43 <andythenorth> biab 18:18:04 *** Japa [~Japa@112.79.36.47] has joined #openttd 18:20:22 <andythenorth> frosch: look again at my paste order :D 18:20:43 <andythenorth> I'm returning 0xF2020202 18:20:53 <andythenorth> I had forgotten about endian-ness 18:21:22 <frosch> :p 18:21:37 <andythenorth> ha ha 18:21:44 <andythenorth> these effects are offset by about 2 tiles :P 18:21:46 <andythenorth> excessive 18:24:46 *** Japa_ [~Japa@112.79.36.47] has joined #openttd 18:24:50 <andythenorth> bath time 18:25:01 <andythenorth> this grf is definitely doing something now 18:25:09 <andythenorth> might not be correct yet :) 18:29:27 *** Japa [~Japa@112.79.36.47] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:34:15 *** gaghiel` [~user@adsl-50.109.242.65.tellas.gr] has joined #openttd 18:39:36 *** gaghiel [~user@adsl-83.37.6.72.tellas.gr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:39:55 <Wolf01> bbl 18:40:01 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 18:41:05 <andythenorth> frosch: 2 smoke plumes :D 18:41:15 <andythenorth> I won't screenie until I've got a nice example 18:41:24 <andythenorth> this one is....ugly 18:41:30 <frosch> can you test the rotation and such? 18:42:09 <andythenorth> you mean the custom effects? 18:42:30 <frosch> the relative position of the effect to the vehicle rotates with the vehicle orientation 18:43:37 <andythenorth> so on a large offset from 0,0,z it should look correct? 18:43:39 <andythenorth> I'll test 18:45:12 <andythenorth> I _think_ it's correct 18:45:33 <frosch> both longitudinal and cross offsets? 18:45:44 *** DarkAceZ [~BillyMays@50-32-46-251.drr01.hrbg.pa.frontiernet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:46:34 <andythenorth> still testing 18:46:38 <andythenorth> 8 angles :) 18:46:44 <andythenorth> slow ship :P 18:46:56 <frosch> not as easily routable like a train :) 18:47:00 <andythenorth> no 18:47:06 <andythenorth> ships go where they want :( 18:47:08 <andythenorth> even with bouys 18:48:10 <andythenorth> meh, don't test with ships where the offsets are questionable :P 18:48:31 <frosch> enable the bounding boxes? 18:49:16 * andythenorth counting on fingers for signed bytes :P 18:49:23 *** adf88 [~Thunderbi@wis-zul.spine.pl] has joined #openttd 18:49:29 <andythenorth> bbox is on :) 18:49:34 <andythenorth> that's how I know the offsets are borked 18:50:31 <andythenorth> rotation _appears_ correct 18:55:14 *** Super_Random [~kvirc@75-102-176-79.d2.itctel.com] has joined #openttd 19:04:25 *** Pol [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:05:58 *** DarkAceZ [~BillyMays@50-32-15-237.drr01.hrbg.pa.frontiernet.net] has joined #openttd 19:18:30 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:26:51 *** supermop [~daniel_er@cpe-74-71-50-7.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 19:27:34 <supermop> hi 19:27:52 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 19:28:17 <andythenorth> frosch: http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/6705 19:28:20 <andythenorth> https://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/6704 19:28:40 <supermop> hey andy, 19:28:51 <supermop> do you use any means to sketch stuff out 19:28:52 <andythenorth> I've got a branch started for the FISH stuff, I'll push commits in there until the toolchain is properly fixed 19:29:05 <andythenorth> supermop: pencil? 19:29:10 <andythenorth> graph paper 19:29:13 <supermop> or just go straight for the sprites 19:29:21 <supermop> i want to try to start drawing again 19:29:22 <supermop> but 19:30:09 <supermop> i find drawing pixel artis so detailed right from the start that its hard to make quick passes to get an idea for things 19:30:54 <supermop> rather than very rough ideas for a vareity of houses, i spend hours getting partly through one sprite, then bored and frustrated 19:31:28 <supermop> i dont know if i would like modelling buildings withought rendering them any better 19:32:23 *** jjavaholic_ is now known as jjavaholic 19:32:38 <supermop> and i get unenthused about 'wasting effort' drawing in a scale or style that i might want to abandon in a few sprites 19:32:53 <supermop> on a related note - 19:33:23 <supermop> has anyone made themed base sets? like a japan set base set? or .se base set? 19:34:00 <frosch> themed base sets make little sense 19:34:01 <Rubidium> is "night" a theme? 19:34:11 <frosch> you would rather make a newgrf 19:34:25 <supermop> i wonder if it would be easier to get started on a town set if one instead approached it first as a base set, with no new features, and instead aimed to produce a 1:1 equivalent of each default house 19:34:28 <frosch> "themed" means you want to use it for a specific game, so it should also be part of the savegame 19:34:52 <supermop> and then after that is complete, expand from there to create a fuller stand alone new grf 19:35:01 <supermop> i guess i mean, 19:35:22 <supermop> i am assuming swedish houses are gpl 19:35:26 <supermop> dont remember, 19:35:29 <frosch> anyway, newgrf are easier to make than basesets 19:35:52 <frosch> with basesets you have to deal with all the weird default offsets and such, with newgrf you can just set useful ones 19:36:55 <supermop> lets say i just compile a base set that uses an appropriate sprite from the swedish houses for each of the default houses, and the swedish rails sprites for the default rails, etc 19:37:09 <supermop> hmm 19:38:00 <supermop> but that way if we so desired, we could play a multiplayer game where i play with swedish things, and you play with japanese things, even though they are functionally identical 19:38:30 <supermop> just one of many silly ideas i've had lately 19:39:35 <supermop> if i play a tropical game but load japan landscape, its the same as if i play a temperate game with jpn land loaded right? 19:40:05 <supermop> there is no effect on terrain or trees? just default industries and vehicles? 19:40:13 <supermop> sorry to be spamming the thread here 19:40:14 <frosch> except for town growth, vehicles, industries, ... 19:40:16 <NGC3982> Alberth: It works out great. I'm starting a server right now. 19:40:23 <supermop> ooh ok 19:40:24 <frosch> mapgen hilliness 19:40:56 <supermop> so one could abuse the desert/rainforest elements in some way? 19:41:20 <supermop> or can a landscape newgrf introduce it's own similar effects? 19:43:02 <supermop> for example, i could provide green grass tiles for desert, but rain forest trees would still not grow there, so i could simulate different highland and lowland ecologies 19:44:52 <juzza1> all the different climates have their own landscape sprites, a landscape newgrf only replaces one or several of them. i'd assume japanese landscape only replaces temperate sprites, so it would have no effect in other climates 19:46:12 *** roadt__ [~roadt@223.240.108.176] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:46:30 <DorpsGek> Commit by rubidium :: r26225 trunk/src/cpu.cpp (2014-01-04 19:46:24 UTC) 19:46:31 <DorpsGek> -Document: more tidbits about cpuid and PIC (Eagle_Rainbow) 19:47:26 <tyteen4a03> how do I see a list of airports? can't find the Stations button on the UI 19:48:31 <juzza1> supermop: sure you could do that, but then you wouldn't have desert. there is no "spec" for landscape, only the possibility to replace sprites 19:48:51 <andythenorth> frosch: so what's next? Test the custom stuff? 19:48:55 <andythenorth> or extend nml properly? 19:50:48 <frosch> i haven't coded the custom stuff 19:50:55 <frosch> i have some ideas for nml 19:50:57 <frosch> like constant names 19:51:08 <frosch> and some buildin function for the register value 19:53:56 <frosch> tyteen4a03: it's the rightmost button of the second to leftmost group 19:53:58 <frosch> or so 19:54:02 <frosch> next to townlist and such 19:54:19 <tyteen4a03> frosch, thanks 19:54:34 *** glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 19:54:37 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 19:55:20 <frosch> andythenorth: anyway, is it any good? 19:55:27 <frosch> does it solve the requirements? 19:56:17 <andythenorth> perfectly so far :) 19:56:26 * NGC3982 puts stuff in __ln__ 20:05:37 <Rubidium> is anyone using 32 bits OpenTTD on a 64 bits computer because that's faster? 20:10:45 *** retro|cz [~retro@ip-89-176-82-80.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 20:11:34 *** Progman [~progman@p57A19A09.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:18:42 <andythenorth> Rubidium: not intentionally, how could I check? 20:19:05 <andythenorth> iirc OS X had some thing about running apps in 32 bit, but that might be old 20:31:41 <andythenorth> frosch: FISH sprites have wrong proportions in / and \ views :D 20:31:42 <andythenorth> oops 20:31:49 <andythenorth> so funnels are in wrong place :P 20:32:05 <andythenorth> I could probably handle that in the cb if I could be bothered 20:35:54 <andythenorth> maybe the interface should be: I draw pink pixels in the sprite, the game generates effect vehicles there :P 20:35:57 <andythenorth> way easier :D 20:45:47 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 20:47:13 *** narushevich [~oftc-webi@87.110.11.88] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 20:56:26 *** Alberth [~hat@2001:980:272e:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has left #openttd [] 21:02:22 *** JGR_ [~JGR@host86-184-169-87.range86-184.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 21:04:17 *** JGR [~JGR@host86-182-38-225.range86-182.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:09:36 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host58-55-dynamic.182-80-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 21:18:12 *** Djohaal [~Djohaal@177.16.170.233] has joined #openttd 21:26:37 *** glx is now known as Guest2501 21:26:37 *** glx_ [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 21:26:37 *** glx_ is now known as glx 21:26:40 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 21:32:38 *** Guest2501 [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:38:42 *** retro|cz [~retro@ip-89-176-82-80.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:55:36 *** DanMacK [~453f374e@188.cimarosa.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 21:55:43 <DanMacK> Hello all 21:55:49 <DanMacK> @seen andythenorth 21:55:49 <DorpsGek> DanMacK: andythenorth was last seen in #openttd 1 hour, 19 minutes, and 51 seconds ago: <andythenorth> way easier :D 21:55:55 <DanMacK> troz 21:59:54 *** skyem123_ [~skyem123@cpc1-walt4-0-0-cust432.13-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:11:34 *** DanMacK [~453f374e@188.cimarosa.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 22:13:28 *** Aristide [~quassel@tok69-5-82-235-150-75.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 22:36:41 *** adf88 [~Thunderbi@wis-zul.spine.pl] has quit [Quit: adf88] 22:48:48 <Xaroth|Work> LordAro: http://i.imgur.com/DdcjXIH.jpg 22:49:58 *** oskari89 [oskari89@62-241-226-106.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 22:50:04 *** HannezR [~hr@221.85.190.90.dyn.estpak.ee] has joined #openttd 22:50:12 *** HannezR [~hr@221.85.190.90.dyn.estpak.ee] has left #openttd [] 22:53:25 *** Super_Random [~kvirc@75-102-176-79.d2.itctel.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:57:26 *** HannezR [~hr@221.85.190.90.dyn.estpak.ee] has joined #openttd 22:58:07 *** HannezR [~hr@221.85.190.90.dyn.estpak.ee] has quit [] 23:03:11 *** Lord_Aro [~LordAro@sns61-104.york.ac.uk] has joined #openttd 23:06:13 <Wolf01> 'night 23:06:19 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 23:10:27 *** Lord_Aro [~LordAro@sns61-104.york.ac.uk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:11:22 <LordAro> Xaroth|Work: :D 23:17:08 *** SpComb^_ is now known as SpComb 23:24:50 *** Djohaal [~Djohaal@177.16.170.233] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:40:53 <Xaroth|Work> LordAro: thought you'd appreciate it 23:41:05 <LordAro> very nice :) 23:45:15 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@5070A0D5.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:48:41 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:54:38 *** Djohaal [~Djohaal@177.16.170.233] has joined #openttd