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Log for #openttd on 17th May 2020:
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00:22:52  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] giordy opened issue #8153: Sometimes vehicles don't get replaced https://git.io/Jf0oB
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05:58:36  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro approved pull request #8151: Fix: Desync after house replacement https://git.io/Jf0M3
06:11:34  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/nml] LordAro commented on pull request #143: Add: Script to format the changelog for TT-Forums https://git.io/Jf0Mu
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06:33:53  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] andythenorth commented on issue #8153: Sometimes vehicles don't get replaced https://git.io/Jf0oB
06:40:12  <andythenorth> moin
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07:03:56  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] giordy commented on issue #8153: Sometimes vehicles don't get replaced https://git.io/Jf0oB
07:09:22  <LordAro> could be cache related?
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07:52:15  <andythenorth> it's usually failure to route to depot in my experience
07:52:21  <andythenorth> but I didn't open the save
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08:06:27  * _dp_ wonders how many servers have more that 1 person playing on avg
08:06:35  <_dp_> guess about 10
08:09:34  <Eddi|zuHause> "average" over what timeframe?
08:12:24  <_dp_> in general
08:12:38  <_dp_> or at least over the server uptime
08:12:53  <_dp_> but then you'll need to avg the number of servers
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08:19:40  <Eddi|zuHause> i'm not sure that's a useful figure
08:20:05  <Eddi|zuHause> people might keep their server running and only playing a few hours per day
08:26:04  <andythenorth> no frosch
08:26:05  <andythenorth> hmm
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10:30:48  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on issue #8153: Sometimes vehicles don't get replaced https://git.io/Jf0oB
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11:52:58  <_dp_> what's the easiest way to get a proper crash log out of dmp?
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12:03:52  <Eddi|zuHause> on windows? load the .dmp file in visual studio (bonus points if you have the .pdb file of the binary)
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12:06:42  <Samu> translators are working hard lately
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12:12:44  <Borg> I need m0ar comments on BSPI...
12:13:07  <Borg> new feature for banks... 5000 valueables limits In Town.. but 50% of exceed valueables goes back to production..
12:18:22  <nielsm> thought for banks, make their production also depend on the level of economic activity in the town as measured by active industries and pax moved
12:20:08  <Borg> how?
12:20:24  <Borg> for now.. they production is based on population level
12:20:35  <Borg> it would be neat to chain in into for example goods delivery to city + population
12:21:08  <nielsm> hm I guess all the industries would have to set a flag on the town of some sort, probably in production change cb
12:21:28  <Borg> ahh this way... yeah.. kidna complicated..
12:21:43  <Borg> maybe for BSPI v3.00 ;)
12:24:38  <andythenorth> hmm
12:24:50  <andythenorth> maybe I have to do a house grf
12:24:57  <andythenorth> to control town for FIRS
12:25:06  <andythenorth> maybe I can just have FIRS patch towns
12:26:33  <Borg> w/ fertlity for organic.... now there is plenty of things to watch over....
12:26:46  <Borg> seems I will leave banks as they works now...
12:27:00  <andythenorth> Borg how do you control town growth in BSPI?
12:27:01  <Borg> also nice for mixed coop games where they are PAX players vs IND ones..
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12:27:14  <Borg> andythenorth: I dont... I just have GS to limit it...
12:27:21  <Borg> you need to grow it by default openttd way
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12:27:31  <Borg> with I dont like to do.. because im not PAX player at all
12:27:33  <andythenorth> do you have any cargo like building materials?
12:27:34  <andythenorth> or goods?
12:27:56  <Borg> BSPI is stock Industries and cargos.. nothing fancy was added.. except Industry logic
12:28:04  <andythenorth> ok
12:28:48  <Borg> afaik.. you cant control town growth at all from GRF... you need GS for it..
12:29:12  <Borg> I saw some neat GS scripts in City Growth servers... but they arent open source I think
12:30:48  <andythenorth> you can control town growth from house set somewhat
12:31:09  * andythenorth still puzzled by how flawed FIRS design is
12:31:16  <andythenorth> not today's problem though
12:31:33  <andythenorth> frosch123 remember this? :) https://devs.openttd.org/~frosch/texts/industrymap_green_darkgreen_violet.html
12:32:51  <Borg> andythenorth: oh... Ill leave it then :)
12:33:49  <milek7> and it starts by using almost identical colors on first two rows? :P
12:34:18  <milek7> ah no, it's red/green
12:35:11  <Yexo> ... there is no green anywhere near the top of that list
12:35:44  <frosch123> andythenorth: i didn't until now :)
12:35:59  <andythenorth> I reused the same list for cargo colours
12:36:00  <milek7> hm
12:36:02  <andythenorth> mostly works
12:36:09  * milek7 might be slightly coloblind
12:36:16  <andythenorth> I just need to remove grey, and a yellow that is used in the cargo flow UI
12:36:37  <Borg> cargo flow have terrible colors imo
12:36:42  <Borg> I patched my OpenTTD for betters one
12:36:50  <andythenorth> milek7 those first two colours are red and brown, and are a classic combination that will trip colour blindness
12:37:02  <andythenorth> they're really similar contrast and saturation
12:48:28  <_dp_> Eddi|zuHause, I don't have windows, that's the problem...
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12:49:41  <_dp_> and all the good cb scripts are os afaik
12:50:05  <_dp_> citymania cb isn't but it's not using a script either
12:53:43  <Borg> okey.. im pleased... w/ new BSPI v2.00 and all bits set... its really hard to maintain superb production at hubs...
12:55:10  <glx> oh nice, I can't generate ob[gms] files
12:55:29  <glx> (probably because beta utf-8 support is enabled)
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13:16:30  <andythenorth> cargo abbreviations are translated?
13:17:07  <glx> default cargo are
13:18:50  <andythenorth> that means I can't automate
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14:45:34  <milek7> _dp_:
14:45:39  <milek7> https://github.com/google/breakpad/blob/master/src/processor/minidump_stackwalk.cc
14:46:37  <milek7> and for using pdb https://github.com/luser/dump_syms
14:47:23  <glx> I just open the dmp in visual studio
14:48:14  <milek7> (minidump_stackwalk comes usually in whole breakpad package)
14:48:24  <milek7> tough to install visual studio on linux
14:51:57  <_dp_> milek7, is there just a .deb somewhere? that looks like a pain to compile
14:52:42  <glx> tried your package manager ?
14:53:24  <_dp_> glx, ofc, but didn't find
14:54:58  <milek7> it's fairly standard to build, just need to install depot_tools first
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14:57:53  <supermop_Home> yo
15:01:18  <milek7> (hm, breakpad contains also its own dump_syms. but I remember I had some problem with it)
15:05:07  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/nml] FLHerne opened pull request #145: Tidying grfstrings.handle_string a bit. https://git.io/Jf0hp
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15:15:09  <_dp_> milek7, how do I give it pdb for symbols?
15:15:49  <milek7> afair you first pass it through dump_syms, then you create overcomplicated directory structure
15:16:25  <milek7> something with pdb hash, place .sym in valid place and then minidump_stackwalk uses this overcomplicated mess to open single file :D
15:17:34  <milek7> symbols/foo.pdb/F10D19E2C18C485F8C51CBB8FD2B470F1/foo.sym
15:17:50  <milek7> then: minidump_stackwalk dump.dmp symbols
15:17:58  <milek7> that hash is in first line of .sym file
15:20:49  <_dp_> milek7, hm, and what's sym? I only have .pdb file
15:21:28  <milek7> you need to use that dump_syms tool to generate .sym from .pdb
15:22:20  <milek7> breakpad has its own but I remember I had problem with it, so try also others (luser or mozilla one linked there)
15:25:10  <_dp_> milek7, oh, yeah, I missed that
15:25:23  <_dp_> yet another cryptic tool with a weird make system...
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15:41:18  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 updated pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code) https://git.io/fhbqc
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15:52:25  <nielsm> so when's cmake getting merged? :)
15:53:24  <glx> I'm not the decision-maker here :)
15:55:04  <nielsm> there's three checkboxes missing
15:56:24  <nielsm> I don't know if they're considered important, but at least when I tried it all a while back it worked well enough on windows
15:58:16  <_dp_> great, now with linear town production ppl are ignoring pax and going mail only for a starting moneyline xD
15:58:41  <nielsm> mail is also affected by that setting tho
15:58:50  <glx> yeah but these checkboxes can be fixed later
15:59:16  <_dp_> nielsm, yes, with linear there is more mail so it's now possible to ignore pax
15:59:44  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code) https://git.io/JfEeE
16:06:30  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 opened pull request #8154: Fix: properly support utf-8 in baseset translation vbscript https://git.io/JfEeM
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16:12:21  <andythenorth> wonder if I can automate price factors
16:12:53  <andythenorth> probably not
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16:29:59  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 commented on pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code) https://git.io/JfEvl
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16:52:51  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 updated pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code) https://git.io/fhbqc
16:55:12  <supermop_Home_> i guess i should try to start fixing grfs
17:01:15  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 updated pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code) https://git.io/fhbqc
17:02:27  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 commented on issue #8153: Autoreplace does not report failures due to refittability https://git.io/Jf0oB
17:03:58  <FLHerne> supermop_Home_: What grfs are broken?
17:06:18  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 commented on pull request #8134: Fix #8132: Corrupted savegame crashing OpenTTD on load https://git.io/JfEfj
17:08:21  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on pull request #8134: Fix #8132: Corrupted savegame crashing OpenTTD on load https://git.io/JfEJL
17:08:33  <glx> haha a useless comment from james
17:09:51  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc approved pull request #8154: Fix: properly support utf-8 in baseset translation vbscript https://git.io/JfEJm
17:11:56  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 merged pull request #8154: Fix: properly support utf-8 in baseset translation vbscript https://git.io/JfEeM
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17:13:12  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on issue #8153: Autoreplace does not report failures due to refittability https://git.io/Jf0oB
17:14:05  <andythenorth> FLHerne most of them are broken? :)
17:14:12  * andythenorth useless comment time of day :)
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17:45:45  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] DorpsGek pushed 1 commits to master https://git.io/JfEUy
17:45:45  <DorpsGek_III>   - Update: Translations from eints (by translators)
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18:22:49  <andythenorth> nielsm you know refit orders have an associated newgrf cb?
18:22:57  <andythenorth> [before I add a useless comment]
18:23:52  <nielsm> nope
18:25:11  <andythenorth> https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/Callbacks#Refit_cost_factor_.2815E.29
18:25:20  <andythenorth> it doesn't prevent running a check and mess afaict
18:25:33  <andythenorth> just means that the result can always never be predicted in advance :P
18:25:46  <Wolf01> https://www.flickr.com/photos/141605483@N08 andythenorth: nice locos there
18:25:52  <andythenorth> mess / message /s
18:26:09  <andythenorth> so many bone parts Wolf01
18:26:44  <andythenorth> has V453000 been making Lego renders? https://www.flickr.com/photos/141605483@N08/43687454001/
18:26:48  <andythenorth> that just is a NUTS train
18:27:24  <Wolf01> The brass one and the gothic one are really nice, not a fan of the boney one
18:28:19  <andythenorth> this is good https://www.flickr.com/photos/141605483@N08/32466865968/
18:28:24  <andythenorth> and this https://www.flickr.com/photos/141605483@N08/43908619961/
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19:39:41  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 commented on pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code) https://git.io/JfEIN
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20:01:12  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Andrew350 opened issue #8155: Roadtype speed limit values are doubled in scenario editor drop-down menu https://git.io/JfELR
20:03:35  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 commented on issue #8155: Roadtype speed limit values are doubled in scenario editor drop-down menu https://git.io/JfELR
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20:18:08  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 commented on pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code) https://git.io/JfEL7
20:18:37  <glx> james can be annoying :)
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20:21:11  <FLHerne> I think I was like that
20:21:21  <FLHerne> (maybe I still am :p)
20:22:03  <FLHerne> Can someone look at nml #144 ? It would be nice to do 0.5.2 soonish
20:28:30  <andythenorth> I have read it but the diff is too big for me to review :P
20:28:52  <andythenorth> [meaning it's beyond what I'm competent at]
20:31:19  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/nml] Yexo approved pull request #144: Fix #139: Make --cache-dir work, and avoid creating dirs with --no-cache https://git.io/JfEtf
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20:34:59  <FLHerne> Yexo: Thanks :-)
20:35:56  <FLHerne> Yexo: Also not ideal is the except-anything-whatsoever catch block :-/
20:36:14  <FLHerne> But I felt rewriting all that was out of scope
20:36:31  <Yexo> It's absolutely out of scope of your change
20:36:45  <Yexo> There are probably more things that are not ideal
20:37:49  <FLHerne> Any idea why some elements of `sources` can be None?
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20:38:12  <FLHerne> I questioned it, looked at the stuff defining it, and lost interest
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20:38:27  <FLHerne> Well, decided to just accept it and move on
20:38:32  <Yexo> No idea, I'd have to hunt down the code to figure that out
20:38:50  <FLHerne> Ok, don't bother, I'll try and find out sometime
20:38:59  <FLHerne> Speaking of 'not ideal', I found this earlier https://www.flherne.uk/files/madness889.png
20:39:10  <FLHerne> I mean...WHAT?!
20:39:40  <Yexo> That whole block of code is just magic
20:39:44  <FLHerne> I guess the underlying specifications are a bit weird
20:40:10  <FLHerne> You don't say
20:40:35  <Yexo> I'm pretty sure this is the underlying specification: https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/blob/master/src/strings.cpp#L504
20:41:25  <Yexo> Hmm, looks like NML's version is openttd's code +1
20:41:37  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/nml] FLHerne merged pull request #144: Fix #139: Make --cache-dir work, and avoid creating dirs with --no-cache https://git.io/Jf0Em
20:41:38  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/nml] FLHerne closed issue #139: Running regression tests litters examples with empty .nmlcache directories https://git.io/Jflcq
20:44:54  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Yexo commented on issue #8155: Roadtype speed limit values are doubled in scenario editor drop-down menu https://git.io/JfELR
20:47:19  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 commented on issue #8155: Roadtype speed limit values are doubled in scenario editor drop-down menu https://git.io/JfELR
20:49:13  <Yexo> Meh, I was trying to fix this via the web ui, but all I managed to do was create a pull request against my own fork. That's not helpful
20:50:45  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Yexo opened pull request #8156: Fix #8155: Roadtype speed limit in toolbar dropdown in scenario edito… https://git.io/JfEty
20:53:07  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/nml] FLHerne opened pull request #146: Doc: Changelog for 0.5.2 https://git.io/JfEt7
20:53:19  <FLHerne> glx: ^ wording ok?
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20:55:53  <glx> seems good
20:56:23  <andythenorth> +1
20:56:33  <FLHerne> Yexo: Pet peeve: the first line of github commit messages can only be so long
20:56:37  <FLHerne> *git
20:56:59  <FLHerne> github's UI completely fails at that, and linebreaks it in the middle of a word, which makes no sense
20:58:30  <Yexo> argh
20:58:35  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/nml] andythenorth approved pull request #146: Doc: Changelog for 0.5.2 https://git.io/JfEtx
20:58:35  <Yexo> Is that a limit in git?
20:58:57  <FLHerne> Yexo: Yes
20:59:25  <nielsm> git as such doesn't put limits on commit messages, but convention is to stay below 72 characters on first line
20:59:26  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/nml] FLHerne merged pull request #146: Doc: Changelog for 0.5.2 https://git.io/JfEt7
20:59:28  <nielsm> iirc
20:59:34  <nielsm> possibly even less
20:59:34  <LordAro> i think it's guidance, rather than a hard limit or anything
21:00:06  <nielsm> since "git log --oneline" should ideally not have linebreaks on 80 character terminals
21:00:22  <Yexo> I see
21:00:37  <Yexo> Is there a way to change the commit message via the web ui?
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21:02:10  <nielsm> afaik not
21:03:46  <Yexo> Meh. That's for another day then (feel free to copy that fix and apply it)
21:04:19  <nielsm> well when you merge a PR you can squash and change the commit message for the resulting single commit
21:05:06  <Yexo> Squash a single-commit PR? Doesn't make a lot of sense to me, but if it works, fine :)
21:05:12  <glx> you can edit the message squash yes
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21:43:24  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] JGRennison opened pull request #8157: Fix: Incorrect save/load array size of Town::cargo_accepted https://git.io/JfEmO
21:44:37  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] JGRennison updated pull request #8157: Fix: Incorrect save/load array size of Town::cargo_accepted https://git.io/JfEmO
21:46:25  <andythenorth> FLHerne did you use the script :)
21:46:53  <FLHerne> andythenorth: Yes, but then I fiddled with the message manually anyway
21:47:00  <andythenorth> thanks
21:47:01  <FLHerne> So eh
21:48:15  * andythenorth sleep time 
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21:54:29  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on pull request #8157: Fix: Incorrect save/load array size of Town::cargo_accepted https://git.io/JfEm1
21:56:05  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh approved pull request #8156: Fix #8155: Roadtype speed limit in toolbar dropdown in scenario editor was doubled. https://git.io/JfEmS
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22:00:03  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] ldpl commented on pull request #8157: Fix: Incorrect save/load array size of Town::cargo_accepted https://git.io/JfEmp
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22:38:35  <_dp_> measured some random games, 25-100% of monthly lag is that cargo stuff calculation for subsidies
22:40:36  <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 commented on pull request #8157: Fix: Incorrect save/load array size of Town::cargo_accepted https://git.io/JfEOW
22:46:27  <FLHerne> _dp_: Is it not used by GS?
22:46:43  <FLHerne> More people use those than subsidies
22:46:50  <_dp_> FLHerne, doesn't look like it
22:47:03  <FLHerne> Huh
22:48:11  <_dp_> newgrfs are a bit involved but it would be very weird for them to rely on some callback that's called randomly
22:49:47  <_dp_> and even removing that stuff will stop it from being called randomly... just less often
22:50:08  <_dp_> can a newgrf callback change game btw?
22:50:53  <_dp_> *game state
22:51:28  <_dp_> *will not stop
22:51:30  <_dp_> bed time xD
22:52:18  <FLHerne> Yes
22:54:15  <_dp_> yes for game state? if so this callback is straight up desync material as it's called in gui
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22:56:31  <kamnet> I have rejoined the Matrix.
23:25:24  <FLHerne> kamnet: But we're on IRC :p
23:25:37  <FLHerne> Anyway, hi
23:25:44  <FLHerne> But now I'm going to sleep
23:26:56  <supermop_Home_> hi kamnet
23:35:03  <kamnet> Goodnight FLHerne. And hello Supermop. :)
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