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Log for #openttdcoop.devzone on 3rd May 2010:
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07:18:54  <planetmaker> @calc 1/3.2
07:18:54  <Webster> planetmaker: 0.3125
07:34:02  <andythenorth> hi hi
07:39:53  <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: NFO Meta Language - Revision 136: Feature: Allow Feature 02, action0 (ships) <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/nml/repository/revisions/136>
08:11:07  <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: NFO Meta Language - Revision 137: Fix: Typos 14 != 0x14 and 3.2 != 3.6 <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/nml/repository/revisions/137>
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09:46:07  <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 790: -Fix: Correct some strings. <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/790> || FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 789: Change: added spurious code to prevent certain spur... <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/789> || FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 788: Feature: additional layouts for Bakery <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/788>
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11:51:52  <planetmaker> a yorick! :-O
11:53:47  <yorick> oh noes
11:53:50  <yorick> a yorick! :-O
11:54:04  * yorick hides behind planetmaker
11:55:22  <planetmaker> there is no hiding behind me ;-)
11:57:09  <planetmaker> how're you doing? :-) Long time no see
11:57:58  <yorick> I've been doing pretty much the same
11:58:07  <yorick> except openttd wasn't really working
11:58:21  <yorick> but now it is and I'm playing the first time in 5 months :)
12:03:30  <planetmaker> :-)
12:03:44  <planetmaker> good to hear :-)
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14:46:50  <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: NFO Meta Language - Patch #920 (New): don't consider all files language files <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/920>
15:03:20  <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: NFO Meta Language - Patch #920 (Feedback): don't consider all files language files <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/920#change-2499" target="_blank">http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/920#change-2499> || NFO Meta Language - Patch #920 (Feedback): don't consider all files language files <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/920>
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16:18:31  <Brot6> firs: update from r787 to r790 done (1 errors) - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/nightlies/
16:19:24  <Brot6> opengfx: update from r452 to r453 done (0 errors) - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/opengfx/nightlies/
16:19:24  <Brot6> worldairlineset: no commit since last failed compile, compile skipped (r637)
16:19:24  <Brot6> Following repos didn't need a update: 2cctrainset (r516), 32bpp-extra (r31), airportsplus (r48), bros (r10), comic-houses (r69), fish (r360), heqs (r318), nmts (r15), nutracks (r59), openmsx (r49), opensfx (r88), snowlinemod (r10)
16:25:55  <planetmaker> Ammler, ^ last nightly compile log helped to get this one error-free :-) (OpenGFX)
16:26:00  <planetmaker> So yes, I do use it :-)
16:26:33  <planetmaker> Actually these announcements here help me use it / remember it
16:26:41  <planetmaker> much appreciated :-)
16:34:39  <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #921 (Confirmed): testing non-existing variable? <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/921>
16:48:46  <Ammler> he, nice to hear
16:48:59  <Ammler> still not sure, how I should implement nml
16:53:19  <planetmaker> Ammler: an NML project uses the same Makefile...
16:53:30  <planetmaker> so from a makefile POV nothing should change
16:53:49  <planetmaker> the only thing which needs doing is to make NML available in the usual search path like renum and grfcodec
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17:35:00  <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 792: Merge <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/792> || FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 791: Fix: missing two letter abbreviation for Bauxite <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/791>
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18:22:09  <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 793: Feature: additional layour for Cement Plant <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/793>
19:38:54  <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 794: Feature: additional layout for Cement Plant <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/794>
19:44:37  <Terkhen> andythenorth, planetmaker: http://devs.openttd.org/~terkhen/patches/index.php?folder=firs/ <-- this avoids duplicating nfo code among different translations in FIRS; nfo_lang.pnfo and remove_defines.pnfo are shared by all translations: the translation files only need to define the same strings than 7F_any.pnfo
19:45:24  <Terkhen> it is a bit hacky and you need to change a lot of files to alter or add strings, though
19:46:07  <andythenorth> I contemplated something a bit like this before, but thought it might be fragile :)
19:46:45  <andythenorth> I don't want to tackle translations (I have enough to do already!)....so I will be very happy if a solution is found.
19:47:03  <andythenorth> I don't mind hacky as long as it can be maintained and doesn't slow down development horribly :)
19:53:58  <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 795: Change: tweak to Cement Plant layout <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/795>
19:54:06  <Terkhen> well, old defines in translation files would be ignored, and I think I can change it so that it uses 7F defines if the language does not provide one
19:54:35  <Terkhen> but I reckon it will look even more ugly :)
19:55:09  <Terkhen> in that case, I think you can completely forget about outdated translations
19:59:12  <andythenorth> planetmaker: opinions?
20:07:13  <planetmaker> Uhm... can you provide that as a comprehensive patch, Terkhen ?
20:07:20  <Terkhen> sure
20:07:57  <planetmaker> actually... nvm :-)
20:08:02  <planetmaker> Just commit it. Looks fine :-)
20:08:29  <planetmaker> I'm surprised it needs no changes elsewhere...
20:08:59  <planetmaker> but that's good :-)
20:09:11  <Terkhen> do you think I should force 7F defines when the languages don't give one or it is fine as is?
20:09:36  <Terkhen> also, it ignores the DEBUG strings... I don't think it is useful to translate them
20:10:56  <planetmaker> well, but they're as now included everywhere, if I see that right?
20:11:08  <planetmaker> same text, but different languageID?
20:11:55  <planetmaker> It's a bit of a waste to define the same string n times for debuging ;-) But then it's not really important. Or one could add those strings in a separate debug strings file
20:12:15  <Terkhen> yes, I did not move them but if they finally don't get translated they should go elsewhere
20:12:17  <planetmaker> or more general untranslated.pnfo or alik
20:12:19  <planetmaker> *alike
20:13:03  <Terkhen> okay, I'll move them to untranslated.pnfo
20:13:38  <planetmaker>  //#undef TEXT_CRG_PARTS_CTYPE <-- what's these comments in remove_defines.pnfo?
20:13:49  <andythenorth> parts cargo was removed
20:14:08  <andythenorth> so I guess it's legacy stuff?
20:14:15  <Terkhen> I just copied the commented parts around while splitting the code... I don't know if they will get uncommented some day :)
20:14:42  <planetmaker> hm... at another place "parts" is marked as deprecated
20:14:46  <planetmaker> So it can go, I think
20:15:11  <Terkhen> if they are not going to come back I can just remove them from all files
20:15:21  <planetmaker> andythenorth: ^ ?
20:15:53  <andythenorth> parts is a dead cargo.  I left it around in some places so I know which IDs are free for text strings etc
20:16:03  <andythenorth> otherwise it's cruft, remove it
20:16:28  <planetmaker> ah... ok, then the indicator that something is free there, could (should?) stay around
20:19:39  <andythenorth> remove anything to do with parts that does not refer to an ID
20:19:48  <andythenorth> (such as a string ID)
20:21:17  <Terkhen> okay, I'll remove them from these files then
20:21:25  <Terkhen> which industries use the DEBUG thing?
20:22:13  <andythenorth> some of the secondary industries
20:22:17  <planetmaker> ids.pnfo could just use a comment on the 4 unused IDs by parts. Every other reference can go, I think
20:22:34  <andythenorth> DEBUG should only be used by someone like me, I can't see it being useful to others
20:23:36  <planetmaker> ids.pnfo is anyway where the stringIDs are defined.
20:23:56  <planetmaker> anyway: I think it's a magnificient step forward in grf translation, Terkhen :-)
20:24:41  <andythenorth> :)
20:24:45  <Terkhen> thanks :)
20:25:15  <Terkhen> I can't find any industry using DEBUG to test that I did not broke it after moving those strings to a different file...
20:26:52  <andythenorth> you have to enable DEBUG....try setting param 2 to 1
20:26:57  <andythenorth> 0 0 1
20:27:27  <Terkhen> that's strange, I remember seeing it without setting any parameters
20:27:47  <andythenorth> probably in an old nightly
20:28:09  <planetmaker> hm... interesting idea:
20:28:12  <Terkhen> okay, it works :)
20:28:24  <planetmaker> expose newgrf_developer_tools to grf authors via variable :-)
20:28:34  <planetmaker> ttdp :-P - variable that is
20:29:04  <planetmaker> then it can be switched on / off by that setting...
20:33:15  <andythenorth> so how would that work?
20:36:14  <planetmaker> action2?
20:36:35  <planetmaker> similar to like now, I think
20:39:36  <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 796: Change: Modify how translations are handled to redu... <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/796>
20:39:41  <frosch123> how much is the civil fine if you report a desync while using such a variable?
20:40:14  <planetmaker> frosch123: 3 flies on a chopstick served to the alpha frog in the pont maybe? ;-)
20:40:39  <frosch123> :p
20:40:43  <planetmaker> point taken though :-)
20:41:02  <frosch123> use a grf parameter for that :)
20:41:11  <planetmaker> it's being done.
20:41:19  <planetmaker> Mine obviously was just a bad idea :-)
20:49:34  <Rubidium> frosch123: why about fixing all following desyncs as punishment?
20:50:08  <frosch123> deal!
20:54:44  <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 798: Fix: Wrong text define. <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/798> || FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 797: Cleanup: Remove deprecated strings. <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/797>
20:56:11  <planetmaker> hm... not sure whether that's a deal ;-)
20:57:01  <frosch123> night
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20:57:14  <planetmaker> night ...
21:00:21  <andythenorth> good night
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21:09:46  <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 800: Merge <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/800> || FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 799: Feature: additional layout for Cement Plant <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/799>
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